Talk Elections

June 21st. Liberty State Park, NJ.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/top/all/7609982.html

Good.  I think he's more competent than the rest of the bunch.

New Jersey? That's random...

I don't know how I feel about this. It splits the sane vote and increases the chances a crazy is nominated. I'll be supporting him though.

Reagan used the same site. Of course, Hudson County had more than 5 Republicans at the time.

If he does this right he could be positioned very strongly for 2016.

How? To do so he has to actually perform well in some races. All the MSM adoration in the world won't matter much if he can't at least break 20% in NH and win somewhere. The best example would be also rans from 08 like Huckabee, or at a much lower threshold level would be Wesley Clark in 04. I can't imagine Huntsman doing anywhere as well as Huckabee, and I have great difficulty seeing how he even breaks out of the pack to win anywhere and place a few respectable second place finishes elsewhere.

He's simply too moderate and too Mormon for the national GOP primaries, and with Romney already filling that void this wasn't the year to run.

Obviously he has to perform as well as Romney 2008 did. Besides a few exceptions, the GOP nominates the candidate that has established themselves the most, usually through previous tries at the nomination. This is why, unless some Earth shattering event, Romney will be the nominee in this upcoming election.

The only way that running this year hurts Huntsman is if he runs a campaign as inept as Thompson 2008, which is simply possible but not probable.

There's a statue of some lady with a torch right behind the park.

Any chance Matthew can get involved in the whole process?

A nice setting, with the Statue of Liberty behind him...Dont know how many people will show up though..

Excluding staff, media, and people who happen to stop because there are news cameras -- 7

...I just realised that 'MSM' means 'mainstream media' and not 'moderate sane Mormon'.

I've mentioned this for other candidates as well, but I still find this formulation strange.  In making the above statement, Huntsman has already announced that he's running.  So in effect, he's already announced.

Coming for opposite ends of the expectations scale, with Thompson being intially lauded as "the New Reagan" and Huntsman being labeled as either "far too moderate" or simply "who?", then I suppose finishing a weak 3rd in two important early states before dropping out wouldn't kill his future presidential ambitions, but I'm not sure it'd help them either. Regardless, I'm skeptical whether he can manage even that.

Maybe it would've been better to take Hatch's seat (polls showed him a mile ahead of Orrin earlier this year, IIRC) to earn some chits with the teabaggers as a "Washington insider slayer", then keep his powder dry for later runs in 16 or 20.

He seems like an intelligent enough guy but I can't imagine his candidacy going anywhere.

here's the video clip:
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/jon-huntsman-announces-that-he-will-announce-a-presidential-bid-next-tuesday/

I think the impact Huntsman may have on this race is that he will Nader Romney and may hurt him a lot in NH.

However his chance of being nominated is close to 0

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I'm wondering what angle Huntsman's campaign will take; how does he differentiate from Romney on the issues?

I'll be voting for Huntsman.

(I'm a registered Republican)

His campaign will focus on the budget, and getting out of Afghanistan.

I support limited military intervention in Libya, but after reading about his latest foreign policy pronouncements about withdrawing from Afghanistan, our military presence in certain corners of the world, and re-evaluating who our friends and who our enemies are, I must say that I support him even more strongly now.   

He's the only GOP candidate I could see myself supporting in the race, unless he takes a hard turn right.

My support is still behind the President but who knows what can happen in a year.

I'm beginning to see the method to his madness -- wait for the debate, see where the chips start to fall, differentiate.  Nothing overly inconsistent with his record, but size up the field and find where his opportunities lie.

If he's for coming home from AfPak and reducing our worldwide military presence, he has firmed up my support.

His angle will be to go after the same voters that Romney is going after, and peel off just enough of them to stop Romney from winning the nomination.  That way, when Huntsman runs in 2016, there will be no complaints of "but we already tried nominating a Mormon four years ago, and that didn't work".

I don't know if it's been posted, but here's the second video:

'4 Days'
http://vimeo.com/25237798

OMG, what a psycho, if his real motivation is to "protect the Obama administration" and prevent a Romney victory, he deserves to be kicked out of the GOP.  He will deliberately sabotage Mitt Romney's campaign so that Obama can be re-elected. 

This is really beyond crazy and should really give any GOP voter pause in supporting, donating, or campaigning for Huntsman.  He would be a traitor to his party and committing the ultimate treachery.  I would not be surprised if there is a secret deal between Huntsman and the Obama team.  Maybe he wants a seat on the supreme court? 

Seriously, stop Huntsman now, this guy is an Obama loyalist to the core. 

Cool story bro.

You realize that there is no evidence that he's trying to do that, right?

And I though I was a conspiracy theorist!

Evidence that Huntsman is an Obama plant:
(1) Worked for the Obama administration
(2) Loyal to the Obama administration and personally to President Obama
(3) Keeps written letters of praise from Obama
(4) Does not verbally attack the faults of the Obama administration

Something fishy is going on with the Huntsman campaign.  I'm sure more evidence will show up once he announces.  There's enough anti-obama red meat out there, that Huntsman will need to clearly articulate why he would be a better president than Obama, other than being a white mormon governor of Utah.  Huntsman will need to clearly criticize the Obama administration and its failures - but he should not criticize Obama's china policy, doh!

I would really use the Freedom of Information act to figure out what electronic communications occurred between Huntsman and the White House during the last 4 years.  Lets get to the bottom of this coordinated attack on Romney and the Republican party.

of course he's a plant. Manchuria is right next door to China.

My suggestion was that Huntsman may try to stop Romney from winning the nomination, not that he'd try to stop him from winning the general election.  Romney winning the nomination would be bad for Huntsman, whether he goes on to win the general or not.  If Romney is the nominee and loses the GE, then the GOP is not going to nominate another Mormon in 2016.

Huntsman would obviously like to win the 2012 nomination himself.  But, barring that, he'd probably like to see the GOP nominate someone like Rick Perry rather than Romney.

Its hypocritical to work enthusiastically for Obama, and then turn around and say Obama sucks and I can be a better president than him.  If he had some ill will or bitter argument with the Obama administration, then he should run.  But it just seems like he's an entitled rich guy who is disingenuous in his work for the President, and he's just been bs-ing his work in China for the past 3 years.  I wouldn't label Ron Paul as a liberal, but he's certainly gained a strong following from Indepedent voters who are not hardcore republicans. 

Maybe Huntsman is going to triangulate his way to the presidency by alienating both republicans and obama-democrats.  He'll be the moderate-independent candidate. 
When Huntsman isn't busy sucking Obama, he's shaking Republican donors hands trying to get money from them.

If Huntsman thinks he can be a better President than Obama, then fine, but Huntsman has to actually say 'WHY' he would be a better president than Obama.  Will Huntsman have a plan to decrease unemployment from 9%?  Will he handle libya, afganistan, and pakistan, better?

What really is the difference that Huntsman thinks he can offer against Obama other than he is a rich white mormon guy from Utah?  Also, Huntsman has the support of McCain's brilliant brain trust - the same ones that picked Palin and lost huge to Obama.  Huntsman's an idiot at best, a traitor at worst, and he's got egg all over his face.  I'm sure he even supported Obama Health Care.

Huntsman took 2nd place at the Republican Leadership Conference.
Only after Ron Paul...


...the momentum builds....

You'd think he would have been able to buy first place. (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0611/57274.html)

I think Obama was a Huntsman plant, actually.

I just left the event. A friend and I arrived a little late and had to park about fifteen minutes away from the announcement site (thanks for the lack of directional signs, Team Huntsman :P) so we only saw Huntsman being interviewed by Hannity. I heard the announcement itself was pretty weak though another friend of mine who arrived on time said it was a good event all around. I got some nice pictures after Huntsman left Hannity and walked to his car. I'll post them later.

Huntsman can't win the primaries but in attempting to do so, he's already made himself incapable of winning the general too.  He should have run as an Independent moderate technocrat, saying the Republican party has gotten too crazy, lost, then tried again in 2016.  Too late now.

This is embarrassing:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenote/2011/06/huntsman-campaign-launch-begins-day-with-misspelling-of-his-own-name.html

And then there is this:

http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/the-buzz-florida-politics/content/jon-huntsman-staffing-florida-no-one-else

I hope he isn't seriously going to try the old Giuliani tactic...

At least the wind didn't mess up his hair.  It would have been funny if his notes got blown everywhere.  The C-span microphone was terrible

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Huntsman is a no good RINO and the Republican Party already tried putting up the Democrats' favorite Republican last time around and look what happened.

If Rick Perry joins the race, this will be an epic grudge of perfect hair between him, Mittens and Huntsman.

This is why I like Jon Huntsman.

>>>http://vimeo.com/25237798

This, seconded. He's polling at 0% in Iowa. Literally. Who wasn't surprised that more MSM journos were at his announcement speech than actual voters?

Care to explain how he is a "RINO"?

I think you're just confused because you haven't seen an intelligent and rational republican in a while.

So, you agree with Huntsman that the so-called 'stimulus' bill was too small?!?

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0611/57498.html (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0611/57498.html)

He supports civil unions and other rights for same-sex couples (I'm not against that, but the majority of Republicans are), promoted cap and trade, supported an individual mandate for healthcare (If he tries going after Romney on this it will be a serious lol on him), does not believe in constructing a border fence, and is wobbly on the death penalty. Those are not positions a governor of the most Republican and Conservative state in the country should have been endorsing. Romney and Reagan for that matter have the excuse of having more liberal records are Governors considering how Massachusetts and California have always been much more progressive than most of the country.

Huntsman is less of a 'RINO' than Palin and Bachmann.

Yes. It should have cost at least $1 trillion.

I didn't know about his positions on the border fence and capital punishment. If true, that makes me support him even more strongly.

Huntsman's family has been close friends with Harry Reid for years, and has donated about $25,000 to him.  Jon himself hasn't, but this isn't exactly helpful for his image.

http://www.lasvegassun.com/blogs/ralstons-flash/2011/jun/22/huntsmans-family-gave-nearly-25000-reid-last-cycle/

Seems to be the rule for me -- if "true conservatives" are against a Republican, it's usually a clue that they're my ideal candidate.

Corrolary: Explains why they tolerate Romney.  I hate that guy.

A truly nominee worthy politician can circumvent such things.  This is why Romney blew it in 2008 and will likely not be the nominee in 2012.  He sucks at handling scrutiny.

The bigger problem for Huntsman is that the conspiracy theorists of the right will accuse him of being the real life Manchurian candidate.  Or to lesser extent, that he only became a Republican because he knew he couldn't win as a Democrat in Utah.

Huntsman raised $1.2 million on first day of campaign. Join the Hunt!

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/jon-huntsman-raises-1-2-million-on-first-day-of-campaign/

Almost as good as Romney's $10.2 mil first day... almost.

IIRC, that was pledged money, not actual donations?

So, do you agree with Huntsman that the Obama 'stimulus' bill (aka porkulus) was too small?

You seem to be dodging.

Oh, and let me add some other questions:

Which Huntsman position on the individual mandate for healthcare coverage do you prefer?

Are you so enthusiastic about Huntsman because he advocates strangling the economy on the pretext of ‘global warming’?

Do you support Huntsman because the liberal media is absolutely ga-ga over him?

Maybe the endorsement of Huntsman by Sen. Reid ways heavily with you?

Or, is it the gushing by Rachel Maddow?

http://progressivepride.com/2011/06/22/maddow-loves-jon-huntsman-campaign-kickoff/

You tell 'em, CARL!

I prefer his first position on the individual mandate, actually. It's unfortunate that he decided to abandon such a reasonable and level-headed position.
If you're referring to his past support of emissions trading, he dropped it due to the economic recession: http://thehill.com/blogs/e2-wire/677-e2-wire/167925-huntsman-cap-and-trade-at-odds-with-todays-reality (http://thehill.com/blogs/e2-wire/677-e2-wire/167925-huntsman-cap-and-trade-at-odds-with-todays-reality)
I couldn't care less about the news media's opinion of a candidate.
It's nice to see bipartisanship, but Senator Reid's endorsements do not factor whatsoever into my deciding who to support.
Perhaps you provided the wrong link, because I saw no gushing in that video.

Now, if I may ask you a question, Carl: who do you support in the 2012 Republican presidential primary?

OMG so fricken hilarious. His ads are some of the worst I've ever seen from a candidate.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/jimmy-kimmel-on-jon-huntsmans-campaign-ad-sad-like-the-trailer-for-a-movie-where-the-dog-dies/

I've been looking for a Republican who tackles the all important issue of pancakes.

Haven't seen the video (damned video blocking at work) but I'll say this:

Same people did Demon Sheep.  Fiorina won the nomination handily.

It has been the Huntsman campaign's intent all along to first raise profile, and second to worry about being taken seriously.  Frankly, with Huntsman's resume, I think it's the right move -- better to flame out spectularly than to languish in obscurity.

Here's hoping that his next move is to debate a foaming-at-the-mouth social conservative...in Chinese.

Will Jeb Bush Jr. come on board soon?

http://www.seattlepi.com/national/politico/article/Jeb-Jr-joins-Huntsman-1439325.php

Well, I have twice asked you if you agreed with Huntsman on things like the 'stimulus' bill being too small.

If you disagreed with that position, or the others I have cited, you could have simply so noted.

So, where exactly do you disagree with Obama (as he and Huntsman are pretty much in agreement)?

Also, why support a copy instead of the original?

Is it the ugly face of raacism?

"I guess in hindsight we can all say that there were some fundamental flaws with it," the potential GOP presidential candidate told Politico two years ago. "It probably wasn’t large enough."

He's saying it probably wasn't big enough to make an impact, he's not saying it should be bigger, simply giving a problem of the stimulus doesn't give support of it.

Here's his official position on the stimulus:
"Jon Huntsman said that he wouldn’t have voted for President Obama’s stimulus plan and warned from the beginning that “much of the spending (in the stimulus) is misdirected and more likely to bloat the government than boost the economy.”"

First, thank you for responding.

Second, the quote I was citing is NOT his revised (now that he's running) statement, but rather his original statement, which is:

Jon Huntsman Thought the Stimulus Was Too Small

2/1/11 at 2:15 PM

"I guess in hindsight we can all say that there were some fundamental flaws with it," the potential GOP presidential candidate told Politico two years ago. "It probably wasn’t large enough."

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2011/02/john_huntsman_thought_the_stim.html

So, which Jon Huntsman are you supporting?

And as to the other questions I posed...?

I referenced that quote in my response, you obviously didn't see it.
As to your other questions, you can ask them again if you want a response.

This metal lover MUST be defeated.

that article calls him "former governor Jeb Bush Jr." wow.

So, then you agree that the stimuluous bill should have been larger?

Oh, and do you agree with this Huntsman/Obama policy:

As governor of Utah, he appeared in a 2007 ad for an environmental advocacy group in which he said, "Now it's time for Congress to act by capping greenhouse gas pollution."

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700140035/Top-GOP-contenders-flip-on-global-warming.html

He likes progressive rock, not metal. Besides, what if some progressive agree with you on everything but loves metal music?

I do. Why is sanity frowned upon in today's GOP?

Cobbler,

First, welcome to the forum.

Second, you really should check into scientific reality.

Have you noticed that even the advocates of massive totalitarian government have changed the name of their movement from Global Warming to Climate Change?

Best data indicates that we are in for a generation of global cooling, having nothing whatsoever to do with actions of human, but rather with sun cycles.

Huntsman like Progressive rock? That'd be the first thing I like about his candidacy if I'm right and you're talking about Huntsman.

He's a huge Dream Theater fan.

Me too. And I'm wondering the same...

http://gawker.com/5258109/meet-jon-huntsman-jr-our-new-ambassador-to-china

The rock n roller for the GOP.

So, you're in favor of strangling the economy using 'global warming' as a pretext, even though we're facing global cooling due to solar activity.

It's called climate change, but yeah.

So, are you claiming that strangling the economy will stop the sun cycle from causing global cooling?

I really found the name change hilarious. 

If you believe the climate is too hot, or too cool, or too wet, or too dry - well then, you call it "climate change" and have the same Procrustean solution of strangling the economy.

Yes

Whether or not you believe in the evidence for climate change, these policies will still contribute to us getting off of things like oil by incentivizing more investment in alternative energy. Oil isn't going to be there forever. Getting off it is a bigger concern for me.

I do believe the 97% of scientists that say that mankind is impacting climate change, however. I'm glad Huntsman does too.

Ooh! You were the guy in the green shirt, no? This is the black kid in the blue polo!

Hahaha, no, the kid I was with had a green shirt, I think.

Was it... did you have the backpack?

No. I think the kid I was with brought his backpack or maybe that was someone near us.

I guess so. Funny how this happens. Also noticed that someone a couple pages back said 7 people would show up... and I'd say it was seven people with us.

Also read that someone who was invited had an Obama T-shirt... how were they choosing these people?