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8851  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Is the Christian Right comparable to Fundamentalist Islam? on: January 16, 2008, 04:56:48 pm
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Well, I could recommend you An Introduction To Christian Economics by Gary North, but I don't think you'd give them a "fair reading" either. You're just slandering the people you disagree with you through religious means. If you are so eager to put religion out of politics, why are you trying to preach your social gospelism as if it had any sort of biblical basis?

Bono, as an aside, do you believe that the Bible justifies the Divine right of Kings?
8852  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Muslim Terrorists in action films on: January 16, 2008, 05:57:40 am
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Your rank and file Islamic militant is a brainwashed, poorly-educated religious fanatics without any real sophistication or complexity. You can do a lot more with an educated Soviet or Nazi character than you can with a simple-minded militant who grew up in a village and has only read one book in his whole life.

Not True.

But essentially correct but I can't people are missing the most important fact here: namely how damn cool a Russian Accent is.
8853  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Opinion of the preceding signuture part 2? on: January 16, 2008, 05:46:51 am
That's a mighty gay Irish guy

Who was born, lived nearly his entire life and never travelled outside of Auburn, California.

<Skip>
8854  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Opinion of the preceding signuture part 2? on: January 15, 2008, 03:53:56 pm
I like it alot - especially N. Thomas quote. For a politician he was a good man (even with dubious ideology).
8855  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Do you believe that 2007 will have the second coming of Jesus Christ? on: January 15, 2008, 03:47:00 pm
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Yes, it was. I didn't have any of that in mind; the same is true of plenty other antiquity figures. It's Jesus who is given a special status, but not a privileged one, on the contrary, because atheist writers will go to any lenghts to try to show He didn't exist.

Oooopsss... (actually my imagination here perhaps proves my later point.. interesting. Wink )

Anyway as I have already said I do believe that Jesus was a real person; even though as an agnostic I believe that most of his life stories as set in the gospels are fabricated (even ignoring the 'godly' stuff: How likely is it that Pilate would have met with Jesus before his execution? All that attention on a minor prophet - do you know how many of those there were in Judea at the time?)

Though I believe that the fabrication took place well before the gospels were written.

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And yet we have much more documents dealing with early Christianity...

Probably Culture. Though I'm just speculating here tbh. I admit when I say "I just don't know".

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That's not the kind of skepticism I was referring to. I was pointing out that if in your view you cannot know anything you don't experience directly, then you fall into a general septicism, not just a skepticism about religion--this is patently obvious if according to your view one cannot know Napoleon was defeated at Waterloo.

Perhaps 'know' is too clunky a word. I have received knowledge that Napoleon was defeated at Waterloo and that knowledge is known to reliable and true as written in both primary and secondary sources. But I don't 'know' that in the same way, I know what I ate this morning. Damn English language.
8856  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The Soviet Chamber of Horrors on: January 15, 2008, 03:41:00 pm
Blaming Karl Marx for the horrors of Mao and Stalin is like blaming Jesus or St Paul for the Crusades.

And yes we don't need to told that the Soviet Union was not a very nice place.
8857  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Should military service be a pre-requisite for the Secretary of Defense? on: January 15, 2008, 03:38:46 pm
No. Tempted to argue for the reverse; no-one with military service can have the position.
8858  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Do you believe that 2007 will have the second coming of Jesus Christ? on: January 15, 2008, 03:25:52 pm
True; but the expansion of Christanity was not a military event unlike Islam. Europe did not turn Christian under a force of arms; unlike say, Iran.
Most of Europe did, actually.

Yeah, 300+ years after Christ's death. Not quite the same thing. Though I admit I probably should shut up now - my late-Roman Empire knowledge isn't great.
8859  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Do you believe that 2007 will have the second coming of Jesus Christ? on: January 15, 2008, 03:19:41 pm
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We have is not just "western" biographies, is any kind of biography.

I know; what I got across from your post is that you believe Mohammed is given some reputation as 'untouchable' by western writers due to a supposed Islamic Sympathy? Or perhaps that was my imagination.

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Just as difficult as trying to explain the expansion of  Christianity without reference to Jesus.

True; but the expansion of Christanity was not a military event unlike Islam. Europe did not turn Christian under a force of arms; unlike say, Iran. In the Koran Mohammed leads conquests which almost certainly did occur; plotting the historical movements of troops on the globe is much easier to decipher than the early history of what was, an underground and much persecuted sect.

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Yes, so your worldview collapses into skepticism. I don't see how this especially commends it.

I don't think my worldview is particularly commendable. All I report is how I perceive it (or at least I try to), bring other factors into it without skepticism just leads to worst kinds of absolutism. How can we judge one person's opinion on a nebelous human concept - 'religion', 'ethics', 'morality', etc - over another if both people are use external and unprovable forces such as god as justification.
8860  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Do you believe that 2007 will have the second coming of Jesus Christ? on: January 15, 2008, 10:50:24 am
Also note unlike Jesus actual known political history has been attributed to Mohammed;

Though on the other hand (no... probably just a different finger) expecting to find known political history that was the direct result of the activities of the preacher son of a carpenter living in a largely illiterate society two thousand years ago is a little silly.


Err Yes, that is my point.

Bono compared the evidence for Jesus to the evidence to Mohammed, implying that the story of Mohammed is believed by Westerners (Whoever they are) not due to evidence but because of OMG POLITICAL CORRECTNESS OMG!!1111. I was merely refuting that. Anyway I tend to strongly believe that Jesus actually existed - even if the events of his life as told in the gospels are probably fabricated - since the alternative is to imply that someone made him up.
8861  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Do you believe that 2007 will have the second coming of Jesus Christ? on: January 15, 2008, 10:38:48 am
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Did you know that we only have one biography of Mohammed, written 212 years after his death, which used a source from about 100 years after his death, and yet "the historical scepticism of critical European scholarship is substantially less" where Muhammed is concerned! Are you going to put into doubt the records of the activities of Mohammed too?

Perhaps because, until recently, the western interest in the Islamic world was an esoteric intellectual taste?

Also note unlike Jesus actual known political history has been attributed to Mohammed; the rise of Islamic imperalism in the 100 years after his supposed death. Trying to explain that without reference to 'Mohammed' is rather difficult, no?

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Perhaps in a while, you'll be arguing that we cannot know anything about what happened before we were born.

Well, not in the same way I 'know' I am typing on the computer right now.
8862  Election Archive / 2008 Elections / Re: Nevada court declares Kucinich to be included in Democratic debate on: January 15, 2008, 10:26:27 am
What's with all the people who want to stop debate?

There is no measurable difference between the (spoken) policies of Obama, Edwards, and Clinton.  You might as well just present a two-hour orgy where everyone agrees to repeal NAFTA, bring back the troops, and then wink at each other and burst out laughing.
8863  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: How do you pronounce the name of the previous poster... on: January 15, 2008, 06:45:08 am
Gahb - ew.
8864  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: What do you think of this? on: January 14, 2008, 04:24:36 pm
Never has more truth been drawn... (with Quotation marks, o\c)
8865  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: What do/did your family work as? on: January 14, 2008, 04:17:15 pm
Great Great Great Great Great Grandfather? (dad’s dad’s dad’s dad’s  dad’s  dad’s dad) – Indian chief, Co-leader at the Battle of the Monongahela; killed in a raid by Anglo-Colonial forces about a year later; skull brought to Philadelphia.

You win Tongue

Not so, it is believed (though never conclusively proven) by alot of the members of my family that we are descended from a British soldier who decided to settle here during the Cromwellian invasion.

8866  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Muslim Terrorists in action films on: January 14, 2008, 04:15:53 pm
Perhaps because the current War on Terrah is so absurd it really needs a satirist, not a Schwarzeneggar?

And why do you act as if you Jingoism is a good thing? Not entirely unpredictable from you Mike, but still.

Why is loving your country a bad thing?

Because the way 'your country' was chosen was little more than a lucky shot in the great mankind sperm race. (or Unlucky, if you live in the Third world.)

Loving 'your' country; the concept amuses me as I don't love mine. Not that Joe Republic isn't correct when he says there is a difference between Jingoism (OMG LETS GO KILL THOSE SANDNIGGAHS!11111) to patriotism.
8867  Election Archive / 2008 Elections / Re: Who is the next President of the United States? on: January 14, 2008, 12:25:58 pm
McCain.
8868  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Muslim Terrorists in action films on: January 14, 2008, 11:56:04 am
Perhaps because the current War on Terrah is so absurd it really needs a satirist, not a Schwarzeneggar?

And why do you act as if you Jingoism is a good thing? Not entirely unpredictable from you Mike, but still.
8869  Election Archive / 2008 Elections / Re: The 28 Electoral Votes of the Netherlands will go to the Democrats on: January 13, 2008, 03:35:14 pm
Yes. There are religious nuts EVERYWHERE.

Except there is no similiar party anywhere else in Europe. And in the Netherlands the moderate calvinist (and I think Lutheran too but I am not expert) is already taken up by the Christian Democrats and among the more populist ones, the Christian Unity Party.

It should be noted that the Netherlands had de facto religious toleration well before the rest of Europe did - which led to a highly competitive religious enviornment while maintaining a 'permissive' state - I think that Holland's liberal laws and the SGP are both legacies of that.
8870  Election Archive / 2008 Elections / Re: The 28 Electoral Votes of the Netherlands will go to the Democrats on: January 13, 2008, 03:28:50 pm
The Netherlands isn't liberal and certainly isn't left-wing by any sane standard. People should not confuse permissiveness with liberalism, especially when they obviously have no idea what the traditional structure of Dutch society looks like...

So you mean to tell me that the Dutch lifestyle isn't at the very least socially liberal? Do me a favor, snob, and don't tell me I obviously have no idea concerning this issue when I have read a bit on it. I'm not some ignorant American when it comes to European issues like you think I am, Al.

The Dutch lifestyle (note that word, not laws) isn't very liberal outside of the typical havens associated with liberalism in the western world (such as Amsterdam) - if the netherlands was that liberal why do the extreme Calvinist Reformed Political Party always end up with at least 2 seats in parliament?
8871  Forum Community / Off-topic Board / Re: What's the last movie you've seen? on: January 13, 2008, 03:14:52 pm
Also just saw Charlie Wilson's War.

Great performances by all, but Phillip Seymour Hoffman stole the show. That guy needs a lot more roles like that.

Having just saw it and yes, I can't believe I'm saying this, but I agree with you BRTD.
8872  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Is the Christian Right comparable to Fundamentalist Islam? on: January 13, 2008, 03:08:41 pm
No; not quite. The social and cultural worldview is somewhat different (though they would agree in principle on many of the same things.) - though with the increasing "imperalism" of the Christian right - "Nuke Mecca", etc - I might have to change that opinion.
8873  General Discussion / History / Re: Do you think that Gerald Ford was a good President? on: January 08, 2008, 12:48:19 pm
He was better than his predecessor and successor.  That is not saying much.

Indeed.

Ford did OK given the people that surrounded him, East Timor and the Nixon pardon apart I can't think of anything too offensive which happened during his presidency.
8874  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Which foreign leader does the preceding poster remind you of? on: January 08, 2008, 07:03:18 am
Ehhh... Lula. I guess.
8875  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Which of the following do you support? on: January 07, 2008, 05:00:57 pm
Oh.. one of these things again. Anyway..

Support[/u]
Safe Injection Sites
Needle Exchange Program
Heroin Maintenence Program
Legalized Prostitution

Oppose[/u]
Prosecution of Unlicensed MP3 Downloaders
Parental Notification for Minors Obtaining an Abortion
Parental Consent for Minors Obtaining an Abortion
Incarceration of Private Drug Users
Hospitals Required to Report Illegal Aliens Recieving Treatment
Government Access to Library, Telephone Records
Continued Military Presence at Guantanamo Bay
Continued Policy of Embargo Against Cuba
Retroactive Immunity for Government Agents Engaged in Waterboarding

Well....[/u]
Ban on 'Partial Birth' Abortion -> Yes. If the Fetus is a viable entity outside the womb. How 'far' we should go is another thing. Whatever restrictions there can be will always be terribly arbitrary.

Legalized Brothels -> Not really a fan of this idea though in theory I have nothing against it as much as I have against private prostitution and Brothels are easier to regulate. BUT many Amsterdam legal brothels are still connected to crime rings which use that business to show 'legitimacy' and there is the horrible 'industry' side to it. Should be legal but should of course be regulated to an extreme amount

U.S. Switches to the Metric System -> Don't Care; would be useful next time I go to the US o/c

U.S. Lowers its Drinking Age -> Don't Care. Though 21 seems a bit excessive and ridiculous, but then again it would to an Irish person.


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