WinDis Polls - 1: Abortion

[Scam of God]

I am a libertarian. I am thus de facto pro-choice, and passionately so.

[Scam of God]

I am a libertarian. I am thus de facto pro-choice, and passionately so.

Contradiction.

The contradiction is yours. You deny the property rights of the mother.

[Scam of God]

I am a libertarian. I am thus de facto pro-choice, and passionately so.

Contradiction.

The contradiction is yours. You deny the property rights of the mother.

Sorry, one human being can never own another. Hence why I oppose slavery as well as abortion.

A fetus cannot own anything, and hence is not a human being.

[Scam of God]

Pro-life is still pro-choice. Creating a child is a choice in all non-rape instances so you can make that choice beforehand.

     In other words our euphemisms for policy positions are imperfect.

I don't consider pro-abortionists anything more than anti-life, really. Pro-choice is a euphemism but pro-life is a more proper term for what we do consider pro-life.

     Good for you. Just don't expect to convince anyone of the correctness of your position by telling them that the alternative is "anti-life" & that your position is really "pro-choice" as well.

But segwaystyle is 100% correct. The pro-life position is also the 'pro-choice' position.

Support for abortion-on-demand is pro-death and anti-life.

Just like support for the Catholic Church is support for paedophilia.

[Scam of God]

PiT must think Hitler was justified too, because we can't force our anti-murder theocratic views on the Nazis.

Uh oh, Godwin's law!

Nice to see you bring something constructive. Why not legalize all murders then?

Because murder involves killing a being with feelings. Foetuses cannot feel pain, at least not in the early stages of pregnancy.

That is a rather arbitrary definition. In fact a human being has the right to life from the moment of conception, regardless of whether he or she can feel pain.

Then why do we date our lives from date of birth rather than conception?

Custom. We measure specifically from our birthday, not from the day we became human life endowed with natural rights.

Once more, with feeling: there are no natural rights. There are only natural liberties. "Rights" is another word for "soul" or "identity", and neither of these concepts can be quantified, and are based entirely on superstitious, metaphysical premises that deny the reality of the physical world in favor of some Platonic Ideal.

[Scam of God]

PiT must think Hitler was justified too, because we can't force our anti-murder theocratic views on the Nazis.

Uh oh, Godwin's law!

Nice to see you bring something constructive. Why not legalize all murders then?

Because murder involves killing a being with feelings. Foetuses cannot feel pain, at least not in the early stages of pregnancy.

That is a rather arbitrary definition. In fact a human being has the right to life from the moment of conception, regardless of whether he or she can feel pain.

Then why do we date our lives from date of birth rather than conception?

Custom. We measure specifically from our birthday, not from the day we became human life endowed with natural rights.

Once more, with feeling: there are no natural rights. There are only natural liberties. "Rights" is another word for "soul" or "identity", and neither of these concepts can be quantified, and are based entirely on superstitious, metaphysical premises that deny the reality of the physical world in favor of some Platonic Ideal.

Incorrect. There are natural rights, and all human beings are endowed with them by Our Creator.

As I've already said, the concept of "natural rights" is based entirely on metaphysical superstition that values the immaterial realm beyond the sensitive and sensible world of the flesh.

[Scam of God]

Yes, because most people commit murders because they think that their victims aren't human. Couldn't be factors like greed or anger.

     Nevermind that you ignored my point that the concept of a fetus being entitled to the rights of an adult human just doesn't make sense from a secular perspective, that being why the pro-life position is theocratic.

Would you stop with this inane and senseless "theocratic" argument? It's only making you look foolish.

Incorrect. There are natural rights, and all human beings are endowed with them by Our Creator.

You are projecting your religious views into the void, and, consequently, onto us. This is quite the definition of coercion.

[Scam of God]

Yes, because most people commit murders because they think that their victims aren't human. Couldn't be factors like greed or anger.

     Nevermind that you ignored my point that the concept of a fetus being entitled to the rights of an adult human just doesn't make sense from a secular perspective, that being why the pro-life position is theocratic.

Would you stop with this inane and senseless "theocratic" argument? It's only making you look foolish.

Incorrect. There are natural rights, and all human beings are endowed with them by Our Creator.

You are projecting your religious views into the void, and, consequently, onto us. This is quite the definition of coercion.

All laws against murder are enforced by coercion. Sorry.

And I do indeed question whether most of the laws against murder are themselves legitimate. I certainly don't believe, as you evidently do, that one's humanity is readily defined and static throughout the entirety of one's bodily existence.

[Scam of God]

     Besides the point. Many people deny that the fetus should be entitled to the rights of an adult human. From the perspective of an atheist libertarian, there isn't really any sensible reason why they would be.

Why not?  I've never understood why an atheist automatically has to be pro-choice.

And I've never understood why a libertarian automatically has to be conservative. That's just the way the world works, I suppose.

[Scam of God]

     Besides the point. Many people deny that the fetus should be entitled to the rights of an adult human. From the perspective of an atheist libertarian, there isn't really any sensible reason why they would be.

Why not?  I've never understood why an atheist automatically has to be pro-choice.

And I've never understood why a libertarian automatically has to be conservative. That's just the way the world works, I suppose.

Uh, what? Who said a libertarian "automatically has to be conservative"?

You seem to be trying your damndest to preserve fusionism.