Talk Elections

I dont know what the rules are about starting games here, but I'll give this a shot.

There is a game I've been thinking about creating off and on for a while. The "engine" that runs the game is what's important - The setting is not. That being said, I think I found a great setting for the game, the United States in the 1700s.

Here is the map:
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click to zoom in.

Each player would take over one State. Each state has "Cities", "Towns", and "Settlements". Areas outside the cities are faming areas. You play the rule of the Governor of a certain state, under a unrealistic articles of confederation. This limits what you can and cannot do. You have two major neighbouring countries, Britain (Canada), and Spain (Louisiana and Florida)

First and foremost, is that nearly every state has a claim on land that it does not fully control. Only Rhode Island, Delaware, and New Jersey do not, the other 10 do. In most instances, this control is disputed, in some cases by more than one other state. Thats where the fun part (IE war) comes in.

The "Federal Government" is a weak useless tool, but its power is needed for certain things, and can be used in certain ways. Each "Turn" takes a season (4 months). Every 4 years, there is a federal "Election" in which each state gets to cast one ballot for who should be President. Each state must vote for someone, it cannot toss out its vote, or vote for someone invalid. The only person invalid to become President is the current President. The President must be a Governor. This means that the 13 players will have to vote for one another, and to prevent a 13-way tie, the sitting President must vote for someone else.

As President you get a whole bunch of neat powers. For one thing, you get control over the Federal Budget... which actually is not very impressive. The good thing is the only real "Federal" expense you have is maintenance of a Federal Military. Again, not a very impressive thing. In a one-on-one conflict, the Federal Military would likely lose a war against Virgina. However, if you are North Carolina, having the Federal Military on your side will certainly help if Virgina decides to declare war on you. The Federal Army has been specifically balanced to lose in a one-on-one battle with any state, except perhaps the small states (Delaware, Rhode Island, likely even Georgia, New Hampshire, possibly even New Jersey) What is more impressive is the Federal Navy.

Either way. Congress is made up of the following members. 1 Senator per state. 1 Representative per Town and 2 per City. All members of the House and Senate vote how you (the Governor) tell them to. Approval from Congress is needed in order to do certain things; one of which is to go to war with another nation (Spain, the UK). Congress also acts as a middle-man on trade issues.

This game will have a trade engine. Certain things are produced in certain places, and used in others. For example, one Town or City might be near a forest and hence produce large amounts of Wood. If you want to build a Navy, you are going to need that Wood. You can buy it from the other State for a set price (you negotiate it as you wish) but if no state will sell you wood, you can always purchase it from the national middle-man, Congress, who in turn buys it from another country, taxes the heck out of it, and then sells it back to you at a very inflated price. This means you can never "run out" of anything, you can only "run out of affordable" things.

As Game Master, I'd play the foreign nations, as well as administer the game.


Anyways, I dont even know if this sort of thing is allowed, but if so, I think it could be fun.

Each state will have a Legislature and a Governor. Gubernatorial Elections take place every 4 years. They are scheduled to be in between presidential elections. The game begins in Winter of 1784. The first Presidential elections are between Fall and Winter of 1786, with the first State elections between Fall and Winter of 1788.


Each state has a Senate of 25 people and a House of 100.

In the House are a number of political parties. We will get back to these shortly. In the Senate there are no parties. Rather, there are pro administration and anti administration senators. Senate Elections are held every year, between Fall and Winter. They are held just prior to the Gubernatorial elections, when the latter are held. Governors are not elected directly, rather, are elected by the Senate. Hence, you need Senate support in order to get re-elected.

Just because the Senate has 13 anti-administration members at Election Time does not mean you automatically lose. Rather, those members can split their votes and you can win with less than a Majority. This, in short, will happen any time there are no players waiting to play. If there, however, are players willing and ready to play and you are unpopular, they may well be elected to your job. Senators will reflect how much support you have across the State. If you keep taxes low, spend on social programs, grow the economy, and otherwise follow your citizens demands, you can count on Senate support. Otherwise, your out.

The House has political parties. Not Democrats and Republicans, but parties that demand certain actions. There is, for example, a pro-war party. They will want you to attack someone. There is also a pro-peace party, that wants you not to attack anyone. A low taxes party, a high spending party, etc etc. The Legislature can, and will block your actions, or, force you to take actions if your policies get too far from what they want. They can modify your budgets, refuse declarations of war, or best of all, declare war without your approval. The legislature will not act out against you, though, unless they have a majority in both chambers. IE a majority anti-administration senators, along with a majority of House members who want a particular course of action. The single best way to keep your population happy is to respond to their house elections. If they elect a pro-war party, go to war. If they elect a pro-peace party, end the war.

The above is to stop the crazy results that these games sometimes cause. Often a group of warlike players can take over the entire 'world' within a few years, or, a group of pro-peace players can stop any wars from happening at all. No longer can such unbalanced things occur. You will still have great liberty to do whatever you want, but if you go too far off the deep end of begin pro-war or anti-war, your Legislature will let you know in no uncertain terms.

One thing you'll need to go to war is a casus belli, or a reason to go to war. Any areas which you claim are good places to start wars. You can build up a claim to some place, or go to War with a neighbor that's just plain ticking you off; but stabbing your much smaller best friend in the back is going to have negative repercussions. For one thing, your people wont like it and might well vote in pro-peace parties in revenge. They may also vote in a Senate opposed to you. Citizens of other nations wont like it either, and may direct their legislators to pressure their governor to reject trade deals with you.

In short - if you are a "bad boy" the citizens of this world will know it, and will punish you for it.

All of this is to keep the game within certain realistic limits. You wont be able to take advantage of any perceived or found mathematical loophole in the budget for example.

Why is all this done? Well I've played these games before, and the same things tend to happen to often.

1
The superpowers in the game decide this will be a war game. They invade every last country they can think of, usually taking them out one at a time. Other superpowers accept this is how the game will be played and are busy taking their own nations to be ready for the final battle. By the end of it the game only has 2 or 3 players left who then duke it out, usually with nuclear weapons, and destroy the planet.

2
The superpowers in the game decide this will be a peace game. Any country attacking any other country for any reason are met with an alliance of superpower forces which seal you back in your borders. The superpowers then use their super economies to gain an exponential edge on everyone, until one of them is so rich, the game ends due to unbalance.

3
One nation is able to figure out the math behind the budget. He borrows the limit the game master will let him and invests the whole thing into some kind of "economic growth" category, then does the same the next year and the next. Shortly, his population is 5,000 times richer than the population in any other country, and he is able to 'buy' his way to victory.


Playing one of the above is not very fun. The introduction of Legislatures with the balls to push you around is designed to stop that. You can play a war or a peace game, but you will be presented with challenges to your strategy that will force you to adapt.

This sounds awesome.  Hopefully it works out well.  I'd like to try, preferably as New York or New Jersey (if that's how it's going to work).

It is, and I'll mark you down for those states.

I'd like Massachusetts.

EDIT: Do we have any control over trade with foreign (non-State) entities, or must it all be mediated by the Federal government?

You can only freely trade with another state. I *may* allow you to trade with another country, but there will be tariffs regardless (IE its significantly cheaper to buy from another state)

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While the map above does list all "active" claims, there are many "inactive" claims to give you guys plenty of reasons to go to war. They are below.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a9/Marycolony.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8e/Pa_ct_md_va_claims2.gif
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ctcolony.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/Gacolony.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Masscolony.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Nycolony.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Carolinacolony.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Wpdms_virginia_company_plymouth_council.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/35/Penncolony.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/24/Virginiacolony.png

Also note this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connecticut_Western_Reserve

...

Population (estimations)

NH - 87.8k
Mass - 268.6k
RI - 52.9k
CT - 206.7k
NY - 210.5K
NJ - 139.6K
Pen - 327.3K
Del - 54.4K
Mar - 245.5K
Vir - 538.0K
NC - 270.1K
SC - 180.0K
Ga - 56.1K


Kentucky - 45.0K (Owned by Virginia)
Tennessee - 10.0K (owned by NC)
Vermont - 47.6K (disputed, NH, NY)
Maine - 49.1K (owned by Mass)

A great idea:) I'd be happy to take New Hampshire or Rhode Island

Noted.

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For all intents and purposes, what you have is the following:

Maine is owned by Mass. Part of it is claimed by the UK. In general, the rest of it is safe in Mass’ hands. New Hampshire, however, could get away with staking a claim here, but none exists at this point in time.

New Hampshire claims Vermont. We will come back to this. Other than the note above regarding Maine, this is the only claim of NH.

Mass has an active and an inactive claim. The active claim is for a strip of land stretching, hypothetically, to the pacific. The active claim only applies to a point west of a line that exists in modern New York State. Mass has an inactive claim to all of the territory noted, including strips of New Hampshire, and all of Conn and RI. There is a similar claim to most of New York State. A very weak and inactive claim can be laid to most of the continent. Mass is considered one of the stronger powers of the game, and I will give preference to posters with many posts and/or a good strong history in any other atlas games. Mass’ inactive claim also extends to part of Southern Ontario, in the UK.

Rhode Island is one of the smallest states. It has no claims whatsoever. In addition, Claims would be difficult to steak, but could be done especially if in an alliance with another state. For example, New York claims half of Conn, RI could get away with occupying the other half if they worked together.

Conn has the single strongest claim in the entire game, that is to the Western Reserve. The Reserve is the most populated area in the ‘unsettled areas’ and has hundreds of settlers loyal to Conn. The remainder of the claim follows a boundary line similar in respects to that of Mass. Conn also has claims to part of southern New York state including Long Island. Conn claims all of RI.

New York has one of the largest active claims in the game. New York, however, does not have much of an inactive claim beyond this. The state’s inactive claim overlaps with Conn’s claim within Penn, and also contains most of Southern Ontario in the UK.

New Jersey has some limited inactive claims to parts of southern New York state.

Penn itself has very little in the way of claims, but finds itself Claimed by a large number of states. Penn’s most powerful but recently inactive claim is to Delaware. Maryland is also claimed. A claim could even be laid to New Jersey, or extended West, but neither claim exists at this point.

Delaware has no claims whatsoever.

Maryland has no active claims. Inactive claims, however, exist for parts of Penn, and all of Delaware.

Virginia is the game’s main power. It starts holding the Presidency. Its claims extend to nearly the entire unsettled region, and is the only state to have an exclusive claim to any of the region. A very hold historical claim exists that would allow Virginia to claim nearly the entire continent.

North Carolina has a claim to the lands extending west. Part of this overlaps with New York’s claims. North Carolina also has an inactive claim to all of South Carolina.

South Carolina has a claim to the lands extending west. Part of this overlaps with New York’s claims. South Carolina also has an inactive claim to all of North Carolina. South Carolina could potentially stake a claim to Georgia.

Georgia has a claim to all the lands west of it. Part of this is conflicted with an active claim from Spain on behalf of Florida. There is also an inactive Spanish claim on part of the state.


Vermont is disputed by its two claimants. New Hampshire and New York. I am very very reluctant to allow any kind of Independent Vermont. Having new states spring up would make the game difficult since all the claimed areas would just be taken over by new players. If I do decide to allow this, it will only be Vermont, and nothing else. Vermont will also start unrecognized, and you will have to fight for your freedom. I will not be allowing it unless I get enough applications

From a more accurate 1789 census

Whole State Populations      
765.5   Virginia   
475.3   Massachusetts   
434.4   Pennsylvania   
389.8   North Carolina   
340.1   New York   
319.7   Maryland   
249.1   South Carolina   
237.9   Connecticut   
227.3   New Hampshire   
184.1   New Jersey   
82.5   Georgia   
68.8   Rhode Island   
59.1   Delaware   
      
      
      
Populations (included above) of disputed areas      
73.7   West Virginia   Part of Virginia
55.9   Kentucky   Part of Virginia
96.5   Maine   Part of Mass
85.4   Vermont   Part of NH, claimed by NY
36.0   Tennessee   Part of NC

Thank you :) I will take little Delaware. I have a habit in the whole Paradox series of computer games to take small states and keep them secure and thriving.

Largest Cities

49,400   New York   NY
28,500   Philadelphia   PA
18,300   Boston   MA
13,500   Baltimore   MD
6,400   Providence   RI
4,500   New Haven   CT
3,800   Richmond   VA
3,500   Albany   NY
3,000   Norfolk   VA
2,700   Alexandria   VA
2,700   Hartford   CT
2,500   Savannah   GA
2,100   Worcester   MA
1,600   Springfield   MA
1,000   Washington   MD
1,000   Lexington-Fayette   VA


Note that the population of the in-game cities will include the surrounding rural areas, and hence, will be way higher than above. The above, however, will be used as a guideline as to which cities are largest.


edit - noted afleitch. Also, keep an eye out of the big blue blob, it just might come visit the americas... who knows!

Which areas remain open?

They all do. States will not be given out on a first-come-first-serve basis, although being first to ask for one will increase your chances of getting it.

The best option is to provide a list of the top 3 options you want.


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Resources (for Trade)

FUELS
Coal
Wood

AGRI NON FOODS
Cotton
Furs
Tobacco

METALS
Gold
Silver
Iron Ore
Copper

FOODSTUFFS
Grain
Corn
Fish
Rice


GDP per capita: $100 (about)
TOTAL GDP: $350,000,000 (about)

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I'd like New York.

I'd do Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Mass, CT, or VA...Preference to PA.

Add Georgia to the front of my list, actually.

All the above noted.

More maps to hopefully make the claims make more sense

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My choices are NY, MA, CT, MD and VA. Preferences to NY and CT.

I'll take Virginia.

Current Claimants


Einzige - MA
Afleitch - DE, NH, RI
Wyatt - NY
Bull - PA, NJ, MA, CT, VA
Fezzy - GA, NY, NJ
Hash - NY, CT, MA, MD, VA
Deeds - VA

Minor suggestion:

At this point Pittsburgh was already one of the most important towns in the United States (period).  Pittsburgh's strategic location, as it basically provided access the entire Mississippi River system from the East, and thus was the main point of focus for westward expansion and control of the economics of the entire area west of the Appalachians (or the Alleghenies as they were more commonly know a this time).  Any game representing this time period should represent that.

Many more cities, towns, and settlements will be added to the map. They will be done so for two reasons
Historical Accuracy - At this time cities like Hamilton Ontario were larger than Toronto (which was called York), and London Ontario was the largest city in the province. Halifax, meanwhile, was a sprawling metropolis containing over ten thousand people.
Gameplay - Some modern cities did not exist at this time, like Cleveland, but cities like this will be added, as Settlements, to aid and assist in gameplay

May I have Georgia?

I'll add you to the list of claimants

Einzige - MA
Afleitch - DE, NH, RI
Wyatt - NY
Bull - PA, NJ, MA, CT, VA
Fezzy - GA, NY, NJ
Hash - NY, CT, MA, MD, VA
Deeds - VA
NiK - GA

Also, depending on when you are starting, Virginia claimed a significant section of Southwestern PA during this period.

I'd like South Carolina and/or North Carolina.

Preference on North Carolina.

Included in it's maximal claims.
Don't worry, there is plenty of reason for war :D

Einzige - MA
Afleitch - DE, NH, RI
Wyatt - NY
Bull - PA, NJ, MA, CT, VA
Fezzy - GA, NY, NJ
Hash - NY, CT, MA, MD, VA
Deeds - VA
NiK - GA
Sewer- NC, SC

Lovely.

Has the game officially began? If so, what precise structure do you want us to use for turn-taking, etc.? In other words, what are the mechanical rules?

Havent set everything down just yet. I would like to request everyone ask for at least two states though. I will post more on the rules and whatnot tonight.

It has occurred to me that many state flags suck. Therefore, I will make up some flags, er I mean, it is only fair to assume that since I've changed history by not keeping the US, that the flags should change (yea that'll work) part of your duty as governor will be to design a new flag if you wish to. The flags are as seen below. Note, that I have used real flags where the suckitude level is low, and I've used historicalish flags where I could (IE South Carolina. I just made the moon a ton bigger, removed the word liberty from it, and centred it. I did not, however, changed the colours or orientation of the flag moon)

*note, the Virginia flag is based on a real one from the colonial era. The NY Eagle comes from its coat of arms. The PA Horses (the idea for) come from their flag. The NJ horsehead idea comes from its flag, etc.

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Please note the following.


After trying to tinker with budgets, I've given up. Budgets therefore will be anachronistic. Your budget will look like a modern day 2009 budget.

As I said in the begining, the game engine was worked out long ago, and setting is not important. That turns out to only be partially true. While I can, and did, change resources easily, the budgets cannot be changed so easily. The reality is that back during this era, there was just not that much to spend on. I will continue to try to find ways around this, and to make the budget real-ish, but the simple fact is that I cannot have an entire budget that relies on tariffs. Revenues will therefore come from Income Taxes, Sales Taxes, and Property Taxes, even though not all of those existed in 1780.

More to come.

Another minor note, the South Carolina claim, extending west, was dropped pretty early on because it was found to be non-existent.  The pre-existing conditions that had been specified to make that claim possible simply had no basis in reality (has to do with the location of the head waters of the river, but I don't remember the exact details).

As I said, I'm giving everyone ample reason for war :D

If I get Delaware I may change her flag :p But the rest are great ;D

I'm going to finish the patchwork here (I've tried to get a game based on this engine working before, many times before, so I have various files from the various attempts, going back to 2003, that I need to find and tie in to one another) that'll take me until Friday perhaps. Once I get that we can start rolling, but we still need more players. Invite your friends!

Example Budget. Per-capita spending, based on a GDP PC of $100


Note the following. At this time, nearly all government revenues were tariffs. This is a boring game with only one thing to adjust, hence, as I said earlier, your budgets will include income and sales taxes, etc. Also note, that modern day developing nations draw most of their revenues from public corporations. Pakistan in particular gets in huge sums of money from its electricity generation and distribution company. The down side is artificially high prices for power. I've decided to add both into the budgets, alongside the modern taxes, to make things an even better balance of realism and fun. I've also thrown in modern expenses to again, give you more things to tinker with.




$15    Tariffs
$10    Public Corp Revenue
$10    Income Taxes
$8    Sales taxes
$7    Corporation Taxes
   
$50    Revenue
   
   
$10    Defense
$8    Social Services
$8    Healthcare
$7    Education
$6    Government Operations
$2    Public Works
   
$9    Debt Servicing Costs
   
$50    Expenditure

Tariffs - these are charges on goods that do not appear in your list of things to trade. This means you can charge additional tariffs on these goods if you wish to raise more revenue.

Public Corp Revenue - Things like the post office fall in here. You overcharge your citizens for these services, and in exchange, you get more revenue for the government.

Note, the above two comprise half your entire budget, cutting them deeply may prove unwise!

Income taxes - your citizens are charge a single flat tax on their income with no exemptions. You may adjust the rate.

Sales taxes - a single flat rate charged on all sales. You may adjust the rate

Corporation taxes - like income/sales taxes, this is a single adjustable rate.



Defense - this is the most unique category in your entire budget. Defense has it's own budget, and this is the money that is drawn from your yearly national budget to go into the special defense budget. The defense department budget will be put out later, but in short, it will be the thing that allows you to go to war.

Social Services - all the various nice things the government spends on the people to keep them happy

Healthcare - thats right, government healthcare! Unlike real life (and for gameplay reasons) your citizens will not provide their own healthcare, cut this too far and they start dying off.

Education - raising or lowering this will have a direct impact on how smart your citizens are. For gameplay reasons the changes are accelerated.

Government Operations - This is what you pay the bureaucrats to keep the government running. It includes things like the justice department, and tax collectors. Overspending will tie up your government in red tape while underspending will cause you to miss out on opportunities for revenue.

Public Works - this is building roads. If your planning to "settle the west" you are going to need roads!

Debt Servicing Costs - War is not free, and the war for freedom has its literal costs. This is the debt you've built up over that time. Each new debt comes with a repayment schedule, and each state is on the path to being debt free. Until then, however, this will cost you.

I've adjusted the budget to give you more control (and more things to tinker with!)

$10    Tariffs
$10    Public Corp Revenue
$10    Income Taxes
$8    Sales taxes
$7    Corporation Taxes
$5    Property Taxes
$50    Revenue
   
   
$16    Defense
$7    Education
$6    Social Services
$4    Transfers (To your cities)
$3    Government Operations
$3    Police and Justice
$2    Public Works
$9    Debt Servicing Costs
   
$50    Expenditure


$10    Tariffs
These need to be adjusted with words, not numbers. Tell me what your planning to cut.

$10    Public Corp Revenue
I will draw up a list of public corporations and their profit margins, you can then order companies to cut prices, etc.

$10    Income Taxes
Flat rate of 10% with no exemptions.

$8    Sales taxes
Flat rate of 10% with no exemptions.

$7    Corporation Taxes
Flat rate of 10% with no exemptions. (charged on revenue, no profit)

$5    Property taxes
Flat rate of 100 mills, no exemptions.


If you want to add an exemption to Income or Sales taxes etc, you will have to "pay" for it though an expenditure. This allows me to keep the math simple.


Note, I've merged healthcare with social services. I also created a Transfers expense, this is the money you send to your cities. To keep everything simple, you are the only one who taxes, your cities do not tax, so if you do not give them any money, they wont have a cent to spend.


Your current debt load is, in this example, $9 per season (per turn) for 15 turns. This is $90 charged at compound interest at 6%.

I definitely want to play this. And I'll take any state.

Emperor Awesome, you are Awesome!

I've thought about it and I would really like Massachusetts (preferred) or Virginia. I am capable of the involvement these big states would demand of me- note my frenetic rate of activity in Atlasia as evidence.

I'm going to again ask here that NiK, Deeds, and Wyatt submit a second state they wish to play.

If your preference list runs dry, you may end up playing Rhode Island :P

Ah, I forgot to choose a second and a third State:

Very well - my order of preference is Massachusetts, Connecticut, New Hampshire.

Connecticut's my second choice.

Preferences:


1# NC.
2# SC.
3# GA.

Einzige - MA, CT, NH
Afleitch - DE, NH, RI
Wyatt - NY, CT
Bull - PA, NJ, MA, CT, VA
Fezzy - GA, NY, NJ
Hash - NY, CT, MA, MD, VA
Deeds - VA
NiK - GA
Sewer- NC, SC
Bacon King - MA, VA
Sewer - NC, SC, GA

But I'd really really like New York.

Not everyone will be able to get their first option :P

Two people have NY first. Both have CT second. Two people have MA first, one has CT second. These are states in high demand.

I will attempt to balance it to ensure that as many people as possible get their #1, and those who dont, get their #2.

MD, NC and SC need more claimants meanwhile!

2 more players and we reach 13.

I'll put North Carolina and South Carolina as my #3 and #4, respectively.

I'll put MD as my number three but like I said I'd really prefer VA or MA. I'd be very happy with either, though I do have a slight preference for Mass.

I'll play. First NH, then MA, then any other state.

Keep Georgia at the front of my list, but add Maryland as my second choice. Thank you, and good luck with the game!


EDIT: Actually, I'll take either one of those two, however you choose.

I'll play. I don't really mind what state I get.

Alrighty! I need to hit the hay before my work shift tonight, but the nations for each player have been pretty well decided

Ok, Cool! looking forward to starting!

Remember either GA or MD is fine for me!

question. how are combat/warfare mechanics going to work?

While I think this game would take too much of my time, and therefore I don't wish to actually participate, I am observing because this whole era is one which greatly interests me and this game looks brilliant! All the best with it! If there's anything I can do to assist you at any stage, let me know.

I noticed you had included Spain, Britain, France and the First Nations in there - and I also noticed that no one has yet selected them. How will those powers be played?

They will be played by the GM (me) Mostly for trade and/or rebellions.

I have a list of basic units drawn up... somewhere. I'll pull it out and post it.

Combat will be based on the types of units you have, so on and so forth. There is no simple mathematical formula for it, sadly.

I still have to tie all this together, as well, it appears I cannot count and we have 12 (not 13) players. I've decided to distribute the states anyway!

Everything should be in place for a start on monday morning.

I could use more "states I'd like to play" from the following players:
Einzge
Vepres
Deeds

I suspected that, but was checking.

If you wish Smid, I could take you on as sort of a co-game master. Time would not be required, but I could use you for ideas and the like, as well you could play nations (France, the Netherlands) with a different personality than I'd have

Sure, but make it Deputy-Game Master, rather than Co-Game Master. Let me know what you'd like me to do and I'm happy to assist. I'll have a closer read through some of your earlier posts to get a better feel for things.

Sure. I'll start an official "game thread" when we are ready to go. My fear is we will lose people between now and then, so I could always use extra players if anyone wants to sign up as a replacement (once we have our 13)

I've also decided to use a slightly different method to determine who plays which state (so feel free to re-submit your preference lists)

I will start by looking at any state that is #1 on only one list. At this time, that would be Deeds with Virginia, Afleitch with Delaware, and Bull with Pennsylvania. They then get those nations. Next, I would pick at random (die roll, or coin flip, with the first applicant being heads etc) the states claimed by multiple players, etc etc etc. However, in order to do this I need each player to submit at least three states to me (this applies only to those who have not yet) with the knowledge that order is important. If I run out of your preference list, you'll be put on the side while I distribute the other states, and then if there are any left over, you get that one :P

Also, I'm going to push back the start time quite a bit, to ensure that I have time to properly get everything in order (I seem to have lost half the files so need to rebuild them from memory) I'm also willing to allow certain states to be run in "auto mode" which will mean they will grow and the like, but will not make any radical decisions, and be run by the GMs. This is an interim measure between players. I will place limits on what "radical decisions" mean, but in short, they'll not start any wars, trade beyond demand, or change tax rates (unless the legislature forces them to)

To be totally safe, I will place the start date way off on October 12th so that I can get everything in place and finish everything. I will post more information between now and then. Thank you all for your understanding.

Political Parties:

Every Governor needs to pick a party. This party will, partly, be how your term in office is judged. If you are from a pro-war party and spend all your time developing your economy, you will not be as popular than if you were from the party that wants to develop the economy. You also get a number of "free seats" (see below) for your party of choice.

Expansionist Party (E)
Priority: Settlement, War
Does not care about taxes

Development Party (D)
Priority: Low Taxes, Investments (Industry, Agriculture)
Opposes budget deficits

Social Party (S)
Priority: Social investments like Hospitals, Schools.
Very Anti-War

Trade Party (T)
Priority: Dominance in Trade.
Somewhat anti-industry, believes in selling raw resources first. Very anti-embargo.

Popular Party (P)
Priority: Pragmatism. Will have different views in different situations.
Opposes extremes of any sort (taxes too high, too low, etc)

Governors Party (G)
This party allies itself to whichever party you pick, and remains so for your term in office.
If you are defeated at the polls, this party will become loyal to the new Governor (and his party)
 



Every state starts with the following senate:
17 - Pro Administration
8 - Anti Administration

Each state will start with a different House, listed below.



New Hampshire
E - 20
D - 20
S - 16
T - 20
P - 12
G - 12


Massachusetts
E - 22
D - 16
S - 14
T - 18
P - 18
G - 12


Rhode Island
E - 10
D - 24
S - 16
T - 18
P - 20
G - 12


Connecticut
E - 22
D - 22
S - 20
T - 12
P - 12
G - 12


New York
E - 16
D - 20
S - 12
T - 20
P - 20
G - 12


New Jersey
E - 22
D - 18
S - 22
T - 12
P - 14
G - 12


Pennsylvania
E - 20
D - 20
S - 12
T - 12
P - 24
G - 12


Delaware
E - 12
D - 22
S - 24
T - 12
P - 18
G - 12


Maryland
E - 22
D - 12
S - 12
T - 20
P - 22
G - 12


Virginia
E - 24
D - 14
S - 14
T - 18
P - 18
G - 12


North Carolina
E - 16
D - 20
S - 20
T - 20
P - 12
G - 12


South Carolina
E - 12
D - 20
S - 20
T - 24
P - 12
G - 12


Georgia
E - 16
D - 18
S - 18
T - 18
P - 18
G - 12

New Preferences:


1# PA.
2# VA.
3# NC.
4# SC.

When will you announce each player's state?

I'm to late for my native Massachusetts :(

1) North Carolina

2) Vermont Green Republic :)

3) South Carolina

4) New Hampshire

New Preferences:


1# PA.
2# Vermont Green Republic
3# VA.
4# NC.
5# SC.

I'll take anything, but:

1. NH
2. MA
3. CT

You are not too late, so I will add it as your #1.

Results are announced once we get 13 players

Can I have Vermont? If so, I'll add it as my #1.

Vermont isn't a state and probably/possibly won't ever be in this game, guys, it's what Emperor Awesome said himself. Now, if you're so set on Vermont that you'd rather wait for a chance to play it and turn down a guaranteed state right now, go for it I guess guys.

I just remeber that Vermont was an independent country around this time before joining the United States. It also was a joke, since it was made as if it didn't exist.

New Preferences:


1# Vermont Green Republic
2# PA.
3# VA.
4# NC.
5# SC.

You can add Vermont to your list, but unless the demand is high enough (IE 14 players, each of whom posts in this thread more than once to let me know they are still interested) it wont exist, and hence, wont be playable :P (This is also to give more for NY and NH to do.)

New Preferences:

1# PA.
2# VA.
3# NC.
4# SC.

Lookin' foward to startin'

Help me help you!

As I hope I made clear in the beginning, this game is still under development. I found my old data sheets but want to change things up! For one, the budgets are going to change from what I said earlier. Another thing I want to change is trade. Originally, there were but 12 goods to trade. I want to expand that... A LOT! I'm thinking dozens upon dozens of goods. I'm wondering if you guys wanted to help me make up a full list. In short, how it should work is thus...

Start with goods that come from nature. Mined ores, chopped down trees, furs.
Next, throw them into a 'factory' and turn them into something. Metal rods, 2 by 4s, Hats.
Next, throw that back into a 'factory' and turn it into something else! Railroad rails, Chairs, Fashionable outfits.  Sometimes you can combine them (Rails need ties, Couches need upholstery, etc)

Here is a list of things. Some are good, some are not, just things I've written down that seem realistic for this time. Please share your thoughts with me.


FUELS
Coal
Wood

AGRI NON FOODS
Cotton
Furs
Tobacco
Indigo

METALS
Gold
Silver
Iron Ore
Copper

FOODSTUFFS
Wheat
Barley
Corn
Fish
Rice



PROCESSED GOODS
Chairs <-- Wood
Tables <-- Wood
Bed Frames <-- Wood


Sailing Ships <-- Wood, Iron Ore
Clothing <-- Cotton
Fancy Clothing <-- Furs


Outfits <-- Clothing, Fancy Clothing

Iron Making
Shoes
Glass
Pottery
Leather
Wood Goods

various hats, clothings.
Needles
Pins
Thimbles
Smoothing Irons
Paper
Paper Boxes
Alcohol
Coaches
Flour
Bricks
Wire
Silverware
Bottles
Soap

personally I'd prefer that the trade system not get too complicated because it could get really confusing and hard to manage, but if most people are okay with it I can do it.

Watching with great interest...not going to play, though.

Gee thanks :P

Any news on our assignments?

New preferences:

1. Massachusetts
2. New Hampshire
3. Connecticut
4. Delaware
5. Vermont
6. Virginia

I've decided to give everyone time to redo their preferences should they chose to do so.

My state preferences remain the same, but if it helps accomodate more people I'd be willing to play a foreign power...(Britain...France etc)...your call as the GM.

new:

1. MA
2. NJ
3. SC

New:

1. Georgia
2. New Jersey
3. Maryland
4. South Carolina
5. Rhode Island
6. Connecticut

1. Maryland & Georgia
2. Virginia
3. Connecticut
4. Pennsylvania

Mine are as they were.

Assignments

Vepres - NH
Einzige - MA
RI - open
Hash - CT
Wyatt - NY
Bacon King - NJ
Bull - PA
Afleitch - DE
NiK - MD
Sewer - VA
Lahbas - NC
SC - open
Fezzy - GA

But... there is bad news. Check your PM boxes.

Ha, Bacon King and I traded places.

If you want to trade state, just either both PM me or both post it here. So long as it's before the game starts, I don't mind.

Ugh, I keep confusing people.  I just meant that he's from Georgia and I'm from New Jersey and now we're the Governors of each others' state.

Yes! Maryland...

Okay. 95% of my problems are that I'm trying to build a game to run in the 1700s when the original game was designed for the 2000s. Therefore, and this might be controversial, I'm going to use modern things for just about everything, starting with resources.

Thats fine, Why not hold off on the 13 states and do like European countries or such.

noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo keep the current map, i love it!!!!!!!!1!1  D:


but change the system all you want :)

So far I've heard three suggestions, each for one option. Here is what I am going to do:


I am building a list of resources for the game. Once that is done I can begin to come up with the military aspect, as I need to know which units you need resources to purchase.

Once I finish that, I will begin adding city stats. These things combined will neatly complete the game, and I will then add finishing touches.

I will also, however, build a map based on Europe, that will require less players (5, or 7) and see what we can do with that.

I'm thinking something like this for Europe


()


Lots of minor nations (not playable) to take over before you have to cut into a player nation. Of course you could do so anyway :P

no no no :(

US MAP

SADLY
I have to announce that I am putting this project on hold.

The game is just plain farther from finished than I originally thought. This was my mistake and I wish to make an apology to those I let down. I am sorry.


Whatever states you have been assigned, you may keep

I will be setting up a europe-based game in a few weeks. Anyone from this game who wishes to play in that game can give up their state in exchange for a "first bid" of nations in the new game. Anyone who does not give up their state can then pick any of the newly open states should they wish to change.

Hey, I want to play if there is room whenever you get it done.