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July 24, 2014, 07:03:16 am
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News: Don't forget to get your 2013 Gubernatorial Endorsements and Predictions in!

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1  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Should Bushoklahoma join Atlasia? on: Today at 06:46:47 am
Sorry guys but the last thing that he needs to do is get roped into that nonsense. Watching another 12 hours of baseball would be a better use of his time.

We actually agree on something relating to Bushie/the Update.  Who knew Tongue

I can see this producing entertaining results, but it can't possibly end well for him or the board.
2  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Gubernatorial/Statewide Elections / Re: New York Governor- 2014- Astornio vs Cuomo on: July 23, 2014, 07:29:14 pm
Isn't Liu corrupt?

No, but his campaign treasurer was.
3  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1924 on: July 23, 2014, 06:00:19 pm
Underwood/Wheeler! Keep in mind that Underwood dies in January 1929, so we can't have him ever again if we elect Wheeler.

D[inks], I wish I thought of that before voting Sad
4  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1924 on: July 23, 2014, 05:48:21 pm
Voted for Underwood because I like him even if I oppose all of his proposals Tongue. I will support Coolidge in the general election.

Even if Underwood is the nominee? Sad
5  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1924 on: July 23, 2014, 04:30:52 pm
Senator Burton K. Wheeler/Former President Oscar Underwood
6  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Gubernatorial/Statewide Elections / Re: New York Governor- 2014- Astornio vs Cuomo on: July 23, 2014, 04:27:22 pm

He hasn't endorsed yet. Also worth noting that the "Working Families" Party has backed away from Liu/Koppell too.

As far as I'm concerned, de Blasio is a Republican now too. He can be Bernie f***ing Sanders for the rest of his term - if you support Jeff Klein or Tony Avella, you have no place in the Democratic Party.

I wouldn't worry too much about DeBlasio no longer being the great hope of liberals over this. He's clearly supporting them as part of a deal to make the state senate Democratic and help redistricting. Later he can tell them to pound salt when there's a solid majority in the senate.

Are Klein or Avella in any serious danger of a primary anyway?

Klein is looking in pretty good shape thanks to the WF party and some unions lacking any semblance of a backbone.  Avella could very well be toast though Smiley
7  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: "Where've You Gone, General Washington?" - Participatory Election Series on: July 23, 2014, 04:22:22 pm
I vote that ITTL teddy bears are called iggy bears, after Pres. Donnelly. Also reminder to y'all that Cuba and Hispaniola are the territory of Atlantis.

Seconded!
8  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1924 on: July 23, 2014, 04:20:59 pm
Coolidge completely unopposed after passing prohibition? Lame.

The Unionists are quite supportive of inconsistently enforced prohibition Tongue
9  General Politics / Individual Politics / 1924 on: July 23, 2014, 04:13:38 pm
I'll give you the bullet point/abridged version for now because I'm hungry and haven't eaten all day b/c of work.  It'll be edited a bit later...maybe.  Btw, remember to include your VP choices (unless you are a Unionist, in which case, we're operating on the honor system). 

- Calvin Coolidge continued his predecessors proud tradition of never giving a state of the union address

- The Farmer-Labor Party and the Populists merged to form the Worker's Party after the "Disaster of '20"

- Economically, Coolidge is essentially the same as IRL, except he also tried and failed to get a constitutional amendment repealing the income tax passed.  Coolidge quickly withdrew the U.S. from the League of Nations causing the whole thing to fall apart.  RIP Europe!

- Because Louisiana didn't secede in Civil War 2: Electric Boogaloo, New Orleans has replaced Atlanta as the most prosperous city in the South.  Coolidge has proven a solid if somewhat risk averse supporter of civil rights and worked with former President Underwood in the latter's failed attempt to get anti-lynching legislation through Congress.  Reconstruction has once again gone surprisingly well and only Mississippi, South Carolina, and Texas have yet to be readmitted to the Union.

- Coolidge and the Unionists enacted prohibition and harsh immigration restrictions in order to get Southern and Western WPers to agree to vote for his income tax cuts and not to bitch about reconstruction any more than necessary to get re-elected (which is still quite a bit in the case of the former Tongue ).  Hooray for organized crime!

- Overall, Coolidge is regarded by most Americans as a rather successful if boring chief executive.  There was never any teapot dome scandal and Vice-President Warren Harding died in office.  Coolidge is unopposed at the Unionist Convention.  The real race is for Vice-President after Harding died, since Coolidge only picked former Vice-President John Weeks of MA as a place-holder and wanted to create some excitement on the convention floor so people wouldn't make him give a speech Tongue
__________________________________________________

Unionist Vice-Presidential Candidates:
New York Senator James W. Wadsworth is from the crucial state of New York, a small government man, the definition of economic right-winger, but he also opposes Coolidge's reconstruction policies as "radical big government interventionism" and worrying phrases like "state's rights" have a way of slipping into his speeches on civil rights.  There is arch-racist Indiana Senator James E. Watson who would help in the crucial swing states in the upper South like Virginia and Tennessee while bringing Midwestern appeal.  On the flip-side, IRL he was a proud Klansman back in the day.  There is Budget Director Charles Dawes of Illinois who hates Indians and has all the charm and warmth of Joseph Cannon (i.e. everyone hates him because he's an unlikable prick).  Commerce Secretary Herbert Hoover is extremely pro-big business, the choice of the party bosses, and is reasonably popular, but the West is also a WP stronghold so would he really help that much?  Missouri Governor Arthur Hyde is from the right part of the country, overall a solid economic conservative, and provides ideological balance.  Then again, he also supports women's suffrage, environmentalism, the income tax and yucky stuff like that.  Lastly, there is Coolidge's personal choice: Former Iowa Senator William Kenyon.  However, he is considered a UINO by most other Unionists and is probably far to economically progressive to win the Vice-Presidential nomination.
______________________________________________________

The Worker's Party:

The Worker's Alliance has many options.  Naturally, Senator Carter Glass is running again (he makes a better Harold Stassen than Harold Stassen Tongue ).  On to the serious candidates!  The convention is currently deadlocked between the two frontrunners: Former President Oscar Underwood is running again, this time on a platform focusing on creating an inheritance tax, raising the income tax, universal healthcare, repealing prohibition, and banning lynching.  The other frontrunner is MD Governor Albert Ritchie and he is running on fighting corruption, giving women the vote, and repealing prohibition, but he's always going off about state's rights and we all know what that means...  Everyone else is a dark horse hoping the delegates decide "screw it, let's just pick neither of the front-runners and GTFOH." 

Nebraska Governor Charles W. Bryan is all like "Look at me, I'm Stephen Baldwin to my brother's Alec Baldwin.  Wait, that wasn't what I meant Sad "  Arkansas Senator Joseph T. Robinson is basically "look at me, I'm a racist Southerner who doesn't go around saying stupid sh**t, also I'm an interventionist on foreign policy and support prohibition."  Former Ohio Governor James Cox is running because surely the party that nominated Eugene Debs three times will go with the Moderate Hero Tongue  Indiana Senator Samuel Ralston wants to have universal healthcare and has promised to deport all those awful Catholics back to Catholistan or wherever they came from.  Oklahoma Senator Robert L. Owen is running because f*** child labor, that's why!  Virginia Senator Matthew A. Neely is running on D.C. statehood and shockingly supports civil rights.  Montana Senator Burton K. Wheeler supports full equal rights for blacks, women, and indians, loves unions, and has promised to drop out if the Bull Meese nominate LaFollette.  Lastly, Michigan Senator Woolbridge Ferris wants to create a Department of Education (yes, that really was the issue he based his single-issue presidential campaign on in 1924).
_________________________________________________________________

Bull-Meese:

There is California Senator Hiram Johnson and Senate Minority Leader Robert LaFollette...again.  Former Illinois Governor Frank Lowden wants to see if they'll nominate him now that he doesn't hold elected office anymore.  Massachusetts Senator David I. Walsh is running on "muh isolationism" and "muh economic progressivism."  He is also quite fond of comparing Unionists to Klansman and Bolsheviks Tongue  Iowa Senator Smith L. Brookhart really wants to bust the trusts and doesn't realize he's the new Albert Cummins.  New York Governor Alfred E. Smith is running on economic conservatism, repealing prohibition, and repealing Coolidge's immigration restrictions.  General "Black Jack" Pershing is easily the greatest hero of the second Civil War, but he's been disturbingly vague about what he actually believes and is rumored to have both Unionist and WP sympathies Tongue  Lastly, Pennsylvania Governor Gifford Pinochet supports prohibition and is running mainly on conservationism.

26 options, it is your choose...
10  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: "Where've You Gone, General Washington?" - Participatory Election Series on: July 23, 2014, 10:58:04 am
I will if/when work permits.

You can just use the text of that PM you sent me as the body of the thing and then just slog through all that horrible code for the actual poll.

I should be able to do it.  Could you send me the PM I sent you where I described Coolidge's presidency?  I don't have a copy of it.
11  Forum Community / Off-topic Board / Re: Homeland on: July 23, 2014, 06:22:14 am
Season 1 was great although a bit over-rated (I don't mean that as a knock on the season in any way, it simply did far better than it should've at the emmys, although oddly enough, the best actor on the show was the one who didn't get nominated Tongue ).  Season 2 was disappointing and pretty uneven (if season 1 was the Trinity Killer Season of Dexter than this was the season with that random religious nut + Tom Hank's son).  Season 3 was basically a really, really bad season of 24, but without Kiefer Sutherland's consistently excellent performance (disclaimer, I quit watching mid-way through season three).  I would only recommend season 1 and would argue it would've been better if they just made the first season a miniseries or something.
12  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Gubernatorial/Statewide Elections / Re: New York Governor- 2014- Astornio vs Cuomo on: July 23, 2014, 05:31:46 am
Christie rejected Astorino's play for more money.

Because, like I said, with Democrats like Cuomo, who needs Republicans?

I somehow think it has more to do with the fact Christie realizes Astorino doesn't have a shot in hell.

Quote

Does anyone really think he'd be there if Havenstein was running for Governor of Vermont and faced the same odds.
13  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: "Where've You Gone, General Washington?" - Participatory Election Series on: July 23, 2014, 05:21:09 am
I will if/when work permits.
14  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of Washington/West Virginia Senators on: July 22, 2014, 09:18:36 pm
All FFs, especially Manchin and Murray
15  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Has the forum been better since Inks was demodded? on: July 22, 2014, 05:45:50 pm
Nope.
16  Questions and Answers / The Atlas / Re: Petition to ban Snowstalker from posting in International General Discussion on: July 22, 2014, 05:43:14 pm
Why, so every thread can be a circlejerk about how terrible the Russians are and how great Israel is?

Roll Eyes
17  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: The Present Israel-Palestine Conflict Thread on: July 22, 2014, 03:42:27 pm
Israel's actions in the Gaza strip aren't surprising or shocking in the least. They have a clear cut casus belli and Hamas should be punished for its actions. That isn't why this particular conflict is so troubling: Netanyahu is using the threat of Hamas' tunnels as a justification for formally withdrawing his (misleading)  public support of a two state solution and this comes as a Naftali Bennet is pushing for a de facto annextion of the West Bank. Something is rotten in Israel.

I'm an "anti-Zionist" because I am concerned for Jews who have no interest in living in an Israel that treats them as gentile-loving traitors.  Israel legitimizes anti-semitism as a valid worldview every time it defends its settlements. Every time it displays ultra-jingoistic behavior by bombing Gaza hospitals, imprisoning those who work for NGOs and bullying the US, it makes the world a much darker place for Jews.

So you consider anti-semitism a valid and legitimate lens through which to look at the world?  Wow...

Anti-semitism is evil. If you're serious about combating it, it's of the utmost importance to consider what factors nurture anti-semitism. Israel's actions have unquestionably turned millions towards anti-semitic beliefs.

I don't agree, but as long as you weren't justifying anti-semitism or anything like that, we're good. 
18  Questions and Answers / The Atlas / Petition to ban Snowstalker from posting in International General Discussion on: July 22, 2014, 03:38:54 pm
The board's quality would improve by like 250% if that happened.  Normally having him on ignore works, but his trolling keeps getting quoted there and is extremely difficult to avoid. 

X Malcolm X
19  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Happy Birthday Franzl! on: July 22, 2014, 02:09:51 pm
Happy Birthday Franzl!
20  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Opinion of Mr. Pollo on: July 22, 2014, 02:09:06 pm
Obsessing over me won't help you get the dictatorship of the proletariat.
I'm voting FF for this post.
21  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: The Present Israel-Palestine Conflict Thread on: July 22, 2014, 12:42:00 pm
Israel's actions in the Gaza strip aren't surprising or shocking in the least. They have a clear cut casus belli and Hamas should be punished for its actions. That isn't why this particular conflict is so troubling: Netanyahu is using the threat of Hamas' tunnels as a justification for formally withdrawing his (misleading)  public support of a two state solution and this comes as a Naftali Bennet is pushing for a de facto annextion of the West Bank. Something is rotten in Israel.

I'm an "anti-Zionist" because I am concerned for Jews who have no interest in living in an Israel that treats them as gentile-loving traitors.  Israel legitimizes anti-semitism as a valid worldview every time it defends its settlements. Every time it displays ultra-jingoistic behavior by bombing Gaza hospitals, imprisoning those who work for NGOs and bullying the US, it makes the world a much darker place for Jews.

So you consider anti-semitism a valid and legitimate lens through which to look at the world?  Wow...
22  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: The Present Israel-Palestine Conflict Thread on: July 21, 2014, 08:39:29 pm
When on Earth did I ever express support for Hamas, refuse to condemn them or imply they were morally equivalent to Israel?

Also don't see anything remotely offensive about that tweet.

You didn't quite imply that they were morally equivalent to Israel, but the bolded part of this post was in that general ballpark, although in fairness to you, as I look back at the post it seems like I may have misinterpreted what your post.

For the record I was referring only to synogagues that promote unconditional support for Israel. That's equivalent to protesting a mosque that expresses support for suicide bombers, which is completely legitimate. Protesting all synogagues over Israel or all mosques over terrorism isn't.

And yes I doubt the protestors are making such a distinction. But violent or non-violent they still make up a fringe minority. Ray seems to think a majority of Europeans are anti-Semites.

It was in response to the point that protesting synagogues is like protesting mosques after Islamist terrorist attacks. The point was that protesting a synagogue of a Kahanist or Dov Hikind-esque bent is more comparable to protesting a mosque that actually promotes suicide bombings and speaks out in favor of terrorists. That's fair game and I fail to see how either is any different than protesting anti-gay churches.

Are the protestors in question making this distinction? Probably not. And the hate crimes are also quite horrifying. But they make up clearly a very small fringe in any country, and Ray's claims that a "pogrom" is about to start is absurd fearmongering.

Ah, if you meant Kahanist and Hikindesque synagogues , fair enough.
23  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: The Present Israel-Palestine Conflict Thread on: July 21, 2014, 01:18:03 pm
When on Earth did I ever express support for Hamas, refuse to condemn them or imply they were morally equivalent to Israel?

Also don't see anything remotely offensive about that tweet.

You didn't quite imply that they were morally equivalent to Israel, but the bolded part of this post was in that general ballpark, although in fairness to you, as I look back at the post it seems like I may have misinterpreted what your post.

For the record I was referring only to synogagues that promote unconditional support for Israel. That's equivalent to protesting a mosque that expresses support for suicide bombers, which is completely legitimate. Protesting all synogagues over Israel or all mosques over terrorism isn't.

And yes I doubt the protestors are making such a distinction. But violent or non-violent they still make up a fringe minority. Ray seems to think a majority of Europeans are anti-Semites.
24  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Opinion of Ray Goldfield on: July 21, 2014, 10:03:45 am
People like him are the reason antisemitism still exists.

No.

Yeah, no. Drop the victim-blaming.

You think he's the victim? Lol.

No, I think blaming those who face bigotry for the bigotry is nasty. It's a classic aspect of antisemitism so I would watch it if I were you.

Kind of hard to be antisemitic when I'm Jewish myself. And he doesn't face any bigotry.

No, it is not at all hard to be antisemitic and Jewish at the same time. And anyway I can't know who you are so it's a lame argument to use on the internet. Secondly, for precisely the same reasons you have no idea what bigotry he does or does not face.

Antonio made the point pretty concisely.

Hmm, actually I'd say it's quite hard, if not impossible to be Jewish and a genuine anti semite. Unless you have adopted the view that any criticism of Israel or their supporters is antisemitic.

Also, I don't think you realize just how easy it is to be Jewish in this country.

You could easily be lying about your religion, a self-hating Jew, or one of those awful people who goes around claiming to be Jewish when they're really just a Christian trying to convert actual Jews.  Regardless of which of those three you are, the more pressing question is why I haven't put you on ignore yet.  Fortunately, I can easily fix that right now.
25  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: The Present Israel-Palestine Conflict Thread on: July 21, 2014, 09:32:07 am
Do we really need to say it...

No, Non-Israeli Jews or synagogues are not acceptable targets not even for peaceful demonstration, as they have no direct influence on Israeli policy. Israeli abroad are not legitimate targets either for violent acts and even in Israel/Palestinia, it's not legitimate to go after Israeli civilians as targets either (collatoral damage can be discussed).

Even if we only see it from a purely pragmatic POV and not a moral one, the lesson from the Second Intifada and the Israeli invasions and bombings of Gaza, the killing of civilians have not resulted in breaking either sides will to fight.

Yes, you really do need to say it.  One of my biggest criticisms of so-called Palestinian rights activists, regardless of whether or not they're Palestinian, is that while they are always quick to try to paint the Israeli army (which does not target civilians even if some have been unintentionally killed by them) as some sort of bloodthirsty killing machine, they hardly ever criticize the actions of terrorist groups like Hamas which deliberately target civilians and even use their fellow Palestinians as human shields.  And when they do, it is almost always after being called-out on the matter in public/shamed into doing so.  Is the Israeli government's response always perfect?  Of course not and they are in the wrong on some issues, such as the settlements.  Is there anything even remotely resembling a shred of equivalency between Israel's democratic government defending the Israeli people and the terrorism and butchery of groups like Hamas?  No, and it is an insult to the innocent victims on both sides when people like BRTD suggest that there is.  It is like comparing the U.S. to Al-Qaeda.
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