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76  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Congressional Elections / Re: Did Ossoff even stand a chance? on: June 22, 2017, 11:49:30 am
Ossoff's strategy of running on ending government waste seemed phony to me. Sure, the attacks on him for being a "San Francisco liberal" were just as bad but calling for an end to government waste isn't promising much. Every politician promises it but there's not much to cut. It doesn't get to the core issues of the country. He ran on nothing and couldn't win over people who might have given him a chance. Of course, in a district like this it would be hard to run on Medicare for all and increasing taxes on the rich. It will be hard for Democrats to win districts like this which are exclusively white, rich suburbanites, especially if they voted for Trump. They will do better to stick with districts that have either more minorities, college students or working class folks who can be won over with a more traditional Democratic argument.

I must say I called this race completely wrong, largely because I over estimated the willingness of said demographic to flip in the era of, and in reaction to, Trump. Even more so because of how much the situation has degraded to the point where I seriously doubt Trump even makes it through the year. Against that backdrop, I expected the results to be far worse.
77  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HOUSE BILL: Atlasian Aid Protection Act (Debating) on: June 22, 2017, 03:16:43 am
Quote
(1) This act legislates that recipients of Atlasian aid money shall not be ineligible for such assistance solely on the basis of the health or medical services that said group offers.

(2) This Act also rules that no restrictions shall be placed on the use of aid money that does not come from Atlasian aid, or other Atlasian governmental organizations.


Does this mean that if a group sponsors terrorism on the side, with money form Saudi Oil Barrons we are mandated to keep funding their healthcare clinics?
78  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HOUSE BILL: Baby Box Act (Debating) on: June 22, 2017, 03:09:02 am
Yea, I support the notion behind this, but I agree we should focus our resources on those who most need them.
79  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: June 2017 Federalist Convention (Bylaw Amendment Offered) on: June 22, 2017, 01:46:00 am
This has almost 3 hours left
80  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: NC Yankee For the People's House HQ: Main Street First!!! (TOWNHALL!!!) on: June 22, 2017, 01:41:26 am
Quote
Press Release -

I am very pleased with the prompt action and support that the 21st Century Glass-Steagall Act has received in the Senate and the outpouring of support it has obtained the petition today. Its my hope that this will begin a stable and orderly transition away from too big to fail, towards a culture of responsibility in investment banking. The gov't cannot stand by and let Wall Street irresponsibility drag down the economy, with the only consequence being a tax payer funded bailout for the bank and a golden parachute for the executives. Therefore, once Glass-Steagall has been signed, I intend to proceed with the passage of a law that will impose standards, hold people accountable and prevent the need for tax payers to have to foot the bill once again, driving up our debt and taxes on hard working people, who have already paid the price in lost jobs, wages, and homes.
81  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HOUSE BILL: Forest Revitalization and Preservation Act (Debating) on: June 21, 2017, 10:40:46 pm
Pre-reset, we passed a ban on Mountain Top Removal mining back in 2012. TJ in Cleve sponsored it I think.
82  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The Atlantic: How Democrats Lost Their Way on Immigration on: June 21, 2017, 09:51:14 pm
Immigrants are people too, throwing them under the bus because muh americans is disgusting and unforgivable.

Oh please, spare me the "throwing them under the bus" garbage. Their own countries can take care of them, it's not our responsibility. We have to take care of our own citizens first, then if there is anything left over we can give aid to foreign countries. Why is it that you guys always seem to care more about the welfare of foreigners than your own countrymen? It's that perception of your priorities that cost you an easily winnable election, and gives greater credence to the idea that you only care about importing future voters.

I will believe someone talking about "taking care of our own citizens first" when they're willing to stop the predatory financial sector, the destructive corporations, the abusive billionaires and the captive government. If you ignore these while complaining about immigration, you're focusing on hangnails while you bleed to death internally. (And I truly don't know where you stand on any of this.)

I am left leaning on the economy. I wanted Obama to break up the banks when we had the chance back in 2009. I wanted tougher regulations on CDS and other financial instruments that brought us to the brink of ruin back then. I want higher taxes on the wealthy and universal healthcare by expanding Medicare and Medicaid, not the piece of crap Obamacare that was a giveaway to private insurers. I want the debt ceiling to be eliminated so it can't be used as a hostage to cut spending programs that were already authorized by previous Congresses. I want tougher rules on campaign donations, and a constitutional amendment to limit wealthy people and corporations from flooding the airwaves with campaign commercials for their crony candidates.

But before you do any of that you need to gain control over your borders to determine what goods and people get to cross. Democrats had complete control over the government, and they could have nuked the filibuster to pass more progressive legislation, but they didn't do it. They are corporate whores that want to import the 3rd world so their masters get cheap labor, and they can use identity politics to get those new arrivals to become reliable Democratic voters, all while continuing a neoliberal agenda. It's the same playbook the Republicans ran for decades, only theirs was to use religious wedge issues to dupe their base. Trump was just the only chance I saw to shake up that system. Now he's looking more and more like another establishment Republican, so my only hope is the Democrats come around to my side on the issues of immigration and trade, otherwise I'll have no party.

The Democrats will never come around on that issue because their base is now high end and technocratic.

Trump is not going to be the Calvin Coolidge of Republican Populism, he is morel ike the McKinley. McKinley was known for protectionism primarily, but his nomination pushed the party in a direction of being for business and against gov't leading to Presidencies like Coolidge. The first nomination pushing in that direction is going to look at lot more like the traditional nominee then the nominee to come a decade or two later as the that transformation continues.

Hahaha.

Source?

Perhaps he might mean the base of the donor class or cadre class.

Yes of course.

Money talks after all.

Then the "Republican base" is just as unlikely to do what that guy desires.

If Money still talked on the GOP side, Jeb Bush would be the nominee. The GOP base is so angry at their own party, that money doesn't over power that anger.
83  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: SB 2017-105: Draft Restriction Amendment (Debating) on: June 21, 2017, 09:48:43 pm
Another issue of Yankee+Truman v. the Senate. Tongue
84  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HOUSE BILL: Renewable Energy Rebate and Subsidy Act (Debating) on: June 21, 2017, 08:08:35 pm
What is the avg cost of installation?
It depends on the size of the unit - a 4kW solar panel unit is roughly $7,500. A 1kW solar panel unit is about $4,000.

What about the cost of labor for said installation?
85  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Quick question on: June 21, 2017, 07:43:18 pm
Well the rest of it is just about finished in the house


Present vote is 8-0 and time expires tomorrow on the vote.
86  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Office of Southern Speaker fhtagn on: June 21, 2017, 07:07:41 pm
Never always seems to cause me more headaches when he does nothing, then when he is active.  Tongue
87  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The Atlantic: How Democrats Lost Their Way on Immigration on: June 21, 2017, 06:55:57 pm
Immigrants are people too, throwing them under the bus because muh americans is disgusting and unforgivable.

Oh please, spare me the "throwing them under the bus" garbage. Their own countries can take care of them, it's not our responsibility. We have to take care of our own citizens first, then if there is anything left over we can give aid to foreign countries. Why is it that you guys always seem to care more about the welfare of foreigners than your own countrymen? It's that perception of your priorities that cost you an easily winnable election, and gives greater credence to the idea that you only care about importing future voters.

I will believe someone talking about "taking care of our own citizens first" when they're willing to stop the predatory financial sector, the destructive corporations, the abusive billionaires and the captive government. If you ignore these while complaining about immigration, you're focusing on hangnails while you bleed to death internally. (And I truly don't know where you stand on any of this.)

I am left leaning on the economy. I wanted Obama to break up the banks when we had the chance back in 2009. I wanted tougher regulations on CDS and other financial instruments that brought us to the brink of ruin back then. I want higher taxes on the wealthy and universal healthcare by expanding Medicare and Medicaid, not the piece of crap Obamacare that was a giveaway to private insurers. I want the debt ceiling to be eliminated so it can't be used as a hostage to cut spending programs that were already authorized by previous Congresses. I want tougher rules on campaign donations, and a constitutional amendment to limit wealthy people and corporations from flooding the airwaves with campaign commercials for their crony candidates.

But before you do any of that you need to gain control over your borders to determine what goods and people get to cross. Democrats had complete control over the government, and they could have nuked the filibuster to pass more progressive legislation, but they didn't do it. They are corporate whores that want to import the 3rd world so their masters get cheap labor, and they can use identity politics to get those new arrivals to become reliable Democratic voters, all while continuing a neoliberal agenda. It's the same playbook the Republicans ran for decades, only theirs was to use religious wedge issues to dupe their base. Trump was just the only chance I saw to shake up that system. Now he's looking more and more like another establishment Republican, so my only hope is the Democrats come around to my side on the issues of immigration and trade, otherwise I'll have no party.

The Democrats will never come around on that issue because their base is now high end and technocratic.

Trump is not going to be the Calvin Coolidge of Republican Populism, he is morel ike the McKinley. McKinley was known for protectionism primarily, but his nomination pushed the party in a direction of being for business and against gov't leading to Presidencies like Coolidge. The first nomination pushing in that direction is going to look at lot more like the traditional nominee then the nominee to come a decade or two later as the that transformation continues.

Hahaha.

Source?

Perhaps he might mean the base of the donor class or cadre class.

Yes of course.

Money talks after all.
88  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Atlasia Presidential Election Polling 6/20/17 - POLLING STILL OPEN! on: June 21, 2017, 06:53:39 pm
The casual viewer of the AFE board is heavily Labor pool it seems.
89  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HOUSE BILL: Renewable Energy Rebate and Subsidy Act (Debating) on: June 21, 2017, 06:26:25 pm
What is the avg cost of installation?
90  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HR 1123 - Voting Rights Amendment (Amended, Final Vote) on: June 21, 2017, 06:19:13 pm
Vote on Final House Passage of the Voting Rights Amendment, as amended by the Senate:

Aye (Cool: Clyde, Dereich, Leinad, LLR, NC Yankee, OneJ, Peebs and Pessimistic
Nay (0):
Abstain (0):

Didn't Vote (1): CMB222 (on Leave)


This can be closed tomorrow at any time, time expires tomorrow evening.

Going to go ahead and provide my signature. Just insert this one under Pit's Signature since this is for the amended form, and the original House vote and link should remain above unchanged so people can view that as well.

Atlasian People's House of Representatives
Passed 8-0 in the Atlasian House Assembled,
91  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: SB 2017-106: Congressional Procedure Amendment (Debating) on: June 21, 2017, 06:13:48 pm
I agree with PiT.


I think there should also be an exception that opens the door back up for conference committees. I think that would be a much easier way to handle the complex projects like Healthcare (considering all the other difficulties and roadblocks we have so far experienced) then to have it got locked into this auto-pilot system where it could be bounced around and killed.

Now that being said, there are elements of this auto-pilot system that I like, especially since it helps provide a tangible action for the VP that is coded into the constitution and there is nothing requiring a future VP to continue with the signing of bills passing both chambers like Goldwater has been doing, so I am always mindful of regressing. On that note, we should also be mindful of trying to make this transformation of an active VP, a long lasting situation.

The rules changes help, but I would note the last time we had a good run of good VPs (4/5 active between March 2013-July 2014) and we ended up with the rules involving the VP being gutted "in the name of simplicity" (whispers: also partisan/personal animous towards Windjammer).
92  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The Atlantic: How Democrats Lost Their Way on Immigration on: June 21, 2017, 06:03:58 pm
Was Obama racist when he ran on cracking down on employers who hire illegals in 2008, and espousing at least lip service to the lie that is comprehensive immigration reform's inherent promise of enforcing immigration laws on all future illegals, not just criminals?
93  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: SB 2017-104: The 21st Century Glass Stegall Act (Final Vote) on: June 21, 2017, 05:49:07 pm
WEll that was quicker than I expected Tongue
94  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FMSP Petition: Sign and Urge Your Senators to Support Glass-Steagall on: June 21, 2017, 04:55:06 pm
And they say the AFE Board is dead. Tongue

95  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: FMSP Petition: Sign and Urge Your Senators to Support Glass-Steagall on: June 21, 2017, 04:20:33 am
Quote
We the undersigned Atlasian's urge the Senate to promptly pass the 21st Century Glass-Steagall Act -

X People's Speaker North Carolina Yankee
96  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / FMSP Petition: Sign and Urge Your Senators to Support Glass-Steagall on: June 21, 2017, 04:19:39 am
Quote
We the undersigned Atlasian's urge the Senate to promptly pass the 21st Century Glass-Steagall Act -

X Signature

House Action - Passed 5-1
Senate Action - Passed 4-0
Executive Action - Signed

I am launching this petition, because the Senate has done some inexplicable things lately (Cough...Voting Rights Amendment...cough). I therefore encourage Atlasians in all regions to sign this petition to help keep your Senators in touch with your priorities and not those of their donor elites.

This petition is funded by the Federalist Main Street Partnership.
97  General Discussion / History / Re: The Myth of the Kindly General Lee on: June 21, 2017, 03:54:17 am
Personally, I'm not a huge fan of judging historical figures by their private opinions more than by their public actions. The fact of the matter is that, at the end of the day, Lincoln freed the slaves (you can argue about the why, but at the end of the day the result was the same) whereas Lee commanded an army whose stated goal was the preservation of chattel slavery in America. Their own moral rectitude is not really a relevant consideration, unless you're in the position of weighing souls, which a historian most certainly should not be. I will add, though, that there's a definite difference between believing blacks to be of an inferior race (which was a pretty standard view nationally in the 1850s) and believing that they were better off enslaved than free (which Lincoln, for all his hedging and evolutions on the issue, never contended).

Weighing past figures against the modern standard, will distort the vantage point and the most important takeaway.

There is no such thing as perfectionism in history, there is only the constant quest for betterment. I am so tired of these revisionists like that idiot in the NC legislature a few weeks back who attacked Lincoln. Lincoln is hero in our history because relative to the times, he moved the ball 20 yards, while Lee was playing defense. Did Lincoln violate civil liberties? Yes, but so did the damn South many times over. A slave society is by nature a totalitarian society because of the constant few of servile insurrection.

The South didn't become more extreme because of Northern pressure. The south led most every argument, every demand, demanded the breaking of every past agreement, because they concentration of slaves in growing numbers posed a severe threat to public safety and the constant fear, that motivated the increasing extremism, was that worry that tomorrow the South will look like something out of the movie Spartacus (and these people knew classical history).

As this become a more pressing fear, more repressive laws were passed making it illegal to teach blacks to read, making it illegal to espouse religious beliefs that opposed slavery and made it illegal to campaign against it or organize against it. And if a slave runs a away you could be compelled to join a posse to track them down. That is violations of freedom of speech, religion, association and press.

Along with this heightened fear of the concentration of slavery in the slave states, came increasing demands for lands. Suddenly the Missouri Compromise is anti-Southern and has to be repealed. Suddenly you have to force Northerners to help catch runaway slaves (Fugitive Slave Act) and trample all over Northern State's rights, in order for the South's state's rights to be preserved. Finally, the courts start throwing out decades of precedence, to make rulings favorable to South and finally the Supreme Court has to violate all sorts of precedent, norms and the constitution to rule that it is unconstitutional to deny anyone's right to own slaves. It took the Fugitive Slave Act and the Dred Scott decision to unify the North behind a Slavery Restrictionist like Lincoln.

The south didn't become more extreme because they annoyed by a few posters sent south from New England. The South became more extreme because they were scared crapless that they would wake up to find their throats being cut by machetes. The south literally wanted "breathing space" or if you prefer "lebensraum" to spread the slaves out and reduce the risk of servile insurrection, them constantly demanding more and more, and getting it at many stages, pushed the North to unify behind a single party and candidate opposed to the expansion of Slavery. Lincoln would not have won in 1856 or any prior election.

Its hilarious when you consider the parallel that Kalwejt made, because the political evolution of the south is fairly similar (Though much elongated over time) to the ever increasing demands by Hitler in order for him to to be "satisfied".
98  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: State-by-state federal election maps (August 2016-present, WIP) on: June 21, 2017, 02:55:45 am
The interesting thing is that in that clusterf#@k of a Presidential election, Blair and myself tied at 56.

The Labor Slate won 56-52.

Some of my voters voted Labor down ballot. And some people who voted for Blair didn't cast votes down ballot.
99  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: The Atlantic: How Democrats Lost Their Way on Immigration on: June 21, 2017, 02:18:49 am
Immigrants are people too, throwing them under the bus because muh americans is disgusting and unforgivable.

Oh please, spare me the "throwing them under the bus" garbage. Their own countries can take care of them, it's not our responsibility. We have to take care of our own citizens first, then if there is anything left over we can give aid to foreign countries. Why is it that you guys always seem to care more about the welfare of foreigners than your own countrymen? It's that perception of your priorities that cost you an easily winnable election, and gives greater credence to the idea that you only care about importing future voters.

I will believe someone talking about "taking care of our own citizens first" when they're willing to stop the predatory financial sector, the destructive corporations, the abusive billionaires and the captive government. If you ignore these while complaining about immigration, you're focusing on hangnails while you bleed to death internally. (And I truly don't know where you stand on any of this.)

I am left leaning on the economy. I wanted Obama to break up the banks when we had the chance back in 2009. I wanted tougher regulations on CDS and other financial instruments that brought us to the brink of ruin back then. I want higher taxes on the wealthy and universal healthcare by expanding Medicare and Medicaid, not the piece of crap Obamacare that was a giveaway to private insurers. I want the debt ceiling to be eliminated so it can't be used as a hostage to cut spending programs that were already authorized by previous Congresses. I want tougher rules on campaign donations, and a constitutional amendment to limit wealthy people and corporations from flooding the airwaves with campaign commercials for their crony candidates.

But before you do any of that you need to gain control over your borders to determine what goods and people get to cross. Democrats had complete control over the government, and they could have nuked the filibuster to pass more progressive legislation, but they didn't do it. They are corporate whores that want to import the 3rd world so their masters get cheap labor, and they can use identity politics to get those new arrivals to become reliable Democratic voters, all while continuing a neoliberal agenda. It's the same playbook the Republicans ran for decades, only theirs was to use religious wedge issues to dupe their base. Trump was just the only chance I saw to shake up that system. Now he's looking more and more like another establishment Republican, so my only hope is the Democrats come around to my side on the issues of immigration and trade, otherwise I'll have no party.

The Democrats will never come around on that issue because their base is now high end and technocratic.

Trump is not going to be the Calvin Coolidge of Republican Populism, he is morel ike the McKinley. McKinley was known for protectionism primarily, but his nomination pushed the party in a direction of being for business and against gov't leading to Presidencies like Coolidge. The first nomination pushing in that direction is going to look at lot more like the traditional nominee then the nominee to come a decade or two later as the that transformation continues.
100  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: HOUSE BILL: Baby Box Act (Debating) on: June 21, 2017, 01:58:16 am
Representatives have 48 hours to object to clyde's assumption of sponsorship.
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