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News: Atlas Hardware Upgrade complete October 13, 2013.

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1  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Hi all... on: April 27, 2015, 09:48:04 pm
Hey Sam, hope life's been treating you alright! Smiley
2  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: WV: Manchin to stay in Senate, not run for gov. on: April 27, 2015, 11:55:20 am
I don't know what we would do without Joe Manchin in the Senate urging the party to the right.

This is such an idiotic statement and is entirely representative of how how some democrats think their senate majority is going to appear through ignoring huge swaths of the country. Anyway, this statement isn't even right because it depends on the issue whether or not Manchin is "urging the party to the right":

He supports expanding Social Security, allying with Elizabeth Warren in the process.

He opposes "free trade" agreements.

You'll be surprised by many of these issue groups ratings, including 100% by NARAL in 2011, and 58% by the League of Conservation Voters. He has also been ranked consistently high among labor unions.

There's also, you know, the whole Manchin-Toomey thing in which he did more to promote sensible gun control than any of the democratic politicians that you probably like.

Anyway, it just makes me mad how underrated Manchin is by many on the left. Democrats should all be incredibly appreciative that he is helping us achieve the majority again.

This, I don't get all the Manchin hate around here.

And yet, he's objectively to the right of Hillary who is constantly bashed here as a right wing neoliberal...

Manchin's not running for President, he is running for Senate in West Virginia.

I'm aware. I just find it amusing that this site loves to fawn over people like Manchin, Rahall, Barrow, Murphy, Strickland (the latter two of which are running in states you probably need to win to win the presidency), yet consider Hillary Clinton, who is to the left of all of them, a right winger.

- No one here has heaped praise on Rahall.  I doubt most here even like him, I know I don't Tongue

- Barrow was cool because he kept winning seemingly unwinnable races is heavily gerrymandered blood-red districts and consistently had some of the best political ads in the country.

- Most folks here seem to hate Manchin, but I like him because he's way more liberal than we have any right to expect a West Virginia Senator to be, plus he took a really politically risky stand on an issue that is very important to me (gun control).

- Patrick Murphy is literally the only FL Democrat interested in running who can win that seat and is such an excellent candidate that he gets significant leeway on the issues.  He is the most liberal candidate who can win.  You can bet he's well to the left of any of the Republicans.  Incidentally, I've said for a while that I expect Hillary to overperform generic D in much of the state (one exception being the panhandle).

- Strickland is pretty liberal by any objective definition.  That's simply a fact.  Are there a few issues where he's decidedly to the right of Hillary (ex: clean energy)?  Sure.  But he's generally pretty liberal, he's an A-list candidate, and whether you agree with his views or not, he really comes across as a good guy who is in politics for the right reasons (although you obviously never know for sure with these guys).  Hillary isn't the best fit for Ohio, stylistically or ideologically.  We're a very pro-union state that tends to like Democrats who run as economic populists who will take on corperate interests and fight for blue-collar Americans and the middle class.  Having one or two non-economic issues where the Dem is perceived as being a little a bit to the right of the national party is a definite plus in terms of electability, but not a requirement.  Additionally, a politician who is percieved as too ambitious, ruthless, unlikable, or just plain not nice then they're going to rub a lot of Ohioans the wrong way (especially outside the Cleveland media market).  Folks here wave good morning to their neighbors, place a high value on treating others respectfully, etc.  "Midwest nice" is very much a thing in Ohio (especially in places like Franklin County).  Ohio is not unwinnable for Hillary by any means and she probably isn't going to underperform here as much as she will in Colorado or Iowa, but she's not a great fit either.  No matter what the results are, unless the Republican nominee completely implodes, Strickland will probably run ahead of Hillary.

TL;DR: No one has really done anything that could be considered "fawning" over any of those candidates, so please stop straw-manning.

I recall Rahall getting a lot of praise and a strong FF vote in the "opinion of" thread concerning him. Yeah there are some people who hate Manchin for being too conservative, but I'm fairly sure the majority likes him.

Anyway, I pretty much agree with everything you said (with the exception of Hillary being a weak candidate in Ohio, she's always been strong in the Midwest.) You don't need to convince me to support these guys, I already do. I just think it's interesting how the cutting off the nose to spite the face philosophy gets trotted out a LOT more with Hillary Clinton than any other candidate, even those that are legitimately conservative/center-right.

I thought I was literally the only person on the forum who likes Manchin Tongue
3  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 2008 Primaries on: April 26, 2015, 05:39:31 pm
4  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Izvestia: Official Atlasian News Service (CRISIS) on: April 26, 2015, 03:28:22 pm
Those seem like some rather difficult borders to defend.
5  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of Jeannette Rankin? on: April 26, 2015, 02:57:17 pm
FF. Not only the first woman to shatter the glass ceiling of congressional election, but also anti-war. I don't agree with her on voting no to enter WWII, but hey, she was progressive in other areas so it makes up for that.

No, it really doesn't.
6  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1916 Election (The Hearse at Monticello) on: April 26, 2015, 12:05:04 pm
Fairbanks (Anybody but Rankin)

Why? Don't you want to avoid WWI?

Someone who wouldn't vote to declare war on Japan after Pearl Harbor has no business being President, period.  If Rankin wouldn't go to war even then, surely there will be other times where her rabid isolationism would lead to similarly insane decisions if she ever became President.
It's a good thing this election is being held a few decades before Pearl Harbor, then

And surely the most insane decisions Rankin could be responsible would not be 'Joining WWI' - level insane

Entering World War I wasn't an insane decision, although whether it was the right one is debatable (I'd argue the Zimmerman telegram was a sufficient reason).  God knows what sort of crises would be created by Rankin's insane arch-isolationism.
7  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: More shady Clinton foundation stuff uncovered on: April 26, 2015, 11:56:27 am
so not interested in another 1.5 to 9.5 years of this
8  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: WV: Manchin to stay in Senate, not run for gov. on: April 26, 2015, 09:39:19 am
I don't know what we would do without Joe Manchin in the Senate urging the party to the right.

This is such an idiotic statement and is entirely representative of how how some democrats think their senate majority is going to appear through ignoring huge swaths of the country. Anyway, this statement isn't even right because it depends on the issue whether or not Manchin is "urging the party to the right":

He supports expanding Social Security, allying with Elizabeth Warren in the process.

He opposes "free trade" agreements.

You'll be surprised by many of these issue groups ratings, including 100% by NARAL in 2011, and 58% by the League of Conservation Voters. He has also been ranked consistently high among labor unions.

There's also, you know, the whole Manchin-Toomey thing in which he did more to promote sensible gun control than any of the democratic politicians that you probably like.

Anyway, it just makes me mad how underrated Manchin is by many on the left. Democrats should all be incredibly appreciative that he is helping us achieve the majority again.

This, I don't get all the Manchin hate around here.

And yet, he's objectively to the right of Hillary who is constantly bashed here as a right wing neoliberal...

Manchin's not running for President, he is running for Senate in West Virginia.

I'm aware. I just find it amusing that this site loves to fawn over people like Manchin, Rahall, Barrow, Murphy, Strickland (the latter two of which are running in states you probably need to win to win the presidency), yet consider Hillary Clinton, who is to the left of all of them, a right winger.

- No one here has heaped praise on Rahall.  I doubt most here even like him, I know I don't Tongue

- Barrow was cool because he kept winning seemingly unwinnable races is heavily gerrymandered blood-red districts and consistently had some of the best political ads in the country.

- Most folks here seem to hate Manchin, but I like him because he's way more liberal than we have any right to expect a West Virginia Senator to be, plus he took a really politically risky stand on an issue that is very important to me (gun control).

- Patrick Murphy is literally the only FL Democrat interested in running who can win that seat and is such an excellent candidate that he gets significant leeway on the issues.  He is the most liberal candidate who can win.  You can bet he's well to the left of any of the Republicans.  Incidentally, I've said for a while that I expect Hillary to overperform generic D in much of the state (one exception being the panhandle).

- Strickland is pretty liberal by any objective definition.  That's simply a fact.  Are there a few issues where he's decidedly to the right of Hillary (ex: clean energy)?  Sure.  But he's generally pretty liberal, he's an A-list candidate, and whether you agree with his views or not, he really comes across as a good guy who is in politics for the right reasons (although you obviously never know for sure with these guys).  Hillary isn't the best fit for Ohio, stylistically or ideologically.  We're a very pro-union state that tends to like Democrats who run as economic populists who will take on corperate interests and fight for blue-collar Americans and the middle class.  Having one or two non-economic issues where the Dem is perceived as being a little a bit to the right of the national party is a definite plus in terms of electability, but not a requirement.  Additionally, a politician who is percieved as too ambitious, ruthless, unlikable, or just plain not nice then they're going to rub a lot of Ohioans the wrong way (especially outside the Cleveland media market).  Folks here wave good morning to their neighbors, place a high value on treating others respectfully, etc.  "Midwest nice" is very much a thing in Ohio (especially in places like Franklin County).  Ohio is not unwinnable for Hillary by any means and she probably isn't going to underperform here as much as she will in Colorado or Iowa, but she's not a great fit either.  No matter what the results are, unless the Republican nominee completely implodes, Strickland will probably run ahead of Hillary.

TL;DR: No one has really done anything that could be considered "fawning" over any of those candidates, so please stop straw-manning.

9  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1916 Election (The Hearse at Monticello) on: April 25, 2015, 08:13:16 am
Fairbanks (Anybody but Rankin)

Why? Don't you want to avoid WWI?

Someone who wouldn't vote to declare war on Japan after Pearl Harbor has no business being President, period.  If Rankin wouldn't go to war even then, surely there will be other times where her rabid isolationism would lead to similarly insane decisions if she ever became President.
10  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: Fighting for Ohio Fund (R): OH-Sen - Portman leads 47-40 over Strickland on: April 25, 2015, 08:04:27 am
This is obviously a Republican internal/junk poll.

Edit: You also left out the part where Portman leads Sittenfield 56-21, Lebron.  

Omg that's really bad, even for an internal.
That's a name recognition problem. Had national Democrats backed behind Sittenfeld (unopposed), I'm fairly confident he would have the necessary resources to make up lost ground and would end up putting in a hard-fought, but unsuccessful effort against Portman.

The Portman/Sittenfeld poll is meaningless though. Strickland will be the nominee, so I would be paying more attention to the fact that regardless of how skewed this poll is, just how mediocre Strickland is viewed by Ohioans when it comes to his record as governor. Portman will wisely take full advantage of that.

This is a Republican internal, not a credible poll.  We've had two of those and one showed Strickland up by 9% and the other showed the race tied.
11  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Martin O'Malley lays down the law - uses profanity-laced attacks on Republicans on: April 24, 2015, 08:13:46 pm
That's all well and good, but he still was a disaster as Mayor of Baltimore
12  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1916 Election (The Hearse at Monticello) on: April 24, 2015, 08:11:02 pm
Fairbanks (Anybody but Rankin)
13  Forum Community / Election and History Games / Re: The Lion and the Rose, the II ASOIAF Game (Sign Up - Rules Thread) on: April 24, 2015, 03:41:41 pm
Oh sh*t

This might be appropiate for the moment:


Sounds about right
14  Questions and Answers / The Atlas / Re: Banzilla #2 - The Ban Boy Returns - Petition to ban Solarstorm on: April 24, 2015, 05:44:17 am
X Mr. X

For Solarstorm's own good as much as anything else.
15  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: Fighting for Ohio Fund (R): OH-Sen - Portman leads 47-40 over Strickland on: April 24, 2015, 05:27:31 am
This is obviously a Republican internal/junk poll.

Edit: You also left out the part where Portman leads Sittenfield 56-21, Lebron. 
16  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1916 Conventions (The Hearse at Monticello) on: April 24, 2015, 05:18:45 am
You guys know Rankin voted against declaring war on Japan after Pearl Harbor, right?
17  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: 1916 Conventions (The Hearse at Monticello) on: April 23, 2015, 08:07:56 pm
Underwood/Sinclair
18  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: WV: Manchin to stay in Senate, not run for gov. on: April 23, 2015, 07:59:04 pm
I don't know what we would do without Joe Manchin in the Senate urging the party to the right.

This is such an idiotic statement and is entirely representative of how how some democrats think their senate majority is going to appear through ignoring huge swaths of the country. Anyway, this statement isn't even right because it depends on the issue whether or not Manchin is "urging the party to the right":

He supports expanding Social Security, allying with Elizabeth Warren in the process.

He opposes "free trade" agreements.

You'll be surprised by many of these issue groups ratings, including 100% by NARAL in 2011, and 58% by the League of Conservation Voters. He has also been ranked consistently high among labor unions.

There's also, you know, the whole Manchin-Toomey thing in which he did more to promote sensible gun control than any of the democratic politicians that you probably like.

Anyway, it just makes me mad how underrated Manchin is by many on the left. Democrats should all be incredibly appreciative that he is helping us achieve the majority again.

This, I don't get all the Manchin hate around here.

And yet, he's objectively to the right of Hillary who is constantly bashed here as a right wing neoliberal...

Manchin's not running for President, he is running for Senate in West Virginia.
19  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: WV: Manchin to stay in Senate, not run for gov. on: April 23, 2015, 05:38:53 am
I don't know what we would do without Joe Manchin in the Senate urging the party to the right.

This is such an idiotic statement and is entirely representative of how how some democrats think their senate majority is going to appear through ignoring huge swaths of the country. Anyway, this statement isn't even right because it depends on the issue whether or not Manchin is "urging the party to the right":

He supports expanding Social Security, allying with Elizabeth Warren in the process.

He opposes "free trade" agreements.

You'll be surprised by many of these issue groups ratings, including 100% by NARAL in 2011, and 58% by the League of Conservation Voters. He has also been ranked consistently high among labor unions.

There's also, you know, the whole Manchin-Toomey thing in which he did more to promote sensible gun control than any of the democratic politicians that you probably like.

Anyway, it just makes me mad how underrated Manchin is by many on the left. Democrats should all be incredibly appreciative that he is helping us achieve the majority again.

This, I don't get all the Manchin hate around here.
20  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: OH-Sen: Cincinnati Councilman P.G. Sittenfeld likely running on: April 23, 2015, 05:34:43 am
A new editorial is out by Brent Larkin reporting that after Sittenfeld said he would stay in the race after the ODP's endorsement of Strickland, party leaders within the party are about to start a smear campaign against him.

It's not completely the same as in this situation of course, but five years ago, both Brunner and Fisher weren't racking in as much money as they could have had Democrats backed behind one candidate and to make matters worse there were internal and public bombshells being thrown in the primary to weaken each other when Democrats should have used that time uniting against Portman. Those who don't learn history just might be doomed to repeat it, I guess.

As a young college Democrat from Cleveland I don't have any authority to say what happens high up in the ODP down in Columbus, but a toddler could figure out that trying to ruin the career of one of the party's top rising stars is not a good idea, either.

Sittenfield isn't a rising star at this point. 
21  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: IN-Sen: Coats retiring on: April 23, 2015, 05:32:10 am

You seem stuck in 2010, talking about how everyone is going to get teabagged. In case you didn't notice, the Tea Party lost every single race in 2014.
*points to Sasse in NE, Brat in VA, Cotton in AR, Ernst in IA, and Lankford in OK.*

Cotton wasn't a tea-party candidate...
22  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: Meet the GOP's unconventional new star on: April 23, 2015, 05:29:33 am
I look forward to McSally's defeat next year.
23  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Regional Governments / Re: South: Fairness in Cabinet Obligations Amendment on: April 22, 2015, 07:16:42 am
Nay
24  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The Grand New Hampshire Debate on: April 19, 2015, 06:08:56 pm
False dichotomy: both.
25  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Maximum Libertarian Performance on: April 19, 2015, 04:44:29 pm
Their 2012 margin is probably the ceiling.

This
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