Title: City rivalries? Post by: Franknburger on August 13, 2013, 02:28:25 PM There exist a number of established rivalries between larger cities, and I am curious about how they have developed and are maintained.
First a delineation: I don't mean the traditional national anti-Capital sentiment, nor the arrogance of a larger city vis-à-vis a smaller suburb. I also don't mean a rivalry that is only based on sports (the Schalke-Dortmund type for those of you acquainted with German soccer), though sports of course is one of the mechanisms to maintain such a rivalry. Let's start with a few German examples: 1. Run for No.2: Hamburg-Munich (of course enhanced by religion, geographic and cultural distance, etc.) 2. Economic vs. political regional centre: Leipzig-Dresden, Lübeck-Kiel 3. Historical discrimination (that's an interesting pattern I only came across after some research): Cologne-Düsseldorf. Cologne used to have the trade monopoly on the Rhine, meaning trade ships by-passed nearby Düsseldorf. When industrialisation set in, however, Düsseldorf took over. Moreover, when Prussia gained possession of the Rhineland, they selected Düsseldorf as provincial capital, deeply hurting Cologne's pride (Roman founding, largest German city throughout the middle-ages). So, what city rivalries exist in your country/state? How have they developed? Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Gass3268 on August 15, 2013, 05:03:08 PM A couple I can think of off the top of my head:
New York-Chicago Alberta-Edmonton Toronto-Montreal Los Angeles-San Francisco Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Sol on August 15, 2013, 05:12:57 PM Chapel Hill-Durham-Raleigh
(Most pronounced in College football). Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: RedSLC on August 15, 2013, 05:29:48 PM Within Utah, Salt Lake City-Provo. Like the above example, most pronounced in college football. (University of Utah for SLC, BYU for Provo.)
Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: bedstuy on August 15, 2013, 06:13:36 PM A couple I can think of off the top of my head: New York-Chicago Alberta-Edmonton Toronto-Montreal Los Angeles-San Francisco News to me. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Enderman on August 15, 2013, 06:27:02 PM A few I can note:
Milwaukee-Chicago, or Green Bay-Chicago, (Packers v Bears) Detroit-Toledo (actually all of Michigan against Toledo) Orlando-Tampa is a possible one, if not, Orlando-Miami Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Snowstalker Mk. II on August 15, 2013, 06:53:31 PM Philly and Pittsburgh, of course (primarily in sports)
Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Napoleon on August 15, 2013, 06:57:06 PM New York-Boston
New York-Los Angeles Los Angeles-San Francisco Cleveland-Pittsburgh Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: old timey villain on August 15, 2013, 07:24:51 PM on citydata forum there's apparently a big rivalry between Atlanta and Charlotte. Everyone in Charlotte thinks Atlanta is on the decline and Charlotte will take its place as king of the south, and everybody in Atlanta thinks Charlotte is a pathetic ATL wannabe with a superiority complex.
There's pages and pages of people fighting about it. It's hilarious because I was not aware this rivalry existed http://www.city-data.com/forum/charlotte/1490417-atlanta-vs-charlotte.html http://www.city-data.com/forum/atlanta/1457447-atlanta-vs-charlotte-king-south.html Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Smid on August 16, 2013, 12:39:15 AM Sydney vs the rest of Australia.
Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: HansOslo on August 16, 2013, 12:47:40 AM Oslo vs the rest of Norway
Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Gass3268 on August 16, 2013, 01:25:14 AM A couple I can think of off the top of my head: New York-Chicago Alberta-Edmonton Toronto-Montreal Los Angeles-San Francisco News to me. I think that is more of a Chicago view point. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Ban my account ffs! on August 16, 2013, 03:10:55 AM There's an intense rivalry between Minneapolis and Portland regarding cyclists.
There's also an old rivalry between Minneapolis and St. Paul... though at this point St. Paul has become a glorified suburb. People are always like "but St. Paul such nice historic architecture downtown"... Yeah.. because people wanted to build bigger and better buildings in downtown Minneapolis. Nobody wants to build in downtown St. Paul... so they spin it into "yeah we preserve our historic buildings" The two cities used to actually compete for having the biggest/tallest/best downtown... but now it's kinda pathetic () () Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: traininthedistance on August 16, 2013, 01:08:56 PM New York is above considering any American city its worthy rival. :P
Boston probably comes closest, because of the Red Sox and Patriots, and Philly a clear but distant second on the sports front. If you're talking about more incohate cultural factors, I would say DC and San Fran actually loom much larger in our eyes than LA and Chicago. LA is not really what we would consider a "city", and Chicago is just that odd place that operates under the collective delusion that upside-down tomato casserole is somehow "pizza", which of course it is not. ... When I lived in Philly, we definitely considered NYC to be our main rival in everything. Pittsburgh was mostly an afterthought, except when it came to hockey I guess. And upside-down tomato casserole was still, of course, an object of well-deserved derision. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck on August 17, 2013, 10:06:42 AM New York vs. Boston
New York vs. Philadelphia Philadelphia vs. Pittsburgh Cleveland vs. Cincinnati Baltimore vs. Washington D.C. Tampa Bay vs. Miami Houston vs. Dallas Chicago vs. Detroit Milwaukee vs. Chicago Toronto vs. Montreal St. Louis vs. Kansas City San Francisco vs. Los Angeles Los Angeles vs. Anaheim Seattle vs. Portland Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: jimrtex on August 17, 2013, 10:32:11 PM New York vs. Boston New York vs. Philadelphia Philadelphia vs. Pittsburgh Cleveland vs. Cincinnati Baltimore vs. Washington D.C. Tampa Bay vs. Miami Houston vs. Dallas Chicago vs. Detroit Milwaukee vs. Chicago Toronto vs. Montreal St. Louis vs. Kansas City San Francisco vs. Los Angeles Los Angeles vs. Anaheim Seattle vs. Portland Midland v Odessa Texas City v Lamarque Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Ban my account ffs! on August 20, 2013, 02:06:08 AM New York is above considering any American city its worthy rival. :P Boston probably comes closest, because of the Red Sox and Patriots, and Philly a clear but distant second on the sports front. If you're talking about more incohate cultural factors, I would say DC and San Fran actually loom much larger in our eyes than LA and Chicago. LA is not really what we would consider a "city", and Chicago is just that odd place that operates under the collective delusion that upside-down tomato casserole is somehow "pizza", which of course it is not. ... When I lived in Philly, we definitely considered NYC to be our main rival in everything. Pittsburgh was mostly an afterthought, except when it came to hockey I guess. And upside-down tomato casserole was still, of course, an object of well-deserved derision. And yet Chicago is so much more American than New York.. which is increasingly unique... and unrepresentative of the nation as a whole. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: SUSAN CRUSHBONE on August 20, 2013, 06:30:51 AM There exist a number of established rivalries between larger cities, and I am curious about how they have developed and are maintained. First a delineation: I don't mean the traditional national anti-Capital sentiment, nor the arrogance of a larger city vis-à-vis a smaller suburb. I also don't mean a rivalry that is only based on sports (the Schalke-Dortmund type for those of you acquainted with German soccer), though sports of course is one of the mechanisms to maintain such a rivalry. Let's start with a few German examples: 1. Run for No.2: Hamburg-Munich (of course enhanced by religion, geographic and cultural distance, etc.) 2. Economic vs. political regional centre: Leipzig-Dresden, Lübeck-Kiel 3. Historical discrimination (that's an interesting pattern I only came across after some research): Cologne-Düsseldorf. Cologne used to have the trade monopoly on the Rhine, meaning trade ships by-passed nearby Düsseldorf. When industrialisation set in, however, Düsseldorf took over. Moreover, when Prussia gained possession of the Rhineland, they selected Düsseldorf as provincial capital, deeply hurting Cologne's pride (Roman founding, largest German city throughout the middle-ages). Don't forget Karlsruhe/Mannheim (category 1) and Bruchsal/Schwetzingen! :) Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: traininthedistance on August 20, 2013, 07:19:16 AM New York is above considering any American city its worthy rival. :P Boston probably comes closest, because of the Red Sox and Patriots, and Philly a clear but distant second on the sports front. If you're talking about more incohate cultural factors, I would say DC and San Fran actually loom much larger in our eyes than LA and Chicago. LA is not really what we would consider a "city", and Chicago is just that odd place that operates under the collective delusion that upside-down tomato casserole is somehow "pizza", which of course it is not. ... When I lived in Philly, we definitely considered NYC to be our main rival in everything. Pittsburgh was mostly an afterthought, except when it came to hockey I guess. And upside-down tomato casserole was still, of course, an object of well-deserved derision. And yet Chicago is so much more American than New York.. which is increasingly unique... and unrepresentative of the nation as a whole. Are you really trying to play the "Real American" card here? For shame. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Brittain33 on August 20, 2013, 10:19:03 AM Newark vs. Jersey City
Rochester vs. Buffalo Phoenix vs. Tucson Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: memphis on August 20, 2013, 12:39:43 PM Memphis v Nashville. Same state, different worlds. Memphis is ghetto Deep South blues. Nashville is white trash Country rhinestones. They're growing way faster and they can have it. I don't want to be the next Atlanta. We're in the Goldilocks zone for size, as far as I'm concerned.
Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: ilikeverin on August 20, 2013, 12:49:23 PM A couple I can think of off the top of my head: New York-Chicago Alberta-Edmonton Toronto-Montreal Los Angeles-San Francisco News to me. I think that is more of a Chicago view point. Yes. You must not have been to the coasts much - they have no idea that the Midwest exists. (They will grudgingly concede Chicago exists after some prodding.) Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Dave from Michigan on August 20, 2013, 03:34:48 PM Chicago vs Detroit. mostly sports but also a city rivalry. Chicago is a popular place to visit for vacations for people from Michigan. I have been to Chicago at least 5 times for weekend trips. Metro Detroit also loses people like college grads to Chicago, since it is the nearest big city. Also people look at Chicago when talking about fixing Detroit or what Detroit needs to do to comeback. I'm sure this is a one sided rivalry especially for the non sports part because Chicago is looking at New York. Don't laugh at Detroit one day it will comeback it's starting right now on a small level.
Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Franknburger on August 20, 2013, 07:13:55 PM Oslo vs the rest of Norway Does not count. Nobody likes capitals (Paris vs. rest of France, Rome vs. rest of Italy, Athens vs. rest of Greece etc.), while the capitals don't care. What about Bergen-Trondheim? New York is above considering any American city its worthy rival. :P Memphis v Nashville. Same state, different worlds. Memphis is ghetto Deep South blues. Nashville is white trash Country rhinestones. They're growing way faster and they can have it. I don't want to be the next Atlanta. We're in the Goldilocks zone for size, as far as I'm concerned. Stephenville vs. Brownwood Midland v Odessa Texas City v Lamarque A few more cases that caught my attention and interest, because they were new to me, and/or might provide interesting case studies: Alberta-Edmonton Rochester vs. Buffalo St. Louis vs. Kansas City Philadelphia vs. Pittsburgh Cleveland vs. Cincinnati Houston vs. Dallas Seattle vs. Portland .. and of course Karlsruhe/Mannheim (first time I have ever heard of it) Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: traininthedistance on August 21, 2013, 12:08:28 AM New York is above considering any American city its worthy rival. :P Especially not Los Angeles. I was being less than completely serious with that remark, but even so there are at least five different cities I'd think of before them (Boston, Philly, DC, SF, and, yes, Chicago). Boston and DC are probably our "closest" rivals depending on the context, which of course makes the former-Philly-resident in me quite sad. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: Ban my account ffs! on August 21, 2013, 12:53:05 AM New York is above considering any American city its worthy rival. :P Boston probably comes closest, because of the Red Sox and Patriots, and Philly a clear but distant second on the sports front. If you're talking about more incohate cultural factors, I would say DC and San Fran actually loom much larger in our eyes than LA and Chicago. LA is not really what we would consider a "city", and Chicago is just that odd place that operates under the collective delusion that upside-down tomato casserole is somehow "pizza", which of course it is not. ... When I lived in Philly, we definitely considered NYC to be our main rival in everything. Pittsburgh was mostly an afterthought, except when it came to hockey I guess. And upside-down tomato casserole was still, of course, an object of well-deserved derision. And yet Chicago is so much more American than New York.. which is increasingly unique... and unrepresentative of the nation as a whole. Are you really trying to play the "Real American" card here? For shame. Title: Re: City rivalries? Post by: TJ in Oregon on August 23, 2013, 08:41:05 PM Cleveland vs. Cincinnati The only one who thinks Cleveland vs. Cincinnati is a rivalry is MLB. No one in either city has the slightest issue with the other winning, in fact we tend to root for each other against anyone else. Cleveland and Cincinnati view each other like brothers, maybe there's some excitement of playing each other but I wouldn't really call it a rivalry. Now Cleveland-Pittsburgh on the other hand, we're out for blood ;). |