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13801  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Monthly Obama Forum Approval - June 2009 on: June 21, 2009, 10:10:00 pm
Between somewhat approve and strongly approved, but it's on an upward trajectory, I suppose.

Senate Democrats on the other hand...

Don't get me started.

They're a bunch of hokes, and Reid is quite possibly the worst leader we could be stuck with. But the Senate would fight a little harder if Obama bothered to stick his nose into a debate, forcefully, for once. Senate Democrats have no courage partially because they have no proper leader.
13802  Election Archive / 2010 Gubernatorial Election Polls / Re: Strickland +2 Over Kasich on: June 21, 2009, 10:07:30 pm
Please, please, please, let this fool Kasich into running.
13803  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FRANZL ELECTION TRACKER (UPDATED AS OF 5:02 PM EASTERN, SUNDAY 6/21/2009) on: June 21, 2009, 09:56:33 pm
It's clear if you take the time to actually read the books, as Afleitch posted, it's not clear only because of the clouding of the facts made by those who want to register as much of The 25's as possible and because of not needing to really be this strict in the past.

Let's not spin this 'till its head flies off. The actual law is unclear. Outside sources, such as comments in the New Register Thread and the SoFA Law Wiki, can be added and edited by anyone, whether they have a full understanding of the actual statute or not.

Based on the text that is codified as law, the matter is unclear and relies on whether you take a strict or broad interpretation of the law.

Could you please explain to me how registering to vote before you have the eligibility requirements being okay makes sense?

We do it in the US...

As mentioned earlier, if your 18th birthday is before election day, you can "register" to vote before your birthday, but are not eligible to vote until you actually turn 18. So too here, you should be allowed to register, but only be allowed to vote when you hit 25 posts + 7 days.

A 25 post requirement is different than aging. We may as well just abolish voter registration altogether and let anyone vote who has 25 posts. Roll Eyes
13804  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Office Of MaxQue Campaign for the Pacific Regional Seat on: June 21, 2009, 09:51:47 pm
I'm sure you and I will be close allies in the Senate, Max. I can't wait to have you with us.
13805  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FRANZL ELECTION TRACKER (UPDATED AS OF 5:02 PM EASTERN, SUNDAY 6/21/2009) on: June 21, 2009, 09:51:06 pm
It's clear if you take the time to actually read the books, as Afleitch posted, it's not clear only because of the clouding of the facts made by those who want to register as much of The 25's as possible and because of not needing to really be this strict in the past.

Let's not spin this 'till its head flies off. The actual law is unclear. Outside sources, such as comments in the New Register Thread and the SoFA Law Wiki, can be added and edited by anyone, whether they have a full understanding of the actual statute or not.

Based on the text that is codified as law, the matter is unclear and relies on whether you take a strict or broad interpretation of the law.

Could you please explain to me how registering to vote before you have the eligibility requirements being okay makes sense?
13806  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Constitutional Revampification Amendment (Debating) on: June 21, 2009, 09:48:25 pm
My concerns have less to do with the regions (though it does irk me a little bit) and more to do with this unnecessary proposal to create a bicameral legislature. I oppose any effort to create a second house of government like that (unless it's the old proposal of the Council of Governors) and that's non-negotiable for me.
13807  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FRANZL ELECTION TRACKER (UPDATED AS OF 5:02 PM EASTERN, SUNDAY 6/21/2009) on: June 21, 2009, 09:44:33 pm
But no one told that to Barnes after he registered. I mean, why would he be looking in the "New Register" thread? It wasn't mentioned till just a few days ago, so he wouldn't of had time to be able to register and vote. It was our mistake for not telling him.

Maybe. But ignorance of the law, if this is what we presume the law to be, is no excuse I'm afraid.

That I agree with. Ignorance of the law does not make up for not abiding by the law. That said, I have doubts as to whether this, in fact, deviated from the law to the extent that Barnes's vote would be discounted. I usually prefer to see as few votes invalidated as possible and so side with a broader interpretation of the law, but it is up to the SoFA and the courts to decide this one.

I agree. Which is why I'll be taking it to the court. I don;t know if there are any other votes that may be affected in this race

Your lawsuit will have my full support, and if you don't take it to court, I will. Wink People can't just hop in and say they want to vote and expect us to count your posts. The law is quite clear that you register AFTER you get the required amount of posts.

It's not clear, that's the problem.

It's clear if you take the time to actually read the books, as Afleitch posted, it's not clear only because of the clouding of the facts made by those who want to register as much of The 25's as possible and because of not needing to really be this strict in the past.
13808  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Constitutional Revampification Amendment (Debating) on: June 21, 2009, 09:37:13 pm
Well, aside from my personal problems with some of these things and questions of their necessity, I don't think the Senate is the place for these kind of broad sweeping changes. Massive changes to constitutions are why ConCons are called.

There is no reason the senate cannot do this, so long as the it passes public referendum. The reason ConCons are held is to bypass the slowness, divides, and inefficiencies in the senate, and get a new constitution quickly. Ironically, the ConCon is worse in this case.

Not to mention, a ConCon is there for far more sweeping change. This maintains most of the current system, in truth, as it is specifically aimed at regional reform through the national constitution.

Also, it includes provisions largely supported by the Convention delegates.

It doesn't maintain the current system at all. You butcher the Senate and turn, unnecessarily, our system into a bicameral legislature, and make the regional executive branches flimsy.

The regional executives could be strengthened by regional constitutions. And these reforms are hardly unnecessary. This prompts regional constitutional reform, involves more people in the national government and better connects the voices of the regions and the federal government.

Reforms are needed, but not these "just because" changes and unnecessary complications. What rationale is there for changing our system into a bicameral legislature? (And how, again, is that keeping within the current framework at all)
13809  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Constitutional Revampification Amendment (Debating) on: June 21, 2009, 09:09:06 pm
Well, aside from my personal problems with some of these things and questions of their necessity, I don't think the Senate is the place for these kind of broad sweeping changes. Massive changes to constitutions are why ConCons are called.

There is no reason the senate cannot do this, so long as the it passes public referendum. The reason ConCons are held is to bypass the slowness, divides, and inefficiencies in the senate, and get a new constitution quickly. Ironically, the ConCon is worse in this case.

Not to mention, a ConCon is there for far more sweeping change. This maintains most of the current system, in truth, as it is specifically aimed at regional reform through the national constitution.

Also, it includes provisions largely supported by the Convention delegates.

It doesn't maintain the current system at all. You butcher the Senate and turn, unnecessarily, our system into a bicameral legislature, and make the regional executive branches flimsy.
13810  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FRANZL ELECTION TRACKER (UPDATED AS OF 5:02 PM EASTERN, SUNDAY 6/21/2009) on: June 21, 2009, 09:04:22 pm
But no one told that to Barnes after he registered. I mean, why would he be looking in the "New Register" thread? It wasn't mentioned till just a few days ago, so he wouldn't of had time to be able to register and vote. It was our mistake for not telling him.

Maybe. But ignorance of the law, if this is what we presume the law to be, is no excuse I'm afraid.

That I agree with. Ignorance of the law does not make up for not abiding by the law. That said, I have doubts as to whether this, in fact, deviated from the law to the extent that Barnes's vote would be discounted. I usually prefer to see as few votes invalidated as possible and so side with a broader interpretation of the law, but it is up to the SoFA and the courts to decide this one.

I agree. Which is why I'll be taking it to the court. I don;t know if there are any other votes that may be affected in this race

Your lawsuit will have my full support, and if you don't take it to court, I will. Wink People can't just hop in and say they want to vote and expect us to count your posts. The law is quite clear that you register AFTER you get the required amount of posts.
13811  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: The Atlasian Sentinel: Regional Elections Update on: June 21, 2009, 08:58:17 pm
Among those to not vote for the bill was Senator HappyWarrior(DA-MD), who said, "I like the bill but I think it violates the powers of the regions." He voted abstain. The only senator to vote nay on the bill was Senator Marokai (JCP-AZ) who, when questioned as to why he voted nay, said, "The bill, I think, unfortunately falls victim to the idea that if we make kids work, we can make all children scientists, mathematicians, astronauts, historians, football players, and so on, rather than giving all kids a basic education in all subjects, and focusing on what kids are most proficient in."

I appreciate you putting that in. Smiley
13812  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: The Atlasian Sentinel: Regional Elections Update on: June 21, 2009, 08:56:57 pm
I support having a 10 member House. Maybe elected the 5 Senators based on Regions, and have a 10 member house elected based on STV (or better yet, MMP) with 2 month terms.

I'm sorry, but why? There's no need for those changes, you can establish pretty much the same thing just by changing some elections and tacking 5 more seats to the Senate.

I have no intention of going along with unnecessary change or shuffling.
13813  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Repeal of the Magnetic Levitation Research Act (At Final Vote) on: June 21, 2009, 08:54:13 pm
Aye, why not. Tongue
13814  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Constitutional Revampification Amendment (Debating) on: June 21, 2009, 08:52:55 pm
Well, aside from my personal problems with some of these things and questions of their necessity, I don't think the Senate is the place for these kind of broad sweeping changes. Massive changes to constitutions are why ConCons are called.
13815  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Monthly Obama Forum Approval - June 2009 on: June 21, 2009, 03:05:31 pm
Somewhat disapprove. I support principles, not people, and I'm a bit disappointed in the people in this thread.
13816  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of the Issue, part 66 on: June 21, 2009, 05:11:50 am
Ideally, no, but I have no problem with publicly funded media outlets as long as the government has no direct control over content, and of course that the majority of the media is still privately owned.
13817  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: The Atlasian Sentinel: More Election News on: June 21, 2009, 03:57:22 am
Why does your "Old Senate" only have 9 members?

By the way, relating to the whole Constitution problem, I've offered a major Amendment for consideration by the Senate. Feel free to tear it apart. Seriously though, I invite you all to jump into the debate when MasterJedi opens up the thread in the Government board. You guys are allowed to post in those deliberations and this is an important Amendment (that you will all, hopefully, ge tot vote on).

1. Ew.

2. We have a constitutional convention for these things, PS.
13818  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: State by State Favorites: South Dakota on: June 20, 2009, 10:41:30 pm
McGovern
13819  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Do you believe life begins at conception? on: June 20, 2009, 10:27:31 pm
If life ends when the brain stops functioning, why should life begin before the brain begins functioning... or even before it's created?

Well put.
13820  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Universal Health Care Bills Include Fed-Run Public Plan as Option on: June 20, 2009, 10:23:37 pm
I am sure you all have heard of how Tom Daschle, Bob Dole, and Howard Baker have effectively called on President Obama to drop his call for a government-run public plan to compete against private health insurance companies, and settle for something less, like a co-op as Sen. Kent Conrad (D -ND) has advocated. 

What do you all think?  Would you still support a health care bill with a co-op as opposed to a fed-run public plan?   

No, I think it's time to join the rest of the developed western democracies and implement true universal healthcare, not nibbling that won't solve the problem.
13821  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FRANZL ELECTION TRACKER (UPDATED AS OF 5:40 AM EASTERN, SATURDAY 6/20/2009) on: June 20, 2009, 08:24:50 pm
Each of the other instances had witness accounts or evidence that there were technical errors (such as the vote appearing on the profile posts but not in the actual thread) but there were no such documented evidence or witness accounts for Gustaf. We're essentially taking his word for it, and in the close nature of this election, that would be unwise.
13822  Election Archive / 2012 Elections / Re: Texas WILL Stay Republican on: June 20, 2009, 06:37:55 pm
Texas will go Republican in 2012 for sure, in 2016 it will be closer. 2020 is the year to look at, because Demographics are weakening the Republicans there, and all over the country, and it's only a matter of time until Texas becomes competitive. It will just take a couple more Presidential election cycles before that happens.

Trends don't last forever. I've read articles from just six years ago that said the GOP had a lock on the youth.

Populations don't often switch, the trends just sort of stop in their tracks. The damage already being done to the Republicans is largely irreparable from already existing voters, barring major policy shifts. They can reverse the trends though, with time.

As for young voters, even if you read it, that wasn't true. Young voters were Kerry's best voting group five years ago. There's no evidence to show that the GOP ever had a "lock" on younger voters since, pretty much, the Reagan years.
13823  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Constitutional Convention / Re: Presidential Parliamentarian (Motion Passed, Resuming Discussion) on: June 20, 2009, 06:00:33 pm
I would say that the Midwest election is competitive. It would be more competitive if you, Jas, and Lewis Trondheim voted for Fritz.

Ah, competition by compulsion, I hadn't thought of that Wink

Well, with all due respect, Fritz is fairly close to your ideologies, and if you didn't spend so much time complaining about salads and talking about "loonyism" and more time taking things seriously and giving proper candidates due consideration, elections might turn out differently than they do now. You act like class clowns and then complain when the class doesn't turn out well.
13824  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FRANZL ELECTION TRACKER (UPDATED AS OF 5:40 AM EASTERN, SATURDAY 6/20/2009) on: June 20, 2009, 03:32:08 pm
Kyle just invalidated his vote by voting in both booths...

President

[ X ] Senator PiT [PiT (The Physicist)]/Senator HappyWarrior [hannibal]
Regional Protection Party/Democratic Alliance




Mideast Senator

[ 1 ] KyleGordon2016
[ 2 ] Persepolis





Perhaps he has a reason. Gustaf also voted twice, but his vote will still count.

News to me.
13825  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: The "Repair Our Wiki" Project! (R.O.W.) on: June 20, 2009, 04:17:09 am
This was long overdue: http://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Repair_Our_Wiki! Tongue

Also, I fixed a few errors on some of the recently wiki'd laws, moved all of the "-Bill" articles to "-Act" (I made the same mistake, Dan) and created a new category to slap onto things like ROW or Ben's organization, "Citizen Organizations," since "Media Sources" didn't really fit.
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