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8926  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 06, 2007, 06:15:27 am
You're one day late. Lá an crúiscín was the fourth. Happy belated congratulations to everyone who knows what I'm referring to btw!

I think I'm embarrased to admit that I actually don't know what you're talking about.

"The majority of the members of the Irish parliament are professional politicians, in the sense that otherwise they would not be given jobs minding mice at a crossroads."


This is a country where the likes of Michael Lowry constantly top polls at general elections so..
8927  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 06, 2007, 04:32:54 am
Actually as a random aside does anyone have a link to or knowledge of how much % of people in each US state claim Irish ancestory. (NY First; MA second; PA probably third I'm sure but the rest.. just curious.)

Color scheme?

Fantastic none the less (I can't believe I forgot about NJ) though I must say some of those are really, well, unusual.. what's with the Irish cluster in Western Montana\North Idaho.
8928  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 06, 2007, 04:25:42 am
I long for it in much the same way an Orthodox Jew longs for the Promised Land.


You part Irish Soulty?

Actually as a random aside does anyone have a link to or knowledge of how much % of people in each US state claim Irish ancestory. (NY First; MA second; PA probably third I'm sure but the rest.. just curious.)

Generally negative, although I like how much drinking goes on there.

8929  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Should bars be allowed to be open 24 hours? on: October 06, 2007, 03:45:31 am
Of course. Having same-set closing time just leads to having all the drunks on the streets at the very same time. Which really isn't a good idea.
8930  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 06:51:27 pm
Genuine LOL at perhaps Dublin South not being representative
You're right thtat it's far from a burning issue - and that's true just about everywhere, but it's certainly a core FF issue and one with which most Irish people (rightly or wrongly) would probably agree on. It's almost a default position.

Nah most of Dublin South isn't much different from your average lower\middle-middle class outer suburb regions. Except it has Dundrum in it, which for our foreigners here, is a small suburban town which contains a shopping centre the size of a castle where mindless female zombies women of a certain caliber tend to go shopping and whenever you enter your will to live decreases dramatically. And the University College Dublin campus on it; which is known (and mostly true from my experience) to attract a certain type of rich airhead. Most of the really posh areas are in the constituencies of Dun Laoghaire and Dublin South East. Though then again I live only down the road from Foxrock (uber-Posh area) to one side of me and on the other side there is plently of executive housing apart in a more semi-rural areas (I of course live a housing estate like most Dublin Southians.)
8931  Forum Community / Forum Community Election Match-ups / Re: opebo vs. Guy Picciotto on: October 05, 2007, 06:44:36 pm
Well yes, these lyrics don't seem like the type of thing Italians would write

I- I believed- Memory might mirror no reflection on me,
I-I believed- that in forgetting I might set myself free.
But I woke up this morning with a piece of past caught in my throat- AND I CHOKED.
I- I bled- I tried to hide the heart from the head.
I- I bled- in the arms of a girl I'd barely met.
And I woke up this morning with the present in splinters on the ground- and THEN I DROWNED.

There is something about the image of those lyrics and your signature of Larry Craig which just clashes so much it's horrible. It's like imagining Sylvia Plath's poetry while seeing a bunch of naked old dead corpses having sex with each other in front of you. It's just wrong. (And no I don't tend to compare Emo verse to Plath.. Emo is just Plath-wannabism anyway. Excepts it fails epically. Those are among the worst lyrics I've ever seen. So bad it's brilliant.)
8932  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 06:33:56 pm
Well when I mentioned FF, I meant the membership at large or maybe core FF voters, not the parliamentary party in particular.

And my broad point was that given the broad numbers of people here who would support unification (however soft that support may be) it's unfair to label someone as hating Ireland when they fall in line with a likely majority of Irish citizens on the issue.

Ahh.. Tongue in Cheek? (Anyway alot of people I'm sure think I hate Ireland; which actually is something I'm making my mind up over. Wink )

Your perhaps right about the small party membership; though I don't know about actual mainstream voters - around here having a United Ireland is about as big an issue as whether or not we should have Orange colored bins to go with the black and green ones. But then again I do live in Dublin South. So perhaps it's not representative.
8933  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Name the ideology of the preceding poster... on: October 05, 2007, 06:28:11 pm
Nazism (Trend after all)
8934  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 06:27:40 pm
I found that Abortion survey quite interesting btw. But that doesn't mean I think attitudes are changing; I still suspect that this is yet another example of the infamous Irish tendency towards groupthink.

Plus like always if we actually had a referendum on it we still wouldn't get it past, history shows that people tend to swing towards the conservative option during an actual campaign. (It happened in Divorce 1986, Divorce 1995, Abortion 1983, etc)
8935  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 06:21:48 pm
I don't think that's a particularly fair argument. I don't think either of the two groups you put forward are actually overly concerned with unity - the hard left has essentially abandoned republicanism altogether and those young thugs really have no broad political ideology that has any amount of thought put into it.

The aim of a United Ireland is just about the only thing that really binds Fianna Fáil together, the move into Northern politics underlines how important it is to their pysche.

I have no doubt that a vote on unity would pass by a huge margin on this side of the border

Well the far left is so fragmented over here that it's often hard to tell. The major *snigger* far left group seem either obssesed with the cult of Che Guevara and good-ole America bashing (the SWP) while the other is an organization almost entirely dependent the figure of one man (The Socialist Party). Of course neither group is particularly Republican but there is still a significant republican element among far left group. And I'd say the majority of Ideological republicans have left wing sympathies.

As for Fianna fail, pardon my cynicism while I state that the only thing I think holding FF together a bunch of politicians protecting their careers. FF being the party of whatever happens to be in Fashion ATM, I doubt a united Ireland is much more than aspirational aim among FFers and that would be true nowadays of FGers too except for perhaps the most commited Anglos in the party.

I would think a referendum on unification would be close once it became apparent how much it would cost and the fact that we would have put up with Unionists for the unforseeable future.
8936  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 06:15:39 pm
Alot of people when it comes to Ireland (and Scotland too) seem to think things are alot more 'conservative' (for want of a better word) than they actually are.

Only people who abuse the word conservative.

I don't think Ireland is a conservative place; a more accurate term I'd say is complacent. (And still is; while attitudes towards "moral issues" ie. issues relating to sex have somewhat liberalized over the past 30 years - especially the last 10 and the Catholic church's institutional power has declined significantly - though it's still not completely irrelevant as many would think - I don't think the general attitude of the average Irish person has changed too much over a really long period of time.)

As Jas would know, I don't exactly hold a high opinion of "middle Ireland".

Dublin is ridiculous. In all sorts of ways, but particularly expense wise.
I'd advise avoiding Dublin in favour of the great beyond myself.

But that means we'll have to give up such modern convincies like flushing toilets and central heating. I mean I almost live in Kildare now FFS and it's full of bleedin' savages who eat their young. (Note: not actually a joke when referring to Naas. No really..... Sorry, not really.. Yes I think only Jas would understand the reference but it was worth it anyway) I mean I can't imagine what voodoo magic and cant you produce down the country.. I'll have to farm next. Wink

Don't think I can bring myself to agree with all of this. Certainly, there were Irish who benefitted from the Empire and the whole 800 years of oppression thing is certainly overplayed, but there have been a series of very significant grievances.

Undoubtely the problem is with trying to make a balanced history is you have to emphasize the bits which are often left out. (Daniel O'Connell was a strong supporter of the British Empire and there was a significant Catholic element which after emancipation did quite well out of it, Wolfe Tone was an atheist.. something many nationalists don't like bringing up, etc.)
8937  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 06:03:40 pm
Why do you hate Ireland?

I surely do not. I fully support Irish re-unification and the freedom fighter corps aka IRA.

It's funny States because I doubt you like to associate yourself with basically the only people left in Ireland who strongly support a united state. (As a reality; not as a mere hypothetical.) And they are:

1) Hard left Socialist-Nationalists; and Ireland has a history of left-wing Nationalism - basically people who see the current Dublin goverment as British pawns in the fight against the British capitalist system which once defeated will give us a Gaelic utopia for us all.

2) If you ever travel in Ireland for long enough (actually that not long) you will inevitably see graffiti written walls with slogans like "Up the 'Ra" or "Eire 32" - generally these people tend belong to the "Young thugs" caste you seem to hate so much.

Btw, Lol@Kevin Myers. Believe it or not for a long time he was something of a hero (slight overstatement; but only slight) to me.
8938  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 05:55:49 pm
I have quite a bit of Irish blood in me, but I've never really researched it much.  I know much more about the Scottish, German, and Norwegian... but my temper is pretty short, which I like to blame on my Irish blood.

I'd also love to visit Ireland, but like England, it'd probably be terribly expensive.  And I think the weather would drive me nuts.. I guess all that emerald green comes at a price Smiley

Overall, my opinion of Ireland is moderately positive.  They've had a tough last oh... 1,000 years or so.

Potato Famine aside what's happened in Ireland in the past 1,000 years isn't really much worse than any other country. Quite alot of Irish people (Catholics and Protestants; though Catholics only really after 1829 or so) benefitted fairly well from the British Empire; often among the Merchant classes we were more the exploitees than the exploited.

As for it being expensive, well Dublin is pretty damn expensive to live in (which is why I hope to emigrate after I complete my undergrad; though that's not the only reason) and alot of the country especially west of the River Shannon is very economically dependant on tourist income. Apparently we are second most expensive country to live in the EU behind Finland. Oh dear.
8939  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 05:51:28 pm
Very, Very True.

The worst ones all had moustaches for some reason.

May I ask were you travelling just in Dublin or out on the National bus service.


Ah yes, well perhaps needless to say if you travelling a good distance outside the Pale well then you might have problems with the roads for one thing.

As for Moustaches, it seems to be a fashion thing (seen it plently of times). Though nowadays I'd say half of the bus drivers are of non-Irish origin. Still they are picking the crazy up somewhere.

Alas, every Irish I have met over here is very prone to breaking into song.  Enough said!

I have a friend who is going over to Thailand in the summer btw; if you ever meet him I doubt he'll break into song. But you won't meet him, what you do isn't his thing. Most Irish people have more self-respect than you.

Should be reunited. Positive though, especially county Monaghan, where one side of my family is from.

Why do you hate Ireland?
8940  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Is it ok for white people.... on: October 05, 2007, 05:47:07 pm
What exactly is white people's "History and heritage"?

Our founding of civilization perhaps?

Well according to the latest archaelogical evidence the first civilisations (Define Civilisation for a start? Here I'm referring just to settled towns) were based around South America and were probably ethnically Mextico.

And should go without that "civilization" has not exactly been without it's bad aspects (how people are now dead in the name of "civilization"?)
8941  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Name the ideology of the preceding poster... on: October 05, 2007, 05:42:37 pm
Fascism is Authoritarianism, and I despise any type of Authoritarianism. one of my favorite films is America...Freedom to Fascism. Fascism is the synergetic efforts of big Government and Big business to surpress the people.

Thus my slash.. your political beliefs stem from the same places fascism did in Germany or in Italy. Reactionism mixed with disillusion with the tradition right and hatred of the left. Note I used the word "Neo".

But perhaps Conservative Reactionary suits you better.
8942  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The GOP continues transforming into a populist party on: October 05, 2007, 05:40:30 pm
"Free trade" deals have destroyed the American middle class. Even Republicans have a hard time denying this.

Most of the laws of those deals once the small print was written were clearly designed to merely give fixed advantages to certain American companies. (See: My Antigua thread)

Of course there needs to some system of regulation regardless. But the move towards Nativism is something that should scare us all.
8943  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Name the ideology of the preceding poster... on: October 05, 2007, 05:34:08 pm
Stark's Ideology (whatever that is) and it's origins in the US would be pretty interesting to study..

I'll just say Reactionary Conservative\Neo-Fascist.
8944  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 05:32:06 pm
The bus drivers are insane.

Very, Very True. Pity we have quite possibly have the worst system of Rail transport in the Western World. (Seriously you Brits who complain about Railtrack\Network Rail have no idea how lucky you have it.)

But yes there are plently of bus drivers' stories to tell. May I ask were you travelling just in Dublin or out on the National bus service.

Best breakfasts ever Smiley

Not a fan of a hot breakfast sadly. Really more of a cereal man. Perhaps that's because I live in the most Americanized\Anglocized parts of the country but nah.. never got the whole Sausage and egg at 8am thing..
8945  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Opinion of Ireland. on: October 05, 2007, 05:22:12 pm

Might aswell get with the trend. Smiley
8946  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: If you were a notable politician, would you regularly wear a flag lapel pin? on: October 05, 2007, 05:19:46 pm
If I were a notable US politician, yes, I probably would.  Why?  Because if I were a notable US politician, I'd probably have already sold so many of my principles to get elected that I might as well go with the flow and do the necessary song and dance.

Hence why I am never going to be a notable politician.
8947  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Is it ok for white people.... on: October 05, 2007, 05:19:17 pm
What exactly is white people's "History and heritage"?
8948  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: American College Students Overwhelmed by Debt on: October 05, 2007, 05:17:46 pm
This thread makes me glad of the Irish system.

Though It was very hard to resist the temptation to smash the computer screen when Sam Spade went "Something useless like English or Philosophy".

I may occasionally be an asshole, but my response is merely meant to point out that I wish you good luck in trying to find any decent job with simply an English or Philosophy undergraduate degree.  I personally have a similar type of degree to those mentioned from an excellent university attended by another poster here, and that was the case for me as well.

Oh fair enough. (Though for some people Secondary teaching would certainly be a "decent job" not for me though.) May I ask what your degree was in and what college exactly? Admittely as someone who is currently an undergraduate I'm not aware of how things work in Ireland in regards to employment vis a vis certain types of degrees (I intend to do a postgrad anyway.)
8949  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Post something blatantly untrue about the preceding poster on: October 05, 2007, 02:38:40 pm
Is a member of the local Bayern Munchen fan club.
8950  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Is Economics a Pseudo-Science? on: October 05, 2007, 01:28:27 pm
Only retarded aspects of it like "trickle down" policies which is one of the dumbest most retarded things I have ever heard of.

Going Slightly OT:

Btw, the original idea behind any aspects of supply side economics - the Laffer Curve (which was used as part of Ronald Reagan's 1980 platform. ie. The idea essentially without going into too much detail that it's possible to cut taxes and increase {esp. defence} spending at the same time without going into debt as the tax cuts would increase revenue) was originally formulated on Dick Cheney's napkin.
How do you explain the increase in revenue that followed the implementation of the flat tax in Russia?

Links to Statistics - from a non-biased website - please. (Of course there are many things which could explain this such as say the levelling off for tax evasion by some of the super-wealthy.) It should also be noted that my original post wasn't an attack on supply side economics just an interesting aside comments. Funny that you would read it that way.

Well, you act to make that change. For instance, if you think you're better off with a car than with the €15,000 it costs, you buy the car. The notion of what is better as it concerns economics is entirely subjective. It just means that the person acts to attain the state of affairs she percieves as better.

True. But you're implying that "better" neccesarily is linked to consumption and trade. If each individual thought themselves as well-off already and without need for purchases (within reason o\c, there's always neccesary goods like food, etc) then your theories would begin to fall apart, no? It's also worth mentioning here the role that advertising can play in creating demand which did not previously exist, which has always struck me as somewhat explotative.

After reading this, I think your problem is not so much that you have a low view of social sciences, but that you have a too high view of natural sciences. No empirical science, natural or social, can claim to arrive at any sort of objective truth since they always practice the fallacy of affirming the consequent.
Aside from that, no one claims that economic laws predict the behaviour of every person in precise detail. Laws in social sciences only present tendencies.
Also, I don't see how you can claim that there isn't scarcity on a pre-agrarian society. Even if you limit yourself to food, there is the issue of the food varieties that can be gathered, preferences, work and time that are needed to gather food that could be spend painting on the cavern walls, etcaetera.

Yes but tendencies themselves are mainly dictated by cultural factors; the idea that humans shall always crave more as a general tendency being the most noteworthy thing there. What we define as rational in both an economic and general sense is defined by our culture and society (both of which are defined around consumption.) and it tends not to note such as things as shifting ideas or even technology. Milton Friedman made the interesting point that in the 20th Century dramatic stock market shifts tended to be reliant on new technology, for example in the 20s expansion of mass production into transport, the Automobile and transport boom which played a major part in creating the massive bubble which popped in 1929 - the same can be said btw of the relationship (on a smaller scale o\c) between the Tech boom and the bust of the late 90s\early 00s.

As for pre-Agriarian societies, well in a way you are correct should you decide to consider time as a resource; but I was thinking strictly in the sense of trade, production and consumption in many pre-Agriarian societies (such as say, the Modern Bushmen of the Kalihari desert at least until more recent attempts at intregration) tend to live entirely within self-sufficiency. So in a sense there is no economic growth (except in good hunting years, etc) and nor any real trade to an outside partner (again until recently) but rather a state of statis where what is demanded is only what can be expected and what can just live on.

Now what would happen if that became the state of affairs in the west.

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