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60976  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Who would you have voted for? on: November 16, 2004, 10:54:55 pm
McCarthy/McGovern
60977  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Religious preference on Atlas on: November 16, 2004, 10:51:08 pm
and you basis on that claim?
60978  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Religious preference on Atlas on: November 16, 2004, 10:43:07 pm
Lutheran, although I think that's too broad of a term since I belong to the liberal ELCA denomination, which is nothing at all like the ultra-conservative WELS denomination.
60979  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / U.S. Presidential Election Results / Re: All the presidents of the 20th century ranked from furthest left to right on: November 16, 2004, 07:02:23 pm
Come on people! Wilson saw to it that the Espionage and Sedition Acts were passed--they make the Patriot Act look good. He also endorsed the ultra-racist movie "Birth of a Nation" and called it historically accurate.

The Espionage and Sedition acts were good ideas. I liked them. Also, "Birth of a Nation" was a landmark movie and set in course the development for ALL modern movies. Certainly one of the greatest movies in all of cinematic history.

why were they good ideas? I suspect you wouldn't be too fond of them if Lincoln implemented them.
60980  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / U.S. Presidential Election Results / Re: Bellwether Counties on: November 16, 2004, 07:01:25 pm
Big Bellwethers
These counties had more than 100,000 total votes in 2000.

EV Leaders
Since 1964: Buncombe, NC (Asheville).
Since 1972: Stanislaus, CA (Modesto); and Bexar, TX (San Antonio).
Since 1980: San Bernadino, CA (San Bernadino); San Joaquin, CA (Stockton); Ventura, CA (Los Angeles suburb); Clackamas, OR (Portland suburb); DuPage, IL (Chicago suburb); Winnebago, IL (Rockford); Spokane, WA (Spokane).

PV Leaders
Since 1964: Pasco. FL (Tampa suburb).
Since 1980: Pinellas, FL (St Petersburg); St Joseph, IN (South Bend); Caddo, LA (Shreveport); Rockland, NY (New York suburb).

If Nixon is considered to have won the PV in 1960, then Pasco County's streak began in 1928, when the turnout was 2,932.  In 2004, the turnout was 190,866, a 65-fold increase.

why is DuPage on there? It voted against Clinton both times.
60981  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Who would you have voted for in...? on: November 16, 2004, 01:53:11 pm
I don't really know enough up to 32, but:

'32-FDR (D)
'36-FDR (D)
'40-FDR (D)
'44-FDR (D)
'48-Truman (D)
'52-Truman (D)
'56-Stevenson (D) w. hindsight-Eisenhower (R)
'60-JFK (D)
'64-Ugh...LBJ (D)
'68-HHH (D)
'72-McGovern (D)
'76-Carter (D)
'80-Anderson (I)
'84-Reagan (R)
'88-Dukakis (D)
'92-Clinton (D)
'96-Clinton (D)
'00-Gore (D)
'04-Kerry (D)

Truman didn't run again in '52. That was also Stevenson vs. Eisenhower.
60982  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Racial origin on Atlas on: November 16, 2004, 01:10:53 am
which of these does Scandinavian fall under?
60983  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Will the Democrats fillibuster pro-life Supreme Court appointments? on: November 15, 2004, 10:30:39 pm
If he was radically out of the mainstream then that is another matter entirely.

Post number 666!

that's all they filibustered so far, with the possible exception of Estrada, but the problem with him was that he answered very few of the questions he was asked by the committee.
60984  Election Archive / 2008 Elections / Re: What is the most likely Democrat - Republican face-off in 2008? on: November 15, 2004, 10:10:21 pm
forget the positions? that defines an ideology.

what was so crazy about what he said? he simply opposed the Iraq invasion, and that got him written off as some pacifistic dove about the same level as Kucinich. But he was from that. And there was nothing extreme about his governor record. If he was such an extremist why didn't he govern that way?
60985  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Who would you have voted for in...? on: November 15, 2004, 09:44:55 pm
Dewey was too "progressive" and Truman didn't handle the Korean War successfully.

Pretty much the exact same for 1968, a bad wartime president and a liberal GOP candidate.

well you would've voted for both Dewey and Nixon on their previous runs.
60986  Election Archive / 2008 Elections / Re: What is the most likely Democrat - Republican face-off in 2008? on: November 15, 2004, 02:04:07 pm
Actually, this year they picked a standard leftist who sounded right as opposed to a radical Leftist (Dean was the ideological equivalent of Reverend Pat Robertson). Kerry did move to the center, like Bush, for the election; but a real democratic moderate is a different animal.

false, Dean was a moderate and to the right of Kerry. His record as governor was from radical. He simply got stereotyped as a radical leftist because of a few positions and that he had rather angry speeches, but his actual record is far from extreme.
60987  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Who would you have voted for in...? on: November 15, 2004, 01:55:44 pm
He was an imperialistic corporatist.
60988  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Who would you have voted for in...? on: November 15, 2004, 01:24:04 pm
1948 Thurmond
1968 Wallace

um, why? and Fillmore in 1856? Didn't you say you were Catholic? You realize his party's whole platform was basically anti-Catholicsm?

for me:

1824 Clay
1828 Jackson, with hindsight Adams
1832 Wirt
1836 Van Buren
1840 Van Buren
1844 Clay
1848 Cass
1852 Hale
1856 Fremont
1860 Lincoln
1864 Linclon
1868 Grant
1872 Grant
1876 Hayes
1880 Garfield
1884 Blaine
1888 Harrison
1892 Weaver
1896 Bryan
1900 Bryan
1904 T. Roosevelt
1908 Bryan
1912 T. Roosevelt
1916 Wilson, with hindsight Benson
1920 Debs, assuming I wasn't imprisoned by A. Mitchell Palmer
1924 LaFollette
1928 Smith
1932 FDR
1936 FDR
1940 FDR
1944 FDR
1948 Truman
1952 toss up, probably Ike because the country did need a change and Truman was doing poorly at that point
1956 another toss up (last election between two EXCELLENT candidates), I'll go with Stevenson for variety
1960 JFK
1964 LBJ, with hindsight Hass or DeBerry
1968 Humphrey
1972 McGovern
1976 Carter
1980 Carter
1984 Mondale
1988 Dukakis
1992 Clinton
1996 Clinton
2000 Gore
2004 Kerry

so I would've basically very reluctantly been a Democrat until the Civil War just because the Whigs were chumps, then a Republican from then until the turn of the century although this is mostly because of anti-South partisanship. After Bryan took on that fascist McKinley I would've become an independent or swing voter progressive Republican. And when FDR came around I would've been a solid Democrat since, with the possible exception of voting for Ike.
60989  General Discussion / Religion & Philosophy / Re: Would you consider this person an evangelical? on: November 15, 2004, 12:29:04 pm
I have a confession to make. The guy's name isn't Steve, it's George. He was born in Connecticut, moved to Texas, and now he lives in Washington D.C.(1600 Pennsylvania Ave. to be exact).

Still think he isn't evangelical?

you never mentioned that he claims to be a born again.
60990  Questions and Answers / Electoral Reform / Re: None of the Above option on: November 14, 2004, 08:48:35 pm
I think every state should have something like that in Nevada though, just so you can abstain and at least let your abstaintion be counted to send the message. In Oklahoma for example, the only two candidates on the ballot were Bush and Kerry, and write-ins aren't allowed. You can just not check the box, but this way at least it's more visible.
60991  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Presidential Election Trends / Re: Could this ever happen again? on: November 14, 2004, 07:45:26 pm
Giuliani vs. some southern Dem?

Zell Miller would take both Mass and Miss, but he would also take many more states than the ones you have the dem winning.

actually, that's the map Tweed gave when I asked what would happen in Zell Miller vs. John McCain awhile ago, except of course with DC, Hawaii and Alaska added, DC going Dem, the other two Republican.

However, I don't think Zell Miller would win MA or RI.
60992  General Discussion / Religion & Philosophy / Re: Would you consider this person an evangelical? on: November 14, 2004, 06:19:55 pm
Yes.  According to the Left, all Christians who are serious are evangelical, racist wackos, regardless of their veiws on tollerance or their denomination.

p.s. I don't think that evangelical is a bad word or an insult, but it has basically become one.

AHAHAHAHAHA, thanks for the laugh. I guess my left wing extremist self must consider myself an evangelical racist wacko.

to answer the question: no
60993  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2004 U.S. Presidential Election Results / Teton county, Wyoming on: November 14, 2004, 01:13:32 am
why'd it flip? It went from going to Bush in 2000 by almost 14 points with Nader taking about 7, still a healthy margin with Nader added in, to going to Kerry by over 7 points, quite a shift. And even though it voted for Clinton both times, he didn't win it by much and Perot was probably the reason. And prior to that it voted Republican in every election as far back as the free results go, including 1964. what's happening with this place?
60994  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2004 U.S. Presidential Election Results / Re: What happened? on: November 14, 2004, 01:07:16 am
BTW this topic is basically about, how did all these counties become Republican?

um, because it was a landslide year?

1960 or 1968 would be better examples if you wanted to show a shift...
60995  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2004 U.S. Presidential Election Results / Re: Battleground to safe and vice versa. on: November 14, 2004, 01:04:35 am
Iowa
2004: Tossup
2008: Tossup-Weak Republican
Trend: The progressive midwest is disappearing, but not overnight. Iowa is moving faster than much of it, but the results were closer in 2004 than the polls had it out to be.

Actually, Iowa trended Dem if you look at the national average, Bush won it by less than a point which is less than his national average, in 2000 Iowa actually voted Republican in comparison to the national average because Gore's margin of victory there was smaller than it was nationwide. I would put Iowa as slowly trending Dem, and while this might end soon, it won't be weak Republican in 2008, either a total tossup or possibly even weak Democrat.

As for Virginia, it is trending Dem still based on the results, just slower than originally expected. And flipping Fairfax county actually is major progress. But probably still at least one more cycle before it's a true swing state.
60996  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Fun election using preferential voting on: November 13, 2004, 11:01:02 pm
my rankings:

1-BRTD
2-Eugene Debs
3-George McGovern
4-IrishDem
5-FDR
6-Allyson Schwartz
7-Howard Dean
8-John Kerry
9-Lucky the Dog
10-Ross Perot
11-Melissa Brown
12-Barry Goldwater
13-Lyndon LaRouche
14-Keystone Phil
15-George Wallace
16-Rick Santorum
17-Philip
18-AuH2O
19-David Duke
20-Ralph Nader
60997  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Fun election using preferential voting on: November 13, 2004, 10:54:38 pm
the candidates are:

BRTD
AuH2O
Allyson Schwartz
Keystone Phil
IrishDem
Melissa Brown
Rick Santorum
Philip
David Duke
Barry Goldwater
FDR
Ralph Nader
John Kerry
Lyndon LaRouche
George McGovern
Ross Perot
Eugene Debs
Howard Dean
George Wallace
Lucky the Dog

go rank them.
60998  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: 2nd most liberal state after Massachusetts on: November 13, 2004, 09:30:37 pm
Neither Massachusetts or RI are really that liberal, just very partisan Democrat. I'd vote Vermont as the most liberal state period.
60999  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Most Libertarian Senator on: November 13, 2004, 09:29:29 pm
President: Grover Cleveland or Calvin Coolidge
Senator: Susan Collins
Governor: Don't know out of current, but if Gary Johnson was still in in New Mexico he'd win hands down.
61000  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Lyndon Johnson vs. Barry Goldwater on: November 13, 2004, 09:25:36 pm
Johnson wasn't a communist. If he was things would be much better since he would've completely withdrew from Vietnam, much like I wold.

in 1964 without hindsight I would've voted LBJ. With hindsight I would've voted Eric Hass (Socialist Labor)
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