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1  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 06:03:16 pm
German SPD vice-Chancellor Sigmar Gabriel indicates Tsipras has “torn down the last bridges across which Europe and Greece could have moved toward a compromise” ...“By rejecting the rules of the game of the euro area, as expressed in the majority ‘No’ vote

The Germans are very angry. 

if there were any doubt left that the Eurozone is an antidemocratic project..

Democracy implies that German voters should be heard too, shouldn´t they?
2  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 02:44:27 pm
Congrats to the big, independent and proud nation of Greece !

Guatemala is bigger, more independent and, at least, equally proud. Perhaps, with Greece gone, somebody would care for Guatemala.
3  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:54:02 pm
German exporters association: Can't see how Greece remains in Euro. Savings bank association says there should be Grexit.

Happy to see so much agreement between the Greeks and the Germans. I just hope the Germans will donate humanitarian aid: or else, children will be starving.
4  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:52:52 pm
Then progressively implement a socialized economy for the benefit of all.

Well, THAT is cruelty. Greeks do not deserve the mass murder you are proposing.
5  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:51:54 pm
Ah, sore losers trolling... This is tasty. (speaking mainly about ag)

But I agree. Greece should indeed get out of the Euro, possibly the EU. T

I am, actually, quite happy that any pretense is gone. Greece is out, the rest of Europe can concentrate on humanitarian action. A lot of compassion will be needed.

Hopefully, the Greek borders will not be closed, so that Greek citizens, having abandoned the euro, will have a chance to earn it in Germany.
6  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:36:58 pm
So does this strengthen or weaken Tsipras' position? I'd say it's the latter since the creditors now realize that their demands will never be met by a Greek government so it's sensible to just cut their losses and let Greece default and exit.

Tsipras's personal position, as the Greek PM, is, obviously, strengthened. And, as for the negotiations, I am afraid they are now dead, so no issue of "strengthening or weakening" left.

The Greek Labor Minister seems to disagree.  He just said that now Greece’s govt now has strong mandate to go seal deal with creditors.  Question is, what sort of deal ?

Arrangements for a German printing press printing the drachma, obviously.
7  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:33:40 pm
So does this strengthen or weaken Tsipras' position? I'd say it's the latter since the creditors now realize that their demands will never be met by a Greek government so it's sensible to just cut their losses and let Greece default and exit.

Tsipras's personal position, as the Greek PM, is, obviously, strengthened. And, as for the negotiations, I am afraid they are now dead, so no issue of "strengthening or weakening" left.
8  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:32:28 pm
Good for the Greek people. If the austericrats refuse to heed this message, they will have to bear the responsibility of kicking Greece out.

Greek people have freely and without interference voted to get out of the euro. Their voice should be heard.

No, the Greeks have said that they will not bend to any conditions to stay in the Euro. They will be out if they are forced to by the draconian and absurd conditions imposed by Lagarde and Schaeuble.

They knew, even these conditions were, probably, no longer on the table. They knew, that voting "no" means the banks can never reopen issuing euro. They voted. This is their free will, and democracy has to be respected. Doing anything else would be going against the freely expressed democratic will of the Greek people.
9  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:17:55 pm
Guardian saying demand is growing in ND for Samaras' resignation as leader.

This should have been done in January.
10  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:12:36 pm
Yes might pull through after the provisional ballots are counted.

Have you looked at the actual results? Or are you suggesting they are refusing to count the "yes" votes?
11  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:12:06 pm
Good for the Greek people. If the austericrats refuse to heed this message, they will have to bear the responsibility of kicking Greece out.

Greek people have freely and without interference voted to get out of the euro. Their voice should be heard.

The European partners should help with printing the drachma: they might have trouble to finding a printer to do it on credit otherwise.
12  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 01:10:39 pm
Ag, how are you seeing results from places like Sparta - the lowest level I can get is Electoral District?

Once you go into the electoral district, there is another menu for municipality, and then a menu for municipal segment.
13  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 12:46:06 pm
Some things never die. In Lakonia "yes" is at over 49%

And, in fact, in Sparta "yes" is at 50.14%!
14  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 12:43:27 pm
Well, at least this is clear. Euro has just become a smaller zone.

Not sure about that.  I still think there is a non-zero chance of a deal that has the contours of the deal they had last Friday with some small amount of debt writeoff (mostly by shifting back the maturity date) with a structure for more writeoffs as the primary surplus continues into the next few years.

May be. But the trust between the negotiators and the Greeks is very low, at this point.
15  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 12:39:32 pm
Some things never die. In Lakonia "yes" is at over 49%
16  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 12:37:00 pm
Well, at least this is clear. Euro has just become a smaller zone.
17  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 11:59:56 am
Very close results are especially bad here. It shows how split the country is. Of course, any course of action is going to be difficult here (at best), and likely disastrous. So, no matter what happens there will be lots of people saying: "I told you so".
18  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: Today at 11:31:10 am
I hope they havevprepared provisional drachma bills.
19  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Trump vs. Mexico omnibus thread on: July 04, 2015, 10:22:35 pm
I'd love to see a hypothetical meeting between President Trump and President Obrador.

They would, probably, both start barking and howling at the moon within 3 minutes.
20  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Russia publically wonders if it legally still owns Baltics on: July 04, 2015, 10:19:57 pm
Is everyone seriously falling for Russia's painfully obvious trolling?

Trolling in Georgia, trolling in Crimea, trolling in Donbass... Yeah, we are taking Russian trolling seriously. Because it tends to be armed trolling.

Yeah, no one is seriously worried that they're going to roll into NATO any day. What we're worried about is that they're reminding us they can if anyone gets in the way of their reconquest project.
Last I checked Putin is just an authoritarian borderline fascist asshole, not mentally retarded.

His German colleague did not suffer from mental retardation either.
That's true, but to compare the situation of the mid-1930s with modern Europe is ridiculous considering that if Russia actually invaded a country in NATO or the EU everyone wouldn't just sit idly by like in Czechoslovakia or Poland.

Relying on a KGB guy's adequate understanding of realities is, for me, far too slender a thread, when the world's future is concerned.
21  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Russia publically wonders if it legally still owns Baltics on: July 04, 2015, 08:55:38 am
Is everyone seriously falling for Russia's painfully obvious trolling?

Trolling in Georgia, trolling in Crimea, trolling in Donbass... Yeah, we are taking Russian trolling seriously. Because it tends to be armed trolling.

Yeah, no one is seriously worried that they're going to roll into NATO any day. What we're worried about is that they're reminding us they can if anyone gets in the way of their reconquest project.
Last I checked Putin is just an authoritarian borderline fascist asshole, not mentally retarded.

His German colleague did not suffer from mental retardation either.
22  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: July 03, 2015, 07:20:57 pm
I seem to have touched a nerve. Actually, not only your nerve - got some congratulating private messages from our Northern European friends here  Smiley


What nerve? National pride perhaps?  

Even if it is just that, it is, most definitely, worth it. Hate national pride.

I have read Krugman.
23  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Russia publically wonders if it legally still owns Baltics on: July 03, 2015, 06:55:20 pm
Is everyone seriously falling for Russia's painfully obvious trolling?

Trolling in Georgia, trolling in Crimea, trolling in Donbass... Yeah, we are taking Russian trolling seriously. Because it tends to be armed trolling.
24  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Susana Martinez criticizes Trump on: July 03, 2015, 06:20:58 pm

New Mexico, Old Mexico - we are one here Smiley
25  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal on: July 03, 2015, 06:18:26 pm
The "straw man" you have used is a fictional person, or group of persons, who think that "theres [sic] an unlimited cache of money waiting for somebody if they just declare "Austerity = Over." Unfortunately no one actually expressed this belief.

I'm afraid that terrible poster is not the only hot head in this thread. Apparently, ag thinks that I'm complaining because manna ceased to flow toward my country and I want that people feel sorry about me, as well accuses me of being ungrateful. Well, no. I don't remember having put in writing such a thing. I truly appreciate the advantages of joining the "club" back in the 80s. I think governments in my country allocated badly the funds with their excessive enthusiasm for infrastructures, but that's another question. But now I feel really sorry for the people who is actually suffering the consequences of misguided policies, in my country and elsewhere in Europe, and not really for myself. I can see the results every day around me. As well, I deplore the current drive of the Continent and fear the place where it's heading towards. I don't blame such drive only, I'm very critic of past and present governments in my country. It's quite deplorable that certain posters interpretate that I'm begging for alms or something, only because of some geographical accident. And the Greeks... they are really much worse than us. However, and despite their pains have been aggravated by certain policies and institutions, we are not entitled to talk in their favour... because some people is going to say... a strawman. Some people should cool down.     

I seem to have touched a nerve. Actually, not only your nerve - got some congratulating private messages from our Northern European friends here  Smiley
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