Millennials and Howard Dean Triggered: SCOTUS = no hate speech exception to 1st. (user search)
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  Millennials and Howard Dean Triggered: SCOTUS = no hate speech exception to 1st. (search mode)
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Author Topic: Millennials and Howard Dean Triggered: SCOTUS = no hate speech exception to 1st.  (Read 1839 times)
Mr. Reactionary
blackraisin
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Posts: 17,840
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.45, S: -3.35

« on: June 19, 2017, 02:01:42 PM »

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Mr. Reactionary
blackraisin
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,840
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.45, S: -3.35

« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2017, 03:22:27 PM »


Generally the argument is that the exceptions are not considered purely "speech" and are therefore not protected. Incitement, fighting words, libel, fraudulent inducement, conspiracy, etc. do involve communication, however they also contain more: a guilty mens rea. This guilty mental state is a necessary component of the exclusions, as it effectively creates a different act separate from speech. For example, the first amendment protects lies but not lies made with the intent to defraud someone into giving you money. Similarly, the first amendment protects offensive speech but not individually directed offensive speech made with the intent to trigger an immediate physical fight.

To some extent, its just semantics, but since the exceptions are few enough and rooted in historical common law,  and there is no judicial power to recognize new exceptions, the definition of speech effectively excludes the combined act of speech + guilty mental state. Its why the first stolen valor act (criminalizing lying about military service) was struck down by scotus, but the revised stolen valor act  (criminalizing lying about military service with the intent to benefit financially through this lie) is probably ok.
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Mr. Reactionary
blackraisin
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,840
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.45, S: -3.35

« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2017, 05:30:00 PM »


So the ACLU supports the active protection of the right to glorify genocide to those victimized to it in their own neighborhoods think.
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Mr. Reactionary
blackraisin
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,840
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.45, S: -3.35

« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2017, 02:08:12 PM »

Active harassment and dehumanization being declared a fundamental right is not a good thing.


THe ACLU, yes. They actually had a Jewish leader defend neo-Nazi's rights to march through a Jewish neighborhood.

SJWs, of course not.

So the ACLU supports the active protection of the right to glorify genocide to those victimized to it in their own neighborhoods.

So you oppose the right of protest, then?

I oppose the idea that neo-nazis have a right to shove their genocide advocatism down the throats of a Jewish community.

And are you always confident that the laws allowing the suppression of unpopular opinions will be set by those supporting the side of good?

Saying a group of people is bad based on ethnicity, religion, etc can pretty easily be defined separately from other forms of speech.

Until the types of groups which get this special protection become so numerous that no one will be able to think anymore.
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