Talk Elections

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Very negative. Gah it's horrendous. On the plus side it makes them easy to identify...and ignore.

Very negative. Suit jackets are too big, their pants are baggy and could be hemmed better, their shoes look cheap, and their ties are ugly and not tied properly.

The biggest problem is the lack of different summer and winter uniforms and respect for local climate differences.  If you dress the same on a mission trip to Tuscon in July and Duluth in January, you have a problem.

Are they not allowed to wear overcoats in the winter or cotton/linen suits in the summer?

Better than what most wear, so one must give them credit for that. But goodness, those ties are far too short and those suits horrendously ill-fitting.

Mikado, couldn't a black seersucker, linen, or cotton suit for summer and wool for winter solve the problem? A three button wool suit with a heavy dress shirt, buttoned, would keep you rather warm, and vice versa.

RETROSPECTIVE EDIT: Of course, the most common outfit worn by Mormon missionaries are dark trousers, short-sleeve shirt, and tie, which is peculiar both in the sense that it is, while admirable as an attempt at formality, it is an odd and decidedly unstylish combination, and in that it is a combination worn mostly by Mormon missionaries to such an extent that it serves as a unique identifier. More than once have I seen men on the street who simply give off the impression of being Mormon missionaries-- and almost always are-- before I actively realise it's the particular combination of clothes.

I voted positive, would probably vote neutral now. While from a strictly sartorial perspective it'd clearly be negative (there can be worse), the sentiment is to be appreciated, and, far more importantly, it must be considered that this is a BRTD thread and just what kind of clothes BRTD would have a "very positive" opinion of.

Very. Very. Negative!

Why do they wear ties anyway? I would be significantly far less likely to listen to someone wearing a tie than someone not.

Those guys in the picture don't give two sh**ts about your, BRTD.

If they ever met me they theoretically should, as their goal is to convert me to Mormonism.

Here they do dispense with the jackets and do wear shirt sleeved shirts (these two alterations making the ties look even worse).

Perhaps if you made a big deal about it, they would take the ties off.  My point is they aren't posing for you.

Too late. First impressions are everything. Do you think I'd be so into Jesus Christ now if all Christians preached wearing suits and ties?

Crime #1: the suits are terribly ill-fitting
Crime #2: the ties end should just sit on the belt buckle.

No, because your only concern is being hip.  Lucky for you, being a Christian won't save you, or anyone else, from Hell.

BRTD, you are an HP. Those who lambaste ties and suits are at the vanguard of the destruction of society. They are the hallmarks of civilization, of culture, and you hold a contempt for them matched only by my approbatory fervor. I respect you, but I can never like you as long as that remains your position.

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Now this is an (sartorial) FF.

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And so is this guy HRH The Prince of Wales. It also helps the tailor is called- well, what do you think?

RETROSPECTIVE EDIT:  BRTD's fashion preferences remain inane and ridiculous. I have no recollection as to who the men whose pictures I originally posted were, but I assume the tailor which I refer to is Huntsman, which, as with my adoration of Jon Huntsman, is no longer obvious, a Savile Row tailoring house best known for their one-button jackets.

I instead chose President Obama and the Prince of Wales, two men who clearly have different stylistic senses-- largely informed by personal context-- but are both well dressed. Obama has grown on me, at least in terms of what he wears-- his style exemplifies the conservative business attire worn by white-collar professionals. He sets a good example for what to wear to work. While I am probably a greater fan of the Prince of Wales's fashion sense than Obama's, my own sartorial choices will resemble Obama's far more than they will the PoW's, at least while I'm young and a low-level member of whatever organization I end up working for.

More... expressive "business" attire (the technical yet misleading term is "informal") looks better as one grows older and wiser, Bill Clinton is a very good example of this. Fanciness does not equal formality, which is something I've become more aware of over the years (the bowtie being a good example of this). Trying to dress like the Prince would at best make me a young dandy at best and look as if I was dressed in an old man's clothes at worst. There is a suit for all seasons; they allow for far more diversity than BRTD's band shirts.

I could not agree more with the above post.

I have said before that if I ever go to a church and the pastor is wearing a tie, I'm walking about, period. It is never acceptable. Same thing if I were a Jew going to synagogue and the rabbi was wearing a tie.

...and it's yet another predictably BRTD thread.

Simfan, you remind me of Barney from "How I met your mother".

I love how the one guy's jacket is big enough to be a coat.

The suits are a lot less strange than this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormon_underwear

What are you talking about?

Simfan, I salute you. You are a patriot.

Some of these people have great bow ties, which is my choice of tie: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_bow_tie_wearers

Little man on the first picture in the thread. 'Love' meant in a mocking way, obviously.

Oh. I thought you were unfamiliar with a three piece suit and were referring to my people.

The ties are hideous....well at the very least don't go too well with the suits.

What tie knots do you gents use?  I've evolved beyond the four in hand to the half windsor...though I break out the windsor depending on the type of tie and situation.

Both of their ties are too short.

Seriously why can't they dress normal? I had people proselytize to me in college before and except for the Mormons they were dressed normal and without ties. I've had people hand me pamphlets and talk about Jesus outside Christian hardcore shows before. Obviously no one unironically wears a tie to a Christian hardcore show. Why can't the Mormons dress in a way that would make people more likely to listen to them?

I would like to use these exotic knots, bullmoose, but alas I only know how to tie the four-in-hand one.

That's a uniform, not a fashion style, and by these low standards it is comparatively inoffensive.

Were it a fashion style, obviously it would be hilariously fugly.

They are dressing normal BRTD (though very poorly in their attempts to do so). Normal men, in the western world at least, wear a suit and tie.

Seriously?  I think you're calling 'normal' a rather small segment of the population, lief.. perhaps just the upper-middle class, no?

Well, these days, yes. But that's an unfortunate modern development. Even at the height of the Great Depression, the destitute knew well enough to dress properly:

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I was thinking of making that point. Every man carried himself with dignity in those days, no matter how poor or wealthy. Today a similar state exists, where the wealthy dress as the poor:

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Today the national costume of Americans is the mere jeans-and-tee-shirt, for all men and women, of all classes, and today with our Americanizing globalization, this is becoming the global standard.

What does America export? Garbage.

But on a less philosophical note a man will simply look better in a suit than he will in casual clothes. He becomes more dignified and authoritative. Would you take the President seriously if he wore jeans and tee-shirt at the State of the Union?

Four in hand is pretty solid and is the knot I see others wear most, I still use it on certain types of ties.  Youtube has some decent videos on tie knots...the atlantic knot is...interesting.

I usually go with a Pratt.

What this is, is the outfit of a man who believes both:

(a) it is important to maintain well-defined gender roles and to respect traditional sources of authority, and

(b) actually caring about whether your clothes look good or fit properly is gay.


This combination of beliefs, and thus the approach to dress, are not uniquely Mormon. See for example the following observation of Joe Republic:

Religious attire gets far worse. Who would take a guy dressed like this seriously?
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See, this appeals to me.  The more ridiculously baroque and archaic the costume, the more it appeals to me.

Ties are awesome, BRTD.

I do find the enthusiasm of liberals like Ebowed and Lief for the necktie to be a bit strange.  I'm not bitterly opposed to them, but they mean little or nothing to me, and certainly leave me cold.  The only time I wear them is under the typical duress of special occasions at work.