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Title: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Zioneer on July 15, 2012, 07:43:35 PM I've been hearing about Hungary lately, but I don't know how reliable my info is, so I'm asking this forum. Is Hungary veering off into the far right and semi-fascist end of the political spectrum? What's really going on there?
Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Antonio the Sixth on July 16, 2012, 06:00:33 AM I feel much better when I forget about Hungary. What's happening there is so heartbreaking that living with the thought is just impossible.
Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Zioneer on July 16, 2012, 02:21:11 PM I feel much better when I forget about Hungary. What's happening there is so heartbreaking that living with the thought is just impossible. So it's really awful there, then? Is it Greek levels of far-right insanity? I'd like more info. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Dereich on July 16, 2012, 02:44:35 PM I feel much better when I forget about Hungary. What's happening there is so heartbreaking that living with the thought is just impossible. So it's really awful there, then? Is it Greek levels of far-right insanity? I'd like more info. Consider this a mostly uninformed and short summary, but I believe what happened is that the Hungarian right was elected in a landslide few years ago and have since been whittling away the independence of the judiciary and press, making the country an all around less democratic place. The biggest problem with that, is that the fastest growing potential rival (Jobbik) is WORSE, being a sort of ultra-nationalist, Hungary-for-the-Hungarians, almost neo-nazi party. So, with the only options being frying pan or fire, people aren't too hopeful about the political future there. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Stranger in a strange land on July 16, 2012, 06:38:34 PM I feel much better when I forget about Hungary. What's happening there is so heartbreaking that living with the thought is just impossible. So it's really awful there, then? Is it Greek levels of far-right insanity? I'd like more info. Consider this a mostly uninformed and short summary, but I believe what happened is that the Hungarian right was elected in a landslide few years ago and have since been whittling away the independence of the judiciary and press, making the country an all around less democratic place. The biggest problem with that, is that the fastest growing potential rival (Jobbik) is WORSE, being a sort of ultra-nationalist, Hungary-for-the-Hungarians, almost neo-nazi party. So, with the only options being frying pan or fire, people aren't too hopeful about the political future there. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: greenforest32 on July 16, 2012, 10:01:33 PM I've been hearing about Hungary lately, but I don't know how reliable my info is, so I'm asking this forum. Is Hungary veering off into the far right and semi-fascist end of the political spectrum? What's really going on there? https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=145685.0 Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Velasco on July 17, 2012, 04:58:27 AM Hungary is the most worrying place in Europe these days, even more than Greece. If the European Project fails, it would be a setback: a big one to be sure, but one that could be recovered from in 10-20 years. If Europe slides back to its old pre-World War II ways of racial hatred and ultranationalism, the results for the entire world will be much, much worse. It's always useful looking back in History. In the case of Hungary, the country was ruled by a conservative and authoritarian former admiral of the Austro-Hungarian Navy, Miklós Horthy. He was in office between 1920 and 1944 and was a close ally of Hitler, at least until the course of the war became ugly and the Magyar nation was in the verge of being invaded by the Red Army. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikl%C3%B3s_Horthy The contexts are not exactly the same but it has been pointed by many that the economic crisis and the decadence of Europe are factors that contribute to the surge of authoritarian, ultranationalist, xenophobic and anti democratic feelings in general. PS: Why is that photo posted above? Hungarian girls are better looking for sure. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Yelnoc on July 17, 2012, 11:41:52 AM I know some one who is "hungary".... -snip- No, no Hungary () Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Beet on July 17, 2012, 12:51:55 PM This is certainly unpleasant in a vague way, but it seems like an exaggerated trend. (Although, Hungary of all countries certainly has reason to be expansionistic; there are Hungarian-majority areas just across the border in Serbia and Slovakia and there's also the Szekely exclave in Romania, which is far away but nevertheless dominated by Hungarians). People who are really freaking out need to read the cover of Douglas Adams' Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. For those who don't understand the reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrases_from_The_Hitchhiker%27s_Guide_to_the_Galaxy#Don.27t_Panic Is this supposed to be some kind of a joke? Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Hash on July 17, 2012, 04:09:34 PM Wow, this thread has turned into an unmitigated disaster with Vosem being his typical idiot and clarence continuing to be a troll.
Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Vosem on July 17, 2012, 07:50:18 PM Wow, this thread has turned into an unmitigated disaster with Vosem being his typical idiot and clarence continuing to be a troll. Having read up some more on the situation, I deleted that post. It's still being exaggerated by some people (as I understand, the electoral system remains free, so if people want these laws overturned, they can vote for a party that does that). I'm also not sure I can be called a 'typical idiot' by someone who thinks Stephen Harper is the f**king Antichrist. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Associate Justice PiT on July 17, 2012, 09:11:33 PM It seems to me that far-right parties wield significant influence in many European countries; Hungary is just the most blatant example.
Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Stranger in a strange land on July 17, 2012, 09:33:18 PM Hungary is the most worrying place in Europe these days, even more than Greece. If the European Project fails, it would be a setback: a big one to be sure, but one that could be recovered from in 10-20 years. If Europe slides back to its old pre-World War II ways of racial hatred and ultranationalism, the results for the entire world will be much, much worse. It's always useful looking back in History. In the case of Hungary, the country was ruled by a conservative and authoritarian former admiral of the Austro-Hungarian Navy, Miklós Horthy. He was in office between 1920 and 1944 and was a close ally of Hitler, at least until the course of the war became ugly and the Magyar nation was in the verge of being invaded by the Red Army. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikl%C3%B3s_Horthy The contexts are not exactly the same but it has been pointed by many that the economic crisis and the decadence of Europe are factors that contribute to the surge of authoritarian, ultranationalist, xenophobic and anti democratic feelings in general. PS: Why is that photo posted above? Hungarian girls are better looking for sure. All the more worrying because the analogy goes even further: these guys (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrow_Cross_Party)deposed Horthy when he tried to quit the war. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: LastVoter on July 17, 2012, 10:29:51 PM It seems to me that far-right parties wield significant influence in many European countries; Hungary is just the most blatant example. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Associate Justice PiT on July 18, 2012, 03:21:37 AM It seems to me that far-right parties wield significant influence in many European countries; Hungary is just the most blatant example. Of course, look at the vote tallies of the SVP in Switzerland or the FPO in Austria. My point is that it is a broader issue than most people suggest. Title: Re: What's up with Hungary? Post by: Velasco on July 18, 2012, 08:47:57 AM Hungary is the most worrying place in Europe these days, even more than Greece. If the European Project fails, it would be a setback: a big one to be sure, but one that could be recovered from in 10-20 years. If Europe slides back to its old pre-World War II ways of racial hatred and ultranationalism, the results for the entire world will be much, much worse. Quote All the more worrying because the analogy goes even further: these guys (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrow_Cross_Party)deposed Horthy when he tried to quit the war. Oh, yes I've read something about the Arrow Cross Nazis. Quoting the Wiki: Quote During the Spring and Summer of 1944, more than 400,000 Jews were herded into centralized ghettos and then deported from the Hungarian countryside to death camps by the Nazis, with the willing help of the Hungarian Interior Ministry and its gendarmerie (the csendőrség) – both of whose members had close links to the Arrow Cross. The Jews of Budapest were concentrated into so-called Yellow Star Houses, approximately 2,000 single-building mini-ghettos identified by a yellow Star of David over the entrance.[7] In August 1944, before deportations from Budapest began, Horthy used what influence he had to stop the deportations and force the radical anti-Semites out of the government. As the summer progressed, and the Allied and Soviet armies closed in on central Europe, the ability of the Nazis to devote attention to Hungary's "Jewish Solution" waned. About the "Final Solution" in Hungary is very interesting the reading of 'Fateless' or 'Fatelessness', a short and autobiographic book by Imre Kertesz, Hungarian, Jewish and Nobel Prize. It's really shocking the way that Kertesz relate the inconspicuous sucession of events that finally ends in Buchenwald. Anyways Viktor Orbán seems to be more of the Horthy authoritarian style, without the Austro-Hungarian aristocratic pedigree, of course. Worrying and disgusting in any case and a dangerous symptom of an illness that cross many parts of Europe. There is also a far-right antisemite party called "Hungarian Justice and Life", now extra-parliamentary. I see that there's a previous thread on this subject and this one is absolutely train-wrecked. Also I see that I must pay more attention to the current politics in that country in Central Europe; it's a shame but many of us only notice how beautiful Budapest is. |