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1  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Europe-Middle East-Africa Refugee Crisis General Thread on: Today at 08:28:13 am
Some of you people are disgusting.  Some people don't want millions of more people in their countries, so their automatically racists?  What kind of bullspit is that?  It's an issue that can be discussed, debated, compromised on, but you guys don't want that, you want to show how much better you are.  Great job poisoning the well.

Oh please. This, of course, isn't simple. 

my 'Browns' comment was unnecessary - so I'll apologise for it. But there should be consideration of people who are escaping abominable situations that we cannot fathom. We dont understand that desperation, we don't know what kind of risks we'd be prepared to take.

States need to ensure their sovereignty but that's the point. Hence my question - these are humanitarian crises, what do we do? Other than say they're not our problem, despite the policy decisions taken in many of our countries, including mine, helped lead to this.
We can talk about it, but it's a lot harder to do when one side is calling EVERYbody on the other side racists.  It just shows some of you don't really want to talk about it.

I'm happy to talk about it. I exist because countries looked after my grandmother and her family fled persecution and the prelude to war. I'm happy to talk, but when people give equal time to the context and what is causing this.bI never said that this is Europe's problem to solve, it's all of ours.

The argument seems driven by the dehumanisation of people, they are problems, like an invasive pest species. Not people fleeing conditions, again, that we can't imagine. It's much easier to have discussions when problems are reduced to that level.
2  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Denali ! on: Today at 07:05:14 am
Who.
Gives.
A.
F***?

We did the same thing with Indigenous landmarks - Ayers Rock became Uluru, The Devil's Marbles became Karlu Karlu, Mt Olga became Kata Tjuta and in Sydney the area known as the Hungry Mile was renamed Barangaroo. People can still call them whatever they want, but at an official level, that is what they're called.

It's respectful of the existing culture and eventually, people will stop caring.

As we all know, European settlers and their descendants don't have culture.

Um, of course they do. But they don't trump the culture that was there first and the culture that places a lot more and deeper importance than "oh, it's so pretty".
3  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Europe-Middle East-Africa Refugee Crisis General Thread on: Today at 06:55:28 am
Some of you people are disgusting.  Some people don't want millions of more people in their countries, so their automatically racists?  What kind of bullspit is that?  It's an issue that can be discussed, debated, compromised on, but you guys don't want that, you want to show how much better you are.  Great job poisoning the well.

Oh please. This, of course, isn't simple. 

my 'Browns' comment was unnecessary - so I'll apologise for it. But there should be consideration of people who are escaping abominable situations that we cannot fathom. We dont understand that desperation, we don't know what kind of risks we'd be prepared to take.

States need to ensure their sovereignty but that's the point. Hence my question - these are humanitarian crises, what do we do? Other than say they're not our problem, despite the policy decisions taken in many of our countries, including mine, helped lead to this.
4  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Is Hillary Still Our Best Bet on: Today at 01:42:57 am
Yes. Pure and simple.
5  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: International politicians most similar to USA presidential candidate on: Today at 01:42:13 am
How... in any way dudeabides... is Rudd like Huckabee?
6  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: By-elections of the 44th Australian Parliament (2013-2016) on: Today at 01:41:24 am
Two more polls suggesting a 51-49 Lib win, off a pretty strong flow of preferences to the ALP, I think too strong and they'll ease off once people are in the booth.

I still think the most likely result is a 53-47 win for the Libs.
7  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Europe-Middle East-Africa Refugee Crisis General Thread on: September 02, 2015, 11:20:54 pm
But of course, beware the browns right? No matter where they are?

However much you guys like to make this about race it is not the colour of their skin that is the problem, and it is not as simple as "lets just help those in need". Refugee situations can often be boiled down to this, but this one can't. And there have been several attempts to explain why. Ignoring them and just posting a moral reprimand is pointless.



OK then, instead of acting like the victims in this issue. What's your solution? Aside from can't x (read as, anywhere but here) take them?
8  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Europe-Middle East-Africa Refugee Crisis General Thread on: September 02, 2015, 08:33:28 pm
This entire thread is a testimony that re-enforces that I said the moment I saw that poor little boy on a beach in Turkey. We're the worst thing to happen to our planet.

The paranoia about settling people fleeing a war zone... what the hell is wrong with you people? Human beings being treated like a piece of ugly heirloom furniture "No, I don't want it!" "Wait, you liked her more, you take it!".

I'm seriously asking you. There should be an international agreement on this issue that includes all countries in the region and all developed economies. Noting that part of the reason why there are issues about re-settling in the Middle East is due to the high risk of persecution and continued attacks. Frankly, reading some of these cold and spiteful comments, I wonder if they should even bother.

But of course, beware the browns right? No matter where they are?
9  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: The Office of Senator Polnut - Farwell on: September 02, 2015, 05:07:53 pm

Senate Caucus Room, the Capitol



Ladies and Gentlemen,

This is a bittersweet time. On Friday I will be ending my long career in Atlasian politics. This is not a blip, this is not a re-direction, and this is the end. I leave with some sadness, but knowing that this needs to happen and that this is the right thing for me to do.

Atlasia has been part of my life for many years, I dare say longer than any other active personality here. This has left me with regrets, pride, failures and successes.

I am proud that I put in the place the nationís first comprehensive mental health plan. I am proud that I led the charge to protect homeowners from illegal and unethical lending practices. I am proud to have signed into law the largest reform to our social security system. I am proud to have created a national broadcaster. I am proud to have led the process to ensure that our young people who want to go to University are no longer are at the mercy of private lenders. I am proud to have started the process to get our budget on a sustainable path, without cutting services.  While the work is not complete, I am proud to see the work to real and indeed radical reforms to our prison and justice system started, and they must be seen through to the end.

I am also proud that I never resorted to stunts or feigned outrage to get things done. Iíve been accused of being a moderate for the sake of it, but thatís where I differ with many of colleagues over the years. Iíve never assumed that I knew the answers, I have followed the evidence. I have fought to get real practical policy changes to help make the lives of Atlasians better. Building barriers and repairing bridges is better during a flood than shouting at the rain.

There is a big set of questions for those who remain in active politics. What kind of country do you want? If you want this to continue, you need to get real. The petty party nonsense, for a time, needs to stop. This is not a time for personal point-scoring and aggrandisement. Atlasia is damaged and it is weaker than Iíve ever seen it. But it takes effort, commitment and sacrifice to get it back on track. It is also not a time for bystanders. So, particularly those who are in elected offices, I repeat my call that if you cannot commit to the work required, do everyone a favour and walk away. I know my time is over, I no longer have the drive or passion for this place, and I am comfortable and happy with this call.

This has been a remarkable experience, and I hope I left the place in a better situation than when I arrived. Although, to paraphrase one of my favourite quotes, I think very often, the best most of us can say is that we did no harm. I give you all my best wishes for a positive future.

Thank you all. 


10  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Primary Election Polls / Re: Gravis Marketing-IA Trump/Clinton Dominate on: September 02, 2015, 04:03:51 pm
Gravis, lol
11  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Australia General Discussion on: September 02, 2015, 01:42:49 am
Tony Windsor is getting ready to contest New England against Barnaby. Windsor knows the vibe of his electorate better than anyone. This is going to be deeply entertaining.
12  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: In case somebody still missed this on: September 01, 2015, 10:03:50 pm
Back years ago... these jobs were competitive- If I remember correctly
I believe that it is up to the President to set the tone.....and if he is not willing to create an environment where these jobs are desirable,he has got to go

I'm as dissatisfied with Bore's performance as anyone, but to place the blame for the current predicament on the shoulders of one man is inaccurate and, frankly, cheap politics. The roots of this crisis go much, much deeper than the failings of a single president, and while the powers of that office are indeed vast, it is unrealistic to expect him to turn the tide on months worth of inactivity and apathy on his own. Saying otherwise is dangerous, because it ignores the real systematic problems facing Atlasia in favor of a simplistic solution.

It is more complicated than that. Again, I stress that I don't underestimate the challenge that the president faces at all times, let alone at a time like this.

My concern was the apparent lack of concern or engagement by the President on this issue. I felt the concerns of the Senate needed to be conveyed directly to the President. I hope that those who are so fervent in their support and dedication to Atlasia put their hands up, even if it means leaving an elected position. 
13  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: If Dwight Eisenhower came back from the dead... on: September 01, 2015, 08:55:02 pm
He'd be a moderate Democrat.

No, he wouldn't.  He was a moderate Republican until the day he died, and his politics aren't remarkably different in tone than HW.  He'd be a moderate Republican now.

Thinking that HW has any place in the Republican party now, outside of a relic, is kind of cute .
14  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Denali ! on: September 01, 2015, 08:53:39 pm
Who.
Gives.
A.
F***?

We did the same thing with Indigenous landmarks - Ayers Rock became Uluru, The Devil's Marbles became Karlu Karlu, Mt Olga became Kata Tjuta and in Sydney the area known as the Hungry Mile was renamed Barangaroo. People can still call them whatever they want, but at an official level, that is what they're called.

It's respectful of the existing culture and eventually, people will stop caring.
15  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Hillary's favorables are 9.6 points underwater on: September 01, 2015, 08:35:50 pm
It's a basic truth that favourables don't really mean much. You don't have to like someone to vote for them. It's obviously helps, plus favourables have a tendency to shift about a lot, especially during campaigns. It becomes both a reflection of increased exposure, as well as, a comparative rating against your opponent.

16  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Bernie Sanders Says He Will Not End Drone Program If Elected President on: September 01, 2015, 08:01:23 am
Sanders is no peacenik. He's just not a crazy warmonger like Hillary.

You need a new act, it was boring in 2007... It's tedious and hysterical now.

On topic ... good. It's effective if used properly.
17  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Moody's Election Model: Democrats to win 2016 in landslide on: September 01, 2015, 07:59:09 am
a) not a landslide
b) if the Dem is winning OH, CO, FL, VA ... then they're likely winning IA too.
18  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: In case somebody still missed this on: August 31, 2015, 06:44:04 pm
Disgraced former GM and newbies pile onto bore...

Lumine is potentially running for president.

Yeah this is as much of a sh**tshow as I was told. Who would take a cabinet post even if asked in this apocalyptic situation?

This isn't about bore as a person, I've supported bore twice and he's still got two months to run. Very, very few here now understand how difficult the job of dealing with the Cabinet is. But, they're still jobs with importance and it's a part of the president's job to fill them.

This situation cannot be deflected as an accusation of deliberately targeting the President, or about campaigning. This is a serious situation and requires a rapid resolution. I'm very happy that the President has responded.

There are options, such as one person holding more than one role. Basically, what I'm saying is we cannot wait two months for these roles to be filled. I echo the call for those who are being so gun-ho, to put themselves forward and serve your country.
19  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Cheney to Biden: "Go for it" on: August 31, 2015, 04:05:45 pm
Noting all the GOPers urging Biden to run?
20  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Cris Survey Poll - Political landscape. on: August 31, 2015, 06:46:10 am
Why am I in this?

You're the leader of the Labor Party and therefore an important figure in Atlasia.

Ugh I forgot about that..
21  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Why haven't Trump's opponents portrayed him as a RINO? on: August 31, 2015, 06:43:48 am
And the CBO is saying this will cost $300b and take 40 years to deport everyone.

The most sensible thing is amnesty and get people out there working and paying taxes.

Trump's agenda is disgusting and racist and playing xenophobia in older and whiter America. That's all it is. No one can quantify what the economic impacts are the illegal immigration, so... is it worth $300b and the undermining of the 14th amendment so a bunch of angry and paranoid white men feel better about being paranoid racists?

I mean, he was talking about going after street gangs, like an illegal immigrant would be entangled in a situation that would involve the risk of contact with law enforcement? But it plays well to his vile base, facts don't matter, as long as he placates them, and gets support from it, it'll keep going. Illegal immigrants are out there in illegal crime gangs!!! Obviously.

Seriously...

The defence budget in 2014 was $581 billion. According to one estimate, illegal immigration costs the US government more than $100 billion every year. I think the American economy can take this one-time $300 billion hit. It's a worthwhile investment that will pay itself off in 3 years.

Um - where does this one estimate come from. Also conveniently forgetting that CBO also thinks it will take 40 years.

It's disgusting and pointless policy. Trump really doesn't give two s***s about this. This is his angle.
22  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: What is the RNC's doomsday plan? on: August 31, 2015, 06:42:04 am
A hit job?
23  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Why haven't Trump's opponents portrayed him as a RINO? on: August 31, 2015, 01:23:43 am
And the CBO is saying this will cost $300b and take 40 years to deport everyone.

The most sensible thing is amnesty and get people out there working and paying taxes.

Trump's agenda is disgusting and racist and playing xenophobia in older and whiter America. That's all it is. No one can quantify what the economic impacts are the illegal immigration, so... is it worth $300b and the undermining of the 14th amendment so a bunch of angry and paranoid white men feel better about being paranoid racists?

I mean, he was talking about going after street gangs, like an illegal immigrant would be entangled in a situation that would involve the risk of contact with law enforcement? But it plays well to his vile base, facts don't matter, as long as he placates them, and gets support from it, it'll keep going. Illegal immigrants are out there in illegal crime gangs!!! Obviously.

Seriously...
24  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Australia General Discussion on: August 31, 2015, 12:28:32 am
Denis Napthine is stepping down from the Victorian Parliament.

Yeah, it's going to be an interesting by-election me thinks.
25  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: If Warren were running how bad would Hillary be losing right now? on: August 30, 2015, 11:50:12 pm
I don't think Sanders would have jumped in if Warren ran, they agree on way too many issues to run and split the very liberal vote

This. Plus, Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren aren't self-interested hacks who would jump into the race wholly for their own gain.

I'm glad you qualified that, because they're still politicians Tongue
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