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News: Atlas Hardware Upgrade complete October 13, 2013.

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8851  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: What I don't understand about today's society on: April 21, 2007, 02:14:29 pm
Naso, the difference is that liberals use reason, whereas your responses are all simply emotional.

ZING!

Yes, Opebo and BRTD we all know how you use pure reason and debate (and not Personal prejudices at all) in debates...



I love that Image. Smiley
8852  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Who's to blame for the VA Tech shootings? on: April 21, 2007, 02:10:49 pm
You can't claim that just "Cho" (as if he was an abstract concept) did it, as Cho was a protect of many things - his genetics, his parents, his upbringing and of course the Culture into which he was raised. To say otherwise is vastly denying reality in a manner in which only Naso could match.
8853  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: is pre-marital sex wrong? on: April 21, 2007, 02:08:53 pm
1) No one lies.  If you are "f**ck buddies" then make that known, don't pretend to be in love to get a girl in bed.

ha, I've said "I love you" to a girl in bed many times not really meaning it and she knew exactly that. And girls have done the same thing to me.

oh and josh, how do you explain dinosaurs?

Which only proves the point that you have all the morals of a randy evangelist homophobic preacher. Congrats! R-MN really suits you, you know?

And as for the question at hand, Good god what an absurd idea. I've always found weddings silly and rather annoying ceremonies where no doubt both the bride and groom would prefer just to get things go along faster and get to the wedding night, all ready!

Plus Marriage = Romantic love is mostly a 18th Century\Victorian construction.
8854  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: French Presidential Election 22 April 2007 Thread on: April 21, 2007, 06:14:27 am
Predictions:
Sarkozy 24%
Bayrou 19%
Royal 19%
Le Pen 18%
8855  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: VATech shooting on: April 20, 2007, 02:36:58 pm
49.99% A
49.99% B
00.02% C
8856  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: France 2007: Voting Intentions of Atlasia for R1 on: April 20, 2007, 02:27:31 pm
Too late now to vote in the poll, but I would have gone for Bayrou.
8857  General Discussion / History / Re: US Presidents, Day 42: Clinton on: April 15, 2007, 04:05:35 am
I still don't understand why Republicans hate him. Consider his accomplishments:

* Passed NAFTA, a trade agreement supported by the GOP
* Led the attack on the remnants of the social safety net, signing Republican-written welfare "reform" (and smirking that "the era of Big Government is over")
* Signed the Defense of Marriage Act banning same-sex marriage in an appeal to religious conservatives... and a vicious little jab at the gay activists who had supported him
* Fought for the Antiterrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act, expanding the federal death penalty and limiting prisoners' rights
* Favored wide use of American power abroad, with "interventions" in the Balkans; also laid the groundwork for the current debacle by calling for regime change in Iraq
* Made "balancing the budget" his top concern at the expense of social spending, following the counsel of conservative Wall Street advisors

And on, and on. Seriously, why do conservatives hate him? Were his wars not disastrous enough to gain their approval, or what? He would have been considered too far to the right to lead the Democratic ticket in earlier years. Actually, on balance he was a pretty dreadful President.

Because of the "D", and that huge right-wing smear campaign obviously - after 12 years of laziness republicans were too used to their little arrangements in Washington even if the silly little electorate had a different opinion on that.

And I always have when someone calls Clinton "left-wing" though he gets alot of credit from me for his role of Northern Ireland and his foreign policy. By default the best US president since the War (not that that is hard or anything...)

By "the War" you mean WWII, I assume? I'd probably agree with you.

Yes.
8858  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of Albert Edward Smith on: April 14, 2007, 06:07:25 pm
Does Ambiguity actually exist in your world BRTD? Once again neither option can really describe the man though he doesn't sound like a bad person.

I didn't invent the FF/HP dichotomy. It's been around on this forum for a long time.

I thought you'd hate him for being a communist.

I would have hated his communism, I would have not hated him

And invent a new dichotomy please.
8859  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of Albert Edward Smith on: April 14, 2007, 05:56:24 pm
Does Ambiguity actually exist in your world BRTD? Once again neither option can really describe the man though he doesn't sound like a bad person.
8860  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Is the preceding poster an extremist, a moderate, or neither? on: April 14, 2007, 05:54:40 pm
Just laugh out loud.
8861  General Discussion / History / Re: US Presidents, Day 42: Clinton on: April 14, 2007, 05:52:48 pm
I still don't understand why Republicans hate him. Consider his accomplishments:

* Passed NAFTA, a trade agreement supported by the GOP
* Led the attack on the remnants of the social safety net, signing Republican-written welfare "reform" (and smirking that "the era of Big Government is over")
* Signed the Defense of Marriage Act banning same-sex marriage in an appeal to religious conservatives... and a vicious little jab at the gay activists who had supported him
* Fought for the Antiterrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act, expanding the federal death penalty and limiting prisoners' rights
* Favored wide use of American power abroad, with "interventions" in the Balkans; also laid the groundwork for the current debacle by calling for regime change in Iraq
* Made "balancing the budget" his top concern at the expense of social spending, following the counsel of conservative Wall Street advisors

And on, and on. Seriously, why do conservatives hate him? Were his wars not disastrous enough to gain their approval, or what? He would have been considered too far to the right to lead the Democratic ticket in earlier years. Actually, on balance he was a pretty dreadful President.

Because of the "D", and that huge right-wing smear campaign obviously - after 12 years of laziness republicans were too used to their little arrangements in Washington even if the silly little electorate had a different opinion on that.

And I always laugh when someone calls Clinton "left-wing" though he gets alot of credit from me for his role of Northern Ireland and his foreign policy. By default the best US president since the War (not that that is hard or anything...)
8862  General Discussion / History / Re: US Presidents, Day 34: Eisenhower on: April 14, 2007, 05:49:20 pm
Doesn't get nearly as much flak as he deserves.

Yes. Especially about his goverment involvement in Iran, which is one of the major reasons why we're in this mess at the moment.
8863  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: What are you listening to right now? on: April 13, 2007, 04:55:26 pm
The leaking of my fish tank.
8864  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / U.S. Presidential Election Results / Re: Debs: Threat to Roosevelt or Wilson? on: April 13, 2007, 04:52:59 pm
To follow up to that, the nation at the time was in a progressive mood.
...with the result that even people who were not, as it were, particularly progressive, were marketed as "Progressives".
Such as... you know... Woodrow Wilson. Or Teddy Roosevelt. Or even (before his presidency, which destroyed all such illusions) Bill Taft.

Roosevelt and Wilson were definately Progressives. Roosevelt went after shafty trusts, railroads, and slaughterhouses. Wilson was key in passing the Clayton anti-trust act, ending child labor (though the courts messed this up), and the 8 hour work day.
True enough. That's what happens when politicians try to grab a certain mantle - they help pass some of the agenda associated with it.

Anyone as classist and as gung-ho imperialist as Teddy Roosevelt, or as racist as Woodrow Wilson... is not *exactly* what Progressivism was supposed to be about. Although neither man was exactly a dyed-in-the-wool reactionary either.


Progressivism was frequently imperialist and racist. This gets downplayed in histories today, but it was absolutely part of the ideology. Opposition to imperialism would have been more of a conservative attitude in the period.

Not Really. Traditional Isolationism would be associated with conservatives of the time. But Anti-Imperalism? No, Eugene Debs and Emma Goldman were the biggest anti-imperalists out there after all. Progressivism should be seen as movement to reform the worst excesses of the post-civil war economic system in the US whose reins were frequently grabbed by leading politicians - partly due to a real desire to reform, but also partly simply just to get elected. No segment of US history was more populist than the first 15 or so years of the 20th century imo.
8865  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: How old should you have to be to... on: April 13, 2007, 04:29:21 pm
Buy birth control? 14
Have sex? 14 (Well it should be allowed, but it wouldn't encourage it.)
Get an abortion without parental involvement? Depends on the cause of the pregnancy.
Drink alcohol? NA
Buy alcohol? 16
Smoke cigarettes? 16
Buy cigarettes? 16
Watch a pornographic film? 16
Star in a pornographic film? 16
Drive? Never, Cars should be scraped as they are clearly evil. Otherwise 18 or so
Be able to drop out of school? 15
Rent your own apartment? 15
Own your own business? 16
Go to a strip club? 16
Fight a bull? 16
Choose to go to a different place of worship than your parents? 1 day old
8866  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Kurt Vonnegut dead at 84 on: April 13, 2007, 04:23:47 pm
He was a wise, wise fellow though I'm not a fan of either of the books of his I've read (for the record Slaughterhouse Five and The Sirens of Titan - it smacked too much of the cynical studenty intellectualism that I despise in alot of modern writing, even though I suppose Vonnegut got their first and was the best, his work was very quotable.)

Anyway RIP.
8867  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Your opinion of this moral code? on: April 13, 2007, 04:17:53 pm
As one wise man said, who just recently died "We're on this planet to fart around, don't let anyone tell you otherwise".

So, yes it's the only true way to live. So it goes.
8868  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: opinion of George Orwell? on: April 13, 2007, 04:15:06 pm
An overrated novelist (he lacked great imagination imo) but a brilliant journalist, and most definetly an admirable person.
8869  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of this quote on: April 13, 2007, 04:11:31 pm
Utter Shash. As long of course the Subjectivist realizes that one view of the universe and morality is a valid as any other (Especially including his own.)
8870  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Which Truely Has More Influence Over Libertarian Thought? on: April 07, 2007, 07:50:12 pm
Are you denying that Ayn Rand was a huge influence on the libertarian movement, despite her distancing herself from it?

No, I'm not. Many libertarians at least partially borrow from Rand's ideas, or have similar ideas with alterations, but by and large I don't feel that most libertarians are hardcore Randians. Rand is far from the only influence on the libertarian movement.

I know that, but she's probably the most important influence on the movement in the United States. At least more than anyone else I can think of. The likes of Hayek, Von Mises, Rothbard, etc are perhaps more important to academics, economists, etc but Rand seems to me the most influential thinker in terms of rank-and-file libertarians, generally.
8871  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: European Football Thread on: April 07, 2007, 07:39:04 pm
Why can't Chelsea and Man United both lose the premiership?

Anyway Come on Roma and Valencia!
8872  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Which Truely Has More Influence Over Libertarian Thought? on: April 07, 2007, 07:31:43 pm
Define "Libertarian" for a start.

If you mean the US defintion of the word, then Ayn Rand's warped concept of Liberty would be the winner, which of course in itself was influenced by Social darwinism.

Ayn Rand's philosophy was objectivism, which many consider to be a subset of libertarian philosophies. Apparently Rand wasn't too fond of libertarianism, lol.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism_and_Objectivism

Quote
To understand Rand's condemnation of libertarianism, one must also understand that the strategy of libertarianism is to create a "big tent" movement by deliberately refraining from adoption of any particular ethical philosophy. Libertarianism instead tends to bring together people who - for whatever reasons they may have - can support the idea of limited government. As a result, libertarians differ greatly and advocate capitalism on a variety of grounds, including grounds that are altruistic, majoritarian, or even hedonistic.

Rand's problems with political libertarianism seem to spring by that some libertarians are actually realists.. with morals ... (as shocking as that seems..)

Are you denying that Ayn Rand was a huge influence on the libertarian movement, despite her distancing herself from it?
8873  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: In a Break From the Past, Florida Will Let Felons Vote on: April 07, 2007, 04:13:58 pm
Why should a murderer, who took away an innocent citizens right to life, liberty and property continue to be allowed to have the same rights as a productive, law abiding citizen?

I agree: The entire Reagan administration should never be allowed to vote again.
8874  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Which Truely Has More Influence Over Libertarian Thought? on: April 07, 2007, 04:00:19 pm
Define "Libertarian" for a start.

If you mean the US defintion of the word, then Ayn Rand's warped concept of Liberty would be the winner, which of course in itself was influenced by Social darwinism.
8875  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Opinion of Deano on: April 07, 2007, 03:47:33 pm
Of course any time there is any topic that reaches over three pages in length BRTD has to make a poll about it. What is it with you? Do you need validation for every position that you hold or do you just like to torment us?

Confirming my BRTD-and-Opebo-are-the-same-troll theory?? Seriously BRTD, you need more of a life than I do.
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