Talk Elections

So this is my first attempt at a timeline on this forum; I hope you enjoy it.  This style is based on Han's President Goldwater TL's and By A Fluke of the Gods.  So without further ado,

6-19-1852: "Mr. President, it looks like you may be renominated...wait, Scott has withdrawn and endorsed you!  shh they're about to cast the next ballot..."

3rd ballot results:

Fillmore: 235
Webster: 65

1st Vice Presidential ballot:

Webster: 289
Others: 11

6-20-1852: "I stand before you the proud nominee of your party.  I thank you for the great honor you have bestowed upon me.  I humbly accept your nomination for a second term as your president.  Make no mistake, tough times lie ahead.  But I do not shrink in the face of danger!  I pledge to you that we will restore peace, at home and abroad!  Thank you and goodnight!"

Cool! I've wanted to do a Whigs survive timeline, but have held off on it due to the fact I'm working on four timelines and that I'd have to do way too much research. Love to see where this goes.

Thanks Cathcon!

6-22-1852: "My fellow countrymen.  I feel I must inform you that I firmly endorse President Fillmore over Senator Pierce.  My reasons are thus: I disagree with Mr. Pierce's courting of the southern vote, and his intolerable positions on the slavery issue, which have been taken for the sole and exclusive purpose of gaining the election on the backs of southern farmers.  I fully believe in slavery as it is presently, and I have worked closely with the President to craft the Great Compromise just two years ago.  I believe for these reasons that President Fillmore is more of a Democrat in governing than his partisan opponent.  This is why I choose to cast my ballot for him; because he is a generally good man."

- Senator Stephen Douglas (D-IL); many are shocked at this revelation; it remains to be seen if this will affect his political career.

6-25-1852: "I support fullheartedly the candidacy of President Fillmore.  I will be a candidate for senate this year."

- Abraham Lincoln, (W-IL) campaigning on behalf of Fillmore in Illinois

"Many historians believe that President Fillmore's aggresive grassroots activism was the beginning of the modern presidential campaign" - an eighth grade history textbook

7-13-1852: "I pledge that if those damned Anglos don't stop rearing their ugly imperialist head in in the Americas, I will go there personally and end these conflicts myself!  The man to stop these idiotic Englishmen and the Spaniards in Cuba is President Fillmore!" - General Winfield Scott

8-19-1852: After Lincoln following Douglas around Illinois for the past few weeks, refuting Douglas' speeches, Douglas agrees to seven debates with him.  These debates would prove to be influential on history, and many who observe them are astonished at the eloquence of both men, yet are not fully aware of the history that they witness.

10-24-1852: Daniel Webster, Whig candidate for Vice President, dies peacefully in his sleep at age 70.  This is believed to be the first ever October Surprise, as the sympathy vote turns to Fillmore.  The replacement VP candidate is Abraham Lincoln, who has become well-known for his debates with Douglas.

Election Night 1852:

President Millard Fillmore (W-NY) / Congressman Abraham Lincoln (W-IL): 52.3% PV / 258 EV

Senator Franklin Pierce (D-NJ) / William R. King (D-AL): 39.4% PV / 38 EV

Senator John P. Hale (FS-NH) / George Washington Julian (FS-NH): 7.4% PV / 0 EV

Other: 1.0%

()

The Second Cabinet of President Millard Fillmore:

Vice President: Abraham Lincoln
Secretary of State: John J. Crittenden
Secretary of War: Winfield Scott
Secretary of Treasury: Martin Van Buren
Secretary of Navy: Frank Paul *
Attorney General: John Bell
Postmaster General: Stephen Douglas

*A fictional character; the Whig governor of Texas

Many were astonished by the grand coalition that President Fillmore had put together of enemies and adversaries from across the political spectrum.  The Congressional elections were a great triumph for the Whigs.

United States House of Representatives elections, 1852:

Whigs: 153 (+26)
Democrats: 63 (-32)
Free Soil: 11 (+7)
Independent: 3 (-1)

Speaker-elect: Robert Charles Winthrop
Minority Leader-elect: Linn Boyd

United States Senate elections, 1852

Whigs: 31 (+9)
Democrats: 27 (-11)
Free Soil: 6 (+2)

While the Whig mjarity in the senate is much more narrow than the one they enjoy in the House, behind the scenes there is an alliance being formed with the Free Soilers, and President Fillmore has been given a mandate by which to govern.

President Pro Tempore-elect: William H. Seward (W-NY)

4-7-1853:
Winthrop: "Well Mr. President we certainly have a mandate.  This brings us back to the tariff issue..."
Fillmore: "No.  I will not have any of it.  If anything we need to lower the tariff to create free trade.  The more we trade with other nations the richer we will become.  Plus now all the free-trade Democrats support me, and I need to keep popular opinion if we have any hope of accomplishing anything-"
Seward: "I agree.  We have to keep the confidence of the public.  Furthermore, the last time we were rattling that saber, we went down to defeat.  Damn that Clay, he betrayed our party-"
Fillmore: "But remember who is the president here.  Your job is to push through these policies.  We also need a military buildup if we have any hope of taking Cuba and Hispaniola from those damned Spaniards.  Well, thank you gentlemen, I hope for all our sakes that you get our agenda passed."

12-28-1852: "I come before you humbly as your president, carrying out a constitutional duty as old our nation itself.  I remember sitting in the freshman row myself, nearly 18 years ago, watching as President Jackson stood before us, declaring that 'The State of the Union is Good.'  This remains true today, and I wish for all our sakes that we work to maintain that state of being.  We must lower the tariff, and make it fair for all industries. [cheers, with some disgruntled expressions from some of the more partisan northern Whigs] We must work to maintain peace abroad, but be cautious as we watch Europe rear the ugly head of imperialism once again.  We need to protect American interests so that we may protect this shining city on a hill for the next generation of Americans, so in four years, when I ask you 'As you look around you, are you better off than you were four years ago,' you can easily reply 'I most certainly am' without any hesitation or doubt in  your mind! [applause]  We must act now to balance our nation's budget and repay our national debt,[cheers] so I call on the Congress to spend less than what they take in [applause], and I would also ask for a Balanced Budget Amendment and a Line-Item Veto for the President! [cheers] T-[cheers continue]Thank you, God bless you, and God bless the United States of America."

Were such things as a balanced budget & line item veto issues then? And would Fillmore really push for lower tarrifs? He was a Whig after all.

4-17-1853: The United States House of Representatives votes 132-101 (with 1 member abstaining) in favor of lowering the tariff to a flat rate of 14%, nearly as low as the tariff that James Polk put in place.  The House also approves the balanced budget amendment by 169-75.  However the line-item veto passes by 133-101.  This means that it will not be sent to the states for ratification.  However, Fillmore is feeling good about the budget, and has accomplished much in the ways of legislation so far.

Not really, but the national debt was a touchy issue; both parties were guilty of increasing it (much like today) and really couldn't talk about it without being hypocrites.  I think he would have been borderline anti-tariff because of the fact that he acted independently of his party, which led to his OTL failure to be renominated.  Many southern whigs were anti-tariff because of the south's agrarian economy and he had many southern sympathies, being a moderate on the slave issue, etc.  I'm also taking a bit of creative license, like I did in my other TL because very little is known about the presidents I like to focus on.

btw were you the one who said "yes this should continue"?

5-02-1853: Many in Europe see Fillmore as a threat to their colonial empires.  For this reason, Spain and the United Kingdom get together, and begin pouring all their savings into their militaries, as well as those in Mexico and their own client states.  Meanwhile, the German states push for unification, led by Otto Von Bismarck.  They have finally succeeded, with Von Bismarck made chancellor of the unified German Empire by newly-crowned Emperor Wilhelm I.  Von Bismarck pushes for aid to America, seeing it as a great potential ally in the future.

5-11-1853: Mexico is becoming the poster child of imperial Europe.  All kinds of foreign currencies flow freely into their treasury, much to the anger of the United States.  However, the United States benefits from the German marks flooding their own treasury.  Meanwhile, in Germany, negotiations begin on the unification with Austria and Switzerland.  Austria is pleased by the prospect of German union, while Switzerland gives lukewarm support.  However, Von Bismarck quickly discovers that they respond well to cash....

6-2-1853: Three United States merchant ships are sunk by Hispanila, Cuba, and the Bahamas, as well as the French Haitians.  President Fillmore is quick to respond saying "This totalitarian aggression will not be tolerated!  We will never surrender to the cowardly attacks on unarmed, innocent Americans by crazed imperialist aggressors!  We will fight them till their dying breath! I stand before you today, and ask for a Declaration of War on Spain, France, and Britain God bless you, God bless America, and God, for our sake, don't save the queen!"

The German Empire is quick in its response as well.  Von Bismarck calls the Reichstag and the Bundesrat into a joint session, and proclaims "We will stand with our ally, America!  We will fight this act of aggression by our neighbors, and we will strike them where it really hurts!  We will make them pay for what they have done to our friend America!"  His speech is well-received, and after Germany declares war on France, Britain, and Spain, the joint session closes with the singing of "God Bless America" and "Star-Spangled Banner"

WHO SAID NO!  SHOW URSELF!  Nah, but seriously reveal yourself and give the n00b some advice if you don't like it; I'll take all I can get

6-07-1853: American ships arrive in Cuba, Hispaniola, and Puerto Rico.  More ships are bound for the Philippines and should arrive within two weeks.  All male Americans between the ages of 18 and 25 are required to serve.  Meanwhile, back home Winfield Scott outlines his strategy for victory to President Fillmore.

6-12-1853: The Battle of Havana is won by the United States.  It is a great victory for America, and things are looking up for the young nation as it spreads its wings across the map.  The Battle for San Juan is won easily, and the commanding generals of their enemies are killed in both - hanged for all to see.  Many natives welcome the Americans as they are now free from their European masters.

06-17-1853: American troops defeat the Dominicans at Santo Domingo, with few casualties on either side due to Scott's strategy: go for the jugular; pick off the high level Commanding officers as quickly as possible.

06-19-1853: American troops defeat the British at the Bahamas, after several days of fighting.  This is a great victory for the Americans, who are setting up to defeat their former rulers for a third time in just over half a century.

06-24-1853: American ships arrive in the Philippines; the Battle for Manilla begins and ends within two hours after the native Philippinos rush for the Philippino Loyalists in the cover of night.

06-27-1853: American troops head northward to Canada.  Scott is planning a 4-pronged invasion of Canada at Toronto, Montreal, through the Oregon territory, and through Detroit.

07-05-1853: The French surrender to America, and give up all their holdings in the Carribean and the Americas.

07-12-1853: America invades Canada, according to Scott's plan.  When the British see the Americans, they flee to their ships, and begin to pick off troops using artillery.  Scott had planned for this, and orders the unveiling of the American response: the tank.  After several hours of fighting, the battle is over, with an American victory.  The Spanish surrender the United States, and in the peace treaty surrender all of their colonies in the Carribean and Latin America to the U.S.  England is not giving up so easily, however....

07-21-1853: The United States purchases Greenland, Alaska, and Iceland at Seward's urging.  Scott sees opportunity to use these to America's tactical advantage for a surprise invasion.  Several days later, American ships from Alaska land in British Columbia and those from Greenland depart for Toronto.

08-09-1853: The British and United States sign a peace treaty entitling the United States to the Bahamas and British Columbia for $800,000.  BC is merged with the Alaska Territory.

09-12-1853: Germany exits the war, and like America, leaves not empty-handed: they have acquired their fellow Europeans' African colonies, and have purchased Australia and India for several million franks.

10-21-1853: Vice President Lincoln is growing increasingly stubborn with President Fillmore on the slavery issue.  At Lincoln's urging, the Congress passes several Civil Liberties Laws, which President Fillmore gives lukewarm support to.

12-12-1853: The United States admits Oregon into the Union.

01-05-1854: America gears up for election season, with Crittenden and Douglas attempting to recapture senatem seats; neither resigns their position in the cabinet however.

02-12-1854: The Congress submits a budget with a $2 million surplus thanks to the German cash that has kept the treasury full.  The national debt is nearly paid off.

03-07-1854: President Fillmore has helped to usher a new slave compromise through Congress, with some encouragement from Vice President Lincoln.  The law will abolish slavery by 1875 and will compensate each slaveowner $2000 per slave.  This is praised by abolitionists and several southerners.  Few southerners are displeased with the bill.

04-18-1854: John McKinley dies and is replaced on the Supreme Court by David Davis.

06-02-1854: William F. Buckley Sr. is appointed to a federal circuit court

06-29-1854: John J. Davis is appointed to the Supreme Court.  He will be the youngest Supreme Court justice ever at age 25; he is a southern Democrat, so Vice President Lincoln was needed to shore up abolitionist support for him, and he was confirmed with the tie-breaking vote of Vice President Lincoln; the narrowest supreme court confirmation ever.

08-03-1854: Stephen Johnson Field, Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of California, is confirmed to succeed Robert Taney as Chief Justice of the Supreme Court.  Though a Democrat, he is considered to be a moderate on racial issues.

09-29-1854: Reverdy Johnson is appointed to the Supreme Court of the United States.  He is a southern Whig, and though many Whigs are disappointed that Fillmore didn't choose John Crittenden for the appointment, few can deny Johnson's credentials and intelligence.  Furthermore, Crittenden declined the appointment, due to his desire to seek his senate seat instead, believing that to be a better stepping-stone to the presidency in 1856 or 1860.

10-14-1854: Francis Jonathon Buckley is confirmed to the Supreme Court of the United States.  This is President Fillmore's sixth Supreme Court nomination, tied with Jackson's record for total number of court appointments, and second only to George Washington.  It is also his fifth in only a few months, however many are content with this due to his choices typically being similar in ideology to their predecessors, and the regional balance he adds.

Election Day 1854:

The Whigs continue their popularity, and though they lose a few seats in the deep south due to the Civil Liberties Act of 1854, they gain enough in the north to more than counteract the damage.

House:

Whigs: 161 (+8)
Democrats: 52 (-11)
Free Soil: 13 (+2)
Independent: 4 (+1)

Incumbent Speaker: Robert C. Winthrop
Speaker-elect: Robert C. Winthrop
Minority Leader: Linn Boyd
Minority Leader-elect: William Aiken, Jr.

12-24-1854: President Fillmore appoints his seventh Supreme Court Justice, Caleb Cushing.  He jokes that "This year I was granted a Christmas present one day early."

1-17-1855: Congress passes the Judiciary Act of 1855, which adds two Supreme Court seats to the bench.  The seats are quickly filled by President Fillmore, who sends Edward Bates and James Speed to the bench.

United States Senate elections, 1854

Whig: 35 (+4)
Democrat: 22 (-7)
Free Soil: 9 (+3)

President Pro Tempore of the Senate: William H. Seward (Whig)
President Pro Tempore of the Senate: William H. Seward (Whig)

John Crittenden was elected to a senate seat from Kentucky as a Whig, while Douglas was elected to the senate as a Democrat.

3-17-1855: Fillmore appoints Salmon P. Chase to the Supreme Court, making this his ninth appointment to the Supreme Court thus far.  Only three justices on the Supreme Court are not Fillmore appointees: Samuel Nelson, Robert Grier, and John Catron.

05-02-1855: The Second Judiciary Act of 1855 adds another 4 justices to the bench, which greatly agitates the public.  Another seat opens up: that of Samuel Nelson.  Fillmore fills these new seats with Alphonso Taft, Samuel F. Phillips, James Buchanan, John Tyler, and his former opponent Franklin Pierce, which settles the public slightly as the balance of the court has been maintained. *

* Note: this will have repercussions

06-14-1855: President Fillmore announces his intent to seek re-election next November.  Few are surprised, as he has always indicated that he would run for re-election, but many of his fellow Whigs are very displeased...

07-04-1855: The United States budget of 1857 is submitted earlier than ever before, with a surplus of $2.3 million.  The United States has paid off its national debt.

Haven't read all the new updates yet, but...
...William F. Buckley Sr. was born in like 1881. How can he be on any court just under thirty years before he's born?

Also, suggestion: don't just update with one date, compile them into larger updates with like ten different dates. That's how they're usually done.

And at last: I love how Winfield Scott gets appointed War Secretary. Here's hoping for a Civil War where he can be as nasty as he needs to be, though it looks like it may be averted ITTL.

09-12-1855: Though popular support for President Fillmore is high, his fellow Whigs are growing agitated by his conservatism.  It appears he is becoming too old-fashioned for the younger generation of Whigs, though Vice President Lincoln urges his fellow Whigs that Fillmore is the only candidate that can win next year.

11-09-1855: Congress passes a bill making English the official language of the United States.  This is applauded by many from across the political spectrum, particularly those in the small Know-Nothing Movement.

Also, how does a President get away with just expanding the Supreme Court non-stop? I doubt that would fly and I'm not sure, but that seems like the kind of thing that would need a constitutional amendment.

I couldn't find a name for Buckley Sr.'s dad so I called him Buckley Sr....retconning....also the Civil War will be a surprise.

According to wikipedia, it's John C. Buckley, though I have no idea if he has any legal experience whatsoever, and Bill Sr. was a Texas oilman.

That's what we did; there were only 5 justices in the beginning, expanded to 7 under washington, eventually 9 and Lincoln got it to 10, saw people getting miffed about it and then switched it backed to 9; this will have some serious repercussions in the future as I said; the court is up to 15 and many of the n00bs will be replaced in the 1870s; anyway Fillmore didn't really plan on this happening but gladly took the opportunity to pack the court, but there is an ideological balance he maintained; he put Taft and John TYLER on the same bench so sparks will fly; Fillmore believed in replacing the man with someone ideologically similar to maintain the balance on the court.

Thanks I love all the comments

AT LEAST SOMEONE CARES ENOUGH TO COMMENT (HINT HINT!!!!) haha

12-27-1855: Winfield Scott begins a strict regiment of diet and exercize!  His doctors are very upset with his dietary habits, as he has grown to 260 pounds.  He quickly trims off fat and is down to 220 pounds again by April.  Doctors say this was necessary for his health, yet on the first day of the diet, old fuss n' feathers complains "This is not food!  This is what food EATS!"

01-12-1856: Winfield Scott makes it known that he will not be a candidate for the upcoming presidential election.

01-20-1856: Jonathon Gallup founds The Gallup Organization, which is a service that determines a president's approval rating with the general public.  Many are astounded when the first poll shows that only 41% of Americans approve of President Fillmore*

05-03-1856: The United States economy surpasses France to become the fourth-largest in the world, behind only Britain, Germany, and the Russian Empire




*This was added to make things easier for me in terms of how people feel about the pres, etc.

02-13-1856: Many in the senate charge President Fillmore on corruption for having expanded the Supreme Court far beyond the Founders’ intent, however Fillmore responds, “If it’s not what they expected to have good, fine, honest men put on that bench, then by God I’m glad I didn’t meet any of those old coots!”  This settles the populace slightly.

02-15-1856: President Fillmore’s approval rating is at 49%.

03-03-1856: President Fillmore continues to campaign as a strict constitutionalist who saved the United States from imperialist clutches once more.  Gallup releases head-to-head matchups for the upcoming elections:

Fillmore vs. Breckinridge*:



Fillmore vs. Pierce:




Fillmore vs. Douglas:



*Announced candidate

Fillmore approval rating: 54%

04-17-1856: “It is not my time, and I am not yet ready to become president.  That is why I will not seek, and I shall not accept, your nomination for the presidency of the United States.” - Stephen Douglas (D-IL)

04-24-1856: “I’m done with politics!  Here I get to wear these nice black robes (reporters laugh).  Seriously though, I’m not interested in running for president again.” - Franklin Pierce.  With his fine mannerisms and his charm, many think he could have been a great president.

05-03-1856: “Frank’s out, so I’m out too” - James Buchanan.

05-09-1856: “I’m all in!” - John C. Breckinridge (D-KY)

06-01-1856: Minnesota is admitted to the union

Whoops; maps didn't post.

Fillmore vs. Breckinridge:

153 EV vs. 143 EV

()

Fillmore vs. Douglas:

229 vs. 67 EV

()

Filmore vs. Pierce:

173 vs. 123 EV

()

I recommend green for the Whigs. That's the color this site uses, and it shows up better with map shades and text.

Is there any uproar over Fillmore breaking Washington's tradition?

I'd hope for Buchanan to win, but he's out of the running apparently.

Not really any anger over breaking Washington's tradition; back then the media weren't as rabbid as they were in 1940 so really just a few cute cartoons about Fillmore ducking Washington's tradition like Teddy in 1912.  I wanted to use either yellow or orange because those are the most common for the Whigs, but yellow is ugly so I'm switching to orange...till the manual changing gets annoying.  Then I'll use green.

BTW why are these text boxes so annoying?  When I type more than a few lines it starts spazzing out scrolling up and down rapidly...

It ususally depends on what computer you're using or what your internet provider is. I'm not sure. For me it usually happens if I'm using the school computers.

Stupid windows 7....

06-09-1856: After 256 ballots, Lewis Cass is nominated for president while John C. Breckinridge was nominated for Vice President.

06-17-1856: President Fillmore, though he has lukewarm support by many in his party, is re-nominated unanimously at the Whig National Convention in Philadelphia.  Vice President Lincoln is re-nominated with only one vote in opposition: for William Seward.

06-25-1856: William Seward declares himself a candidate for the Whig nomination…in 1860.  Many are stunned by this, as it has little to no relevance to the current election.

08-12-1856: Now that all the candidates for Congress have been nominated, Lincoln is sent out to barnstorm for the Whigs.  He goes on a 3-month nationwide campaign train for himself and his President as well as Congress.  He is well-received wherever he went, which is what inspired Sarah Palin’s vice presidential campaign in [redacted]

08-24-1856: Vice President Lincoln’s campaigning appears to be working; the President’s approval ratings are 57% and rapidly increasing.  In a head-to-head matchup with Cass, the president leads 55%-38% with the rest undecided.

09-03-1856: The national Free Soil Party nominates former President Martin Van Buren for president with Salmon P. Chase as the VP candidate, though Chase will not campaign for the job at all.  The first incidence of cross-party nominating, the New York and California Free Soil Party nominates Vice President Lincoln for president and Van Buren for Vice President.  Lincoln has no comment on this matter

10-29-1856: "President Fillmore!" [waves]
[the president waves back]
[gunshots]
[shrieking]
[The president is shoved into his carriage, which speeds away]

To be continued.....

...IMMEDIATELY!

President Fillmore is rushed to the hospital; luckily the bullet grazed his chest but was deflected by a Bible he had in his coat pocket.

So without further ado, the election:

()

President Millard Fillmore (W-NY) / Vice President Lincoln (W-IL) - 60.1% Pop. Vote;  280 EV
Gen. Lewis Cass / Sen. John C. Breckinridge (D-KY) - 27.4% Pop. Vote; 23 EV
Fmr. President Martin Van Buren (FS-NY) / Salmon P. Chase (FS-OH) - 12.5% Pop. Vote; 0 EV

Obviously the sympathy vote rolled in for President Fillmore, due to the attempt on his life and his Vice President's vigorous campaigning, as well as his opponent's ambiguity after 8 years in the political wilderness.  However his victory is not just due to the sympathy vote, as his coattails prove:

United States House of Representatives elections, 1854:

Whigs: 174 (+13)
Democrats: 44 (-8)
Free Soil: 10 (-3)
Independent: 2 (-2)

Incumbent Speaker: Robert C. Winthrop (W-MA)
Speaker-elect: Robert C. Winthrop (W-MA)
Incumbent Minority Leader: William Aiken, Jr. (D-SC) - defeated
Minority Leader-elect: James Orr (D-SC)

United States Senate elections, 1854:

Whig: 44 (+9)
Democrat: 16 (-6)
Free Soil: 10 (+1)

Incumbent Pres. Pro Tem.: William Seward (W-NY)
Pres. Pro Tem. elect: William H. Seward (W-NY)

*The Other 4 senate gains came from the freshmen from MN and OR.

03-04-1857: President Fillmore is sworn in for a record third term.  It remains to be seen whether the Court-packing plan will be his undoing; for now it appears to have left him unscathed.  The third consecutive election in which the Whigs have gained seats in both houses of Congress, and the third consecutive presidential election won by a Whig; the only Whig who was not a war hero to win a presidential election, President Fillmore's second term is going to be remembered throughout history.

04-09-1857: The Congress submits the seventh consecutive balanced budget, all of which Fillmore can take credit for.  President Fillmore truly unified the Whigs and nearly destroyed the Democratic Party...  He proposes further tariff decreases to take the United States to a record low of 10%.  This is even lower than those under the Polk administration.  It easily passes the Whig-dominated Congress, and when it reaches the president's desk he plucks out all the earmarks of higher rates on certain items.

05-12-1857: The President goes on a "goodwill tour"; this will likely be his final term in office, and he pushes for reciprocity with Germany as a token of American appreciation.  This uncontrovercial legislation passes within two hours and is signed immediately.
06-12-1857: President Fillmore calls for the phasing out (and slow privatization of) the Postal Service, to be complete by 1877.  The bill, which states that the postal service will operate privately (with 50% of expenses covered by the US government the first 10 years, down to 30% of covered until 1877, and the department eliminated immediately) by 1877.

06-29-1857: President Fillmore finalizes his new Cabinet:

Third Fillmore Cabinet

Vice President: Abraham Lincoln
Secretary of State: Nathaniel Prentice Brooks
Secretary of War: Winfield Scott
Secretary of Navy: Martin Van Buren
Secretary of the Treasury: Rick Paul
Attorney General: John Bell
Postmaster General: department eliminated

09-19-1857: President Fillmore participates in the creation of the Conservative Party of New York, praised by Justice Buckley, who calls the new party "revolutionary."  The new party will cross-endorse or nominate its own candidate, and advocates a platform similar to the policies of the Fillmore administration.

02-13-1858: President Fillmore begins to shore up support for his vice president, Abraham Lincoln to be elected in 1860.  He hopes Lincoln will continue his policies.

01-23-1859: Vice President Lincoln announces his intention to run for President in 1860.  He, along with Seward, are among the favorites for the nomination

02-14-1859: The United States surpasses the Russian Empire to become the third largest economy in the world.

03-21-1858: In a surprise move, Secretary of War Winfield Scott declairs himself a candidate for the Whig nomination.  More minor candidates clear the field for these three heavyweights

04-12-1859: Millard Fillmore has remained silent on his endorsement.  Privately, he favors Lincoln on a personal level but Scott on policy.

05-09-1859: The Whig elders are still unsure of who to nominate.  Gallup releases a poll:

Lincoln vs. Douglas  vs. Breckinridge

()


Lincoln vs. Breckinridge:

234 vs. 69

()

Breckinridge announces that if he does not win the Democratic nomination, he will stage a walkout with all the other delegates at the convention.

Scott vs. Douglas  vs. Breckinridge

()

Scott  vs. Breckinridge

249 vs. 44

()

House of representatives elections, 1858:

Whig: 159 (-15)
Democrat: 58 (+12)
Free Soil: 6 (-4)
Independent: 2 (-/+)
Conservative: 7 (+7)

United States senate elections, 1858:

Whig: 42 (-2)
Democrat: 17 (+1)
Free Soil: 10 (-/+)
Conservative: 1 (+1)

06-11-1860: After the third round of balloting, Lincoln drops out and releases his delegates to Scott.  Scott is also endorsed by Seward.  On the first ballot, Lincoln is unanimously renominated for vice president and Seward is promised a cabinet position of his choice; he picks State.

07-03-1860: The Democratic Convention doesn't go so smoothly.  After 369 rounds of ballotting, John C. Breckinridge and all the other southern delegates walk out of the Democratic convention, and nominate Breckinridge for president and Daniel S. Dickenson for Vice President.  This walkout allows Douglas to claim the Democratic nomination easily.  Herschel V. Johnson of Georgia is nominated for Vice President.

09-21-1860: President Lincoln has been campaigning tirelessly for Scott throughout the nation.  He hasn't stopped riding trains, shaking hands, and kissing babies since the convention in June.  But his efforts are paying off; most polls show Scott ahead of Douglas and Breckinridge by 44-26-20 with the rest undecided.

10-02-1860: Although many believe that Scott is too old for president, a poll taken shows that 74% of voters believe that age should not be an issue for a presidential candidate.

...So Fillmore has taken the Whigs in a Conservative direction, as opposed to the more Progressive direction to normally be expected? After all, the Whigs were the party of the U.S. Bank, internal improvements, government programs, etc. I'm wondering how the Democrats respond ideologically. Will they go the opposite direction of Jackson and Jefferson and begin to support more government programs in order to be in opposition to the newer more Conservative Whigs? Or will the nation in general move to the Right and merely have a "Right-wing party" versus a "less right-wing party"?

Also, this was made before your most recent post. How does the old man Scott win nomination against someone like Lincoln?

10-19-1860: The three candidates for president agree to debate in front of a live audience.  There are many tough questions asked and answered for all three candidates, and the undecided voters mainly flock to Scott and Douglas, because although Breckinridge is a great debator, he appears very angry and comes off as unlikeable and out-of-touch.  The highlight of the debate is when Breckinridge asks angrily, "Old man, what the hell do you think you're doing running for president!  You were too old eight years ago, and your own party didn't even want you!  And another thing-"

Scott had prepared for this, and quickly responded, "Look, I won't make age an issue of this campaign, Johnny.  I will not use, for political purposes, my opponents' youth and inexperience."  Both Douglas and Breckinridge laugh at this, as the audience erupts into laughter and cheers, while Scott calmly sips a glass of water.  Douglas would later write "that moment in the debate was when I knew I had lost the election."

Well Lincoln is basically like Sarah Palin; everyone in the party likes him, but no one really thinks he's ready to be president yet.  Fillmore really was a Whig in name only, so I've had him go the more conservative direction, although there are still both wings in both parties.  Right now the Democrats are ideologically similar to where they were at this time in OTL but the whigs are much conservative then the Republicans were at this stage IOTL.  Because of this, this timeline will be more conservative than our own, therefore presidents like Jefferson and Jackson are seen in very positive light while people like the Adamses are remembered as a crapstain on the underwear of history

Don't be hatin' on the Adamses! >:( I contend that Adams was more Conservative than Jefferson, & I would have gladly supported John Quincy in 1824 ( not sure about 1828). I have a fondness for the gruff New England family, & have developed a resentment towards Jackson, not based on his policies, but the fact my history teacher loves him more than any man should. You got a beef with the Adamses?

Election Night 1860:

Well the Whig candidate, not really to anyone's surprise, has won a landslide election to become the fourteenth president of these United States.  Old fuss n' feathers will enjoy some nice coattails tonight, with the Whigs gaining several seats in both houses of Congress; Speaker Winthrop remains Speaker while Benjamin Wade is replaces as Pres. Pro Tem. by Solomon Foot of Vermont

()

Haha not really a beef, I admire Quincy for his stand against slavery but I contend that someone who calls themself a John Adams conservative belongs in the Vermont Progressive party...unless you consider the immigration policy his dad had haha.  I'm for Jackass all the way!  Actually, I fancy myself as a Crawford man.  I really meant people like Henry Clay, and I couldn't think of any recent historical examples of presidents cuz the POD is in the 1850s and I can't give away future presidents!  But basically Bill Clinton with OTL political beliefs would be considered a mentally ill patient and need to be shot on sight.

I can tell you about another souther governor however will play a big role ITTL...  Oh and the conservative party of new York is like The one In otl...it endorses the most conservative candidate or will run its own if it doesn't like either

03-04-1861: Winfield Scott will remain General-in-Chief/commanding general of the United States armed forces during his tenure as president, as he has announced this evening.  He will prove to be a true citizen politician.  His vice president, however, is becoming increasingly bitter at his current post...

06-12-1861: "That freaking asshole old man.  I lost by ten goddam delegates!  F****ing Fillmore, he didn't even lift a finger for me on the campaign trail..."
- The Abraham Lincoln Diaries

Abe Lincoln Gone Wild


If you had done your research, you would have discovered that the Gallup Organization was founded in 1958. See  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallup_Organization

I did my research; if you had read the entire post I went on to say that I am taking a little creative license and i had only done it because it made my life easier so I could convey popular opinion to you.  ;)  Also Lincoln is basically like Nixon now; he's going off the deep end and will serve at least 12 years as vice president. He is very bitter for Fillmore barely helping him on the campaign trail and blames Fillmore for his loss of the nomination

07-12-1861: Germany holds its first federal elections.  Von Bismarck's independents make slight gains in both the Reichstag and Bundesrat.  Von Bismarck uses his political capital to advocate, with the approval of President Scott, the creation of a Jewish homeland.

08-05-1861: The Conservatives in Cogress make Jack Buckley*, brother of Justice Buckley, their house leader.

09-12-1861: The United States economy is rapidly increasing; with tariff cuts, foreign trade is at a record high.  President Scott calls for additional tariff cuts to secure the current boom in the economy

10-17-1861: The New Jersey General Assembly votes to abolish its national bank.

10-24-1861: The United States Congress approves the budget of 1862, another balanced budget with a surplus of 2.4 million dollars.  The Congress approves a further tariff reduction to 8.5%.  Conservative Leader Buckley helps negotiate with President Scott, and Scott finally relents to further cuts.  Conservatives throughout the nation are very happy with President Scott, and see Speaker Winthrop as a great unifying figure for the Whigs.

12-05-1861: The Conservatives win a narrow majority in the British House of Commons due to the economic downturn and their adoption of a low-tariff platform as well as strengthening Anglo-American relations.  The Earl of Derby is the new Prime Minister

The Cabinet of President Winfield Scott:

President: Winfield Scott
Vice President: Abraham Lincoln *
Secretary of State: William Seward
Secretary of War: Ulysses S. Grant
Secretary of the Navy: John J. Crittenden
Attorney General: Nathaniel P. Brooks
Secretary of the Treasury: Rick Paul *

* Retained from previous administration

"Many were stunned when Crittenden announced he would accept a cabinet appointment; many thought that at 73 years old he would retire.  Those who knew him personally thought he would seek re-election to the senate, but once they heard he would be Secretary of the Navy, they knew this would be the last stop in his political career, for better or for worse...."

The Vast History of American Politics, by James L. Buckley

07-12-1862: The German Empire invades Turkey.  They have the firm backing of the United States, and President Scott sends them military aid.  This begins the German-Ottoman War.

11-17-1862: Constantinople is captured by the Germans, who order the shutdown of Ottoman government.  They immediately seize all territory, while establishing Palestine as a German Protectorate and a Jewish state; this was done mainly due to the forcefullness of Chancellor Otto Von Bismarck.  Within two months Germany will supervise elections to the Reichstag and Bundesrat.  They will elect primarily Independents to both bodies, to the glee of Chancellor Von Bismarck.  A poll by Gallup Deutch shows that 67% of Ottomans approve of the new German rule; this is widely believed to be a result of the taxation and authoritarianism of the old Ottoman government, as well as the economic prosperity brought by Von Bismarck's gentle rule over them.

1-24-1863: Chancellor Von Bismarck meets with Russian tsar Alexander II, who is privately pleased with the new German rule in the middle east.  He was afraid of Ottoman aggression, and is convinced to form a non-aggression pact with Germany, thanks to the charm and wit of his German counterpart.

03-17-1863: At the urging of President Scott and Vice President Lincoln, Congress passes several new Civil Liberties laws, protecting the rights of escaped and freed slaves.  Although several southern Whigs would have prefered a more moderate bill, President Scott convinces them to sign on to it and President Lincoln and Senator Douglas convince enough northern Democrats to sign on to the act.

4-14-1863: The South Carolina legislature narrowly defeats a proposed secession from the Union due to the new civil liberties legislation.  President Scott breathes a sigh of relief, thanful that the union will stay intact.

Does anyone want an update on this?

I just don't know where to go from here, though I might come back to this once I'm finished with my "1960" TL

Alright I'm bringing this old gal back, stay tuned for an update.

FYI if you want to refer to books on history, there's "America: The Last Best Hope" by Reagan Education Secretary William J. Benett. Two volumes, one is Revolution to WWI, the second is WWI to what I assume is the fall of the Soviet Union. It's basically a summarry history of everything & I've used it as a reference on one paper & am using it for another. From what I can tell, it's a good read.

Thanks I'll look into it

4-17-1863:
President Winfield Scott and former President Fillmore meet with Chancellor Otto Von Bismarck in New York City.  Von Bismarck asks for the president's blessing to wage war on the Russian Empire, increasingly assertive of its control of Southeast Asia, the Far East, and the Middle East.  The Iron Man plans to take over Japan, Indochina, and eventually, China, as well as the Arabian peninsula in order to form a "great snake" around the Russian Empire, and "starve the bear" by cutting off all their supplies.  Von Bismarck has full support from France, who recently lost Indochina in the French-Russian Conflicts, and the British Empire, who has been fighting with the Russians for centuries.  After much encouragement by both men, the Iron Man receives President Scott's blessing as the German Eagle screams across Asia and the Pacific.

5-2-1863:
Von Bismarck rams through a formal Declaration of War against the Russian Empire.  The Germans begin to reap the benefits of a long arms and naval buildup, as well as the firm support of Otto Lilienthal's experiments on flight.  Lilienthal's plans will bare fruit in several years, but in the meantime are a great way to bolster patriotism, and thus, support for the war, at home.

7-14-1863:
Germany takes control of the Japanese Islands, three days after securing Korea.  The focus of the war now turns to the jungles of Indochina, and Von Bismarck is seen as a conquering hero by Europe, particularly Germany and Denmark.  Von Bismarck will need this political capital for his next move...

8-29-1863:
Otto Von Bismark lands in Indochina, after the seat of thousands of soldiers on both sides, and the German flag is planted firmly in the ground.  It has taken several weeks of fighting, but Southeast Asia welcomes their German conquerors as liberators after the poor conditions provided by the Tsar, and before that abuse by France.  The French Empire has reached its colonial Zenith, but Germany is just getting started.  Von Bismark has plans to hit China hard and swiftly, providing for a firm stranglehold on Russian trade.  Historians consider this the beginning of a period in the history of the German Empire called "Pax Germana", a great turning point in global history and foreign policy.

10-14-1863:
Germany and Russia sign a peace treaty formally ending the Russian-German War.  The Tsar begins to direct his attention to home, with starvation, unemployment, and poor living conditions running rampant from Siberia to the Bering Straight.  He will need a quick way to bring in money, and so sells America Alaska for $5,000,000.  It is the greatest increase in land mass America has seen since the Lousiana Purchase, and is sold as kicking off one the European colonial invaders once and for all.  American nationalism surges, and many diplomats see America as a rising power in the world.

2-7-1864:
Germany invades Persia, Bulgaria, Serbia, and what's left of Romania.  They bring 200,000 troops and know how to use them, and many of them return home as heroes and valiant conquerors.  Among them is Paul Von Hindenburg, a young solider who is well respected by his peers, who praise him as a great soldier, who does what needs to be done in order to ensure victory.  He begins a quick rise through the ranks, earning his sergeant's stripes within weeks.  Von Bismarck has been planting politicians and spies throughout all these nations, who have worked pro-German rhetoric and anti-Russian sentiment into a frenzy.  The bad economy plaguing the middle east doesn't help, and so the citizens welcome the invaders as liberators, fighting alongside the German armies, helping bolster German ranks.  Von Bismarck has been careful not to grow to ambitious, and has treated their conquered peoples with respect and kindness.  He will have to wait for greater numbers and decides that he will invade China and India when Lilienthal completes his state-funded research, and constructs the first-ever airplane.  He will have to wait a little while, but is a patient man...

5-17-1864:
Pope Pius IX declairs that all priests have the right to marry, as "we in the Catholic Faith profess the importance of the Sacrament of marriage; why do we deny our holiest members the right to participate in this Holy Tradition?"  The Pope's progressivism is far ahead of his time, and though privately he wishes to allow women into the church, he doesn't believe it possible or socially acceptable to do so in his lifetime.

7-19-1864:
The Whig National Convention is in a frenzy, as President Winfield Scott announces his decision not to seek a second term "four years is more than enough for a pot-bellied General like me!"  In truth, however, he is in great condition, losing nearly one hundred pounds, riding his horses daily, and walking nearly thrice per week.  "Old Fuss n' Feathers" will play no small part in his successor, however, as he throws his support behind Vice President Abraham Lincoln, while former President Millard Fillmore campaigns actively for Seward.  Both condemn candidate Hannibal Hamlin as "a Radical" (Scott), and "unworthy of this fine party's nomination" (Fillmore).  Lincoln and Seward are neck-and-neck throughout the first few ballots, but Lincoln offers Seward his assured reappointment as Secretary of State.  Seward withdraws, throwing his weight behind Lincoln, who is easily nominated.  He then selects Sam Houston of Texas as his running mate.

8-2-1864:
With many prominent Democrats attending the Convention, including Chief Justice Stephen Johnson Field, party regulars grow tired after no clear frontrunner appears on the sixty-fourth ballot.  Finally, a candidate emerges: Senator Daniel S. Dickinson of New York.  With the support of moderate Democrats, including former President Van Buren, Stephen Douglas, and Andrew Johnson, he will clinch the nomination, and is paired with Andrew Johnson as his running mate

Thoughts?