82% of Brits think religion does more harm than good

[Alcon]

He's trying to train himself to be able to bring up a Bible quote for any situation.  The trouble is, he isn't very good at it.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

While I think jmfcst has a tendency to view everything thru the prism of the Bible, even where religion is at best tangential to the argument, it's hardly unreasonable for him to quote the Bible in a thread about people's views of religion.  It would be nice if he could broaden his perspective to realize that the poll was slanted to be negative against all religion and not just Christianity, but he's never shown a tendency to be that ecumenical in the past.

this is not rocket science:

Point 1) If the people in this poll thought religion led to salvation, then they would NOT believe religion does more harm than good.

Conclusion)  The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

They also seem to be rejecting Islam, Zoroastrianism, Buddhism, Judaism, Wicca, Hinduism, Scientology, and even Universal Unitarianism. (If one considers UU to be a religion.)  Indeed I would find it likely that more people in that poll were opposed to Islam than they were to Christianity.  I wonder how you would react to a Muslim responding in this thread with ayat from the Qur'an.

Not everyone shares your view that Christianity is the true religion and that everything else is heathen superstition and/or devil worship.  As you should have noticed, your stridency may be effective in preaching to the already converted, but it is not at all conducive to inclining others to your point of view.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

Then why did about two-thirds of the people question in the poll consider themselves to be Christians?

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

http://www.eauk.org/resources/info/statistics/2005englishchurchcensus.cfm

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

Then why did about two-thirds of the people question in the poll consider themselves to be Christians?

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

Not everyone shares your view that Christianity is the true religion and that everything else is heathen superstition and/or devil worship.

Granted, but the only opinion that matters is God's.

---

As you should have noticed, your stridency may be effective in preaching to the already converted, but it is not at all conducive to inclining others to your point of view.

I have yet to read any passage in the bible where "stridency" wasn't employed.

2Cor 4:1-3  Therefore, since through God's mercy we have this ministry, we do not lose heart. 2Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God. 3And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.

[Joe Republic]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

[afleitch]

The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

Then why did about two-thirds of the people question in the poll consider themselves to be Christians?

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

http://www.eauk.org/resources/info/statistics/2005englishchurchcensus.cfm

So you're not a Chrstian if you don't attend church once a week? What about my housebound great aunt who prays at home every day but can't get to church. Is she not a Christian now?

[© tweed]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

I have

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

I have

That wasn't jesus.

[Joe Republic]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

I have

You're not supposed to count yourself.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

Unless you believe that someone must attend Church every Sunday to be allowed to call themselves Christian (a detestable idea IMO), what has that got to do with the fact that a very high % of the population here call themselves Christians?Regular Church attendence is just not a major part of religious culture in the U.K anymore; and by American standards it never was.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

I have

You're not supposed to count yourself.

That wasn't jesus he met though.

[KEmperor]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

I have

You're not supposed to count yourself.

That wasn't jesus he met though.

I met a Jesus, but he picked fruit out at this farm.  Seemed like a nice guy, didn't really speak a lot of English though.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I met a Jesus, but he picked fruit out at this farm.  Seemed like a nice guy, didn't really speak a lot of English though.

Can't have been the Jesus as the Jesus speaks English.  Just look in His Authorized Version, and not one of these latter day fake bibles to get the real text though.

[KEmperor]

I met a Jesus, but he picked fruit out at this farm.  Seemed like a nice guy, didn't really speak a lot of English though.

Can't have been the Jesus as the Jesus speaks English.  Just look in His Authorized Version, and not one of these latter day fake bibles to get the real text though.

You think he was a knockoff?  Damn it, you just can't trust people these days.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

Then why did about two-thirds of the people question in the poll consider themselves to be Christians?

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

http://www.eauk.org/resources/info/statistics/2005englishchurchcensus.cfm

So you're not a Chrstian if you don't attend church once a week? What about my housebound great aunt who prays at home every day but can't get to church. Is she not a Christian now?

So, only 6.3% of Britons are physically able to attend church?

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

Unless you believe that someone must attend Church every Sunday to be allowed to call themselves Christian (a detestable idea IMO), what has that got to do with the fact that a very high % of the population here call themselves Christians?

First, the survey says "regularly", defined as "usually attend church on Sunday", not "every Sunday".

And, is it really necessary for me to point out that God created a certain institution called the “church” and that within this said institution he created a structure to regularly “meet together” in order to nourish, train, and support Christians?

Heb 10:25 Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

I don't know how things work in your place of employment, but the members of the management are NOT the only ones expected to show up regularly.  No institution can accomplish anything if only the leadership is doing all the work.  In fact, what is a leader without followers?  And why do you think God demands less of you than your employer?!  If you regularly show up for work, why can't you regularly show up to church?

---

Regular Church attendence is just not a major part of religious culture in the U.K anymore; and by American standards it never was.

American standards?  [GAG!...BARF!...]

Who on earth cares what the “American standard” is or isn’t?

Does not the New Testament teach…
1) That God created the institution of the church?
2) That God appointed in the hierarchy of the church, according to 1Cor 12:28, first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues?
3) That the Apostles did indeed established churches?
4) That the church consisted of believers who “met together” regularly?

Eph 4:10 He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe. 11 It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, 12 to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13 until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.

---

In the Parable of the Talents, who are “the bankers” Jesus referred to in the following passage?

Mat 25:24"Then the man who had received the one talent came. 'Master,' he said, 'I knew that you are a hard man, harvesting where you have not sown and gathering where you have not scattered seed. 25So I was afraid and went out and hid your talent in the ground. See, here is what belongs to you.'

 26"His master replied, 'You wicked, lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? 27Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest.

Who are “the bankers” if not the leadership of the church?

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

Rev 3:20 "Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me."

[KEmperor]

Any "Christian" that thinks religion does more harm than good, has obviously never met Jesus Christ.

I don't think anybody alive on this planet has actually met Jesus Christ.

Rev 3:20 "Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me."

Comedy goldmine.

[Bono]

2) That God appointed in the hierarchy of the church, according to 1Cor 12:28, first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues?

Are you a charismatic, j-man?

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

I met a Jesus, but he picked fruit out at this farm.  Seemed like a nice guy, didn't really speak a lot of English though.

Can't have been the Jesus as the Jesus speaks English.  Just look in His Authorized Version, and not one of these latter day fake bibles to get the real text though.

So, you mock Jesus Christ based on the illogical assumptions of a few of his followers?

Do you do the same in your workplace?  Do you openly ridicule the owner and quit the company based on the mistakes of a few of its employees?  Do you refuse to become a member of any workplace unless it is proven than every single employee is operating under the correct assumptions?

I bet you don't! It bet in your hypocrisy, you allow human imperfection in every aspect of live, except in the church.

The thing about hypocrisy, Sen. Ernest, it leads to logical inconsistencies - just like the illogical King James followers you are mocking!

[afleitch]

The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

Then why did about two-thirds of the people question in the poll consider themselves to be Christians?

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

http://www.eauk.org/resources/info/statistics/2005englishchurchcensus.cfm

So you're not a Chrstian if you don't attend church once a week? What about my housebound great aunt who prays at home every day but can't get to church. Is she not a Christian now?

So, only 6.3% of Britons are physically able to attend church?

Answer me- is my great aunt not a Christian because she is only able to pray at home?

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

2) That God appointed in the hierarchy of the church, according to 1Cor 12:28, first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues?

Are you a charismatic, j-man?

Charismatic?  As in what way?

I should have placed that passage in quotes, for it was directly taken from scripture:

1Cor 12:28 "And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues."

But, the answer to your query lies in the series of rhetorical questions in the immediately following passage:

1Cor 12:29-30 “Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues?”

[KEmperor]

The majority in this poll reject Christianity and view Christianity as doing more harm than good

Then why did about two-thirds of the people question in the poll consider themselves to be Christians?

"Of the 50309000 people living in England, 3166200 usually attend church on a Sunday; regular churchgoers therefore amount to 6.3% of the total population..."

http://www.eauk.org/resources/info/statistics/2005englishchurchcensus.cfm

So you're not a Chrstian if you don't attend church once a week? What about my housebound great aunt who prays at home every day but can't get to church. Is she not a Christian now?

So, only 6.3% of Britons are physically able to attend church?

Answer me- is my great aunt not a Christian because she is only able to pray at home?

Sorry man, sounds like she's going to hell.  Jesus(jmfcst) has spoken.

[Bono]

2) That God appointed in the hierarchy of the church, according to 1Cor 12:28, first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues?

Are you a charismatic, j-man?

Charismatic?  As in what way?

I should have placed that passage in quotes, for it was directly taken from scripture:

1Cor 12:28 "And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues."

But, the answer to your query lies in the series of rhetorical questions in the immediately following passage:

1Cor 12:29-30 “Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues?”

Actually, the answer to my query lies in another passage, which alos follows that one, but not so immediately, and in what you make of it:
1 Corinthians 13:8 8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away.

I am not seeking a debate here, just trying to understand your position.

EDIT: Not just that, but it seems to me that you're advocating teh continuance of the apostolic office in the modern church. Am I getting your point right?