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February 27, 2015, 07:33:07 pm
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News: Don't forget to get your 2013 Gubernatorial Endorsements and Predictions in!

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1  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Proposed Designs for the Obama Library. on: Today at 01:10:44 am

Where's the attached mosque? Huh
2  General Discussion / History / Re: War of 1812: Win, Loss, or Draw for America? on: Today at 12:47:27 am
We've been taught since childhood that we kicked your butts, but Wikipedia says it was a draw.

Canada did kick our butts. The invasion of Canada went terribly for the United States, and Canadians were a major part of that. But there were two other major opponents to the USA in the war: Britain, who won some, lost some, and agreed to peace without a change in territory; and Tecumseh's Confederacy, who basically lost to the USA.

@ Hatman: that's adorable, but there wasn't any 'we' Canadians at the time, only loyal servants of the British Crown. Tongue

@ you & Sparkey: the Canadian border was more of a stalemate than anything. Yes, there were failed American invasions, but the British invasion was thwarted by defeat on Lake Champlain, and the were American victories along the front which weren't followed up for strategic gains, not to mention that burning of York (strategically meaningless as it was).
3  General Discussion / History / Re: War of 1812: Win, Loss, or Draw for America? on: Today at 12:38:11 am
     We started a war and got our capital sacked. I know that not much changed from the status quo, but it's hard for me to call that anything other than a loss.

So? Unlike most European wars where the capture of a capital was usually the last ditch battle of the losing army, the capture of Washington was merely a raid where the British relinquished control of the city within 24 hours. Sure it was a humiliating defeat of a single battle (or rather the Battle of Bladensburg), but it meant little strategically for the overall war or the ultimate Treaty of Ghent.

Besides, does that mean America similarly raiding and burning Canada's capital (York, nka Toronto) mean Canada lost the war?
4  Forum Community / Off-topic Board / Re: Creed, Nickelback or Ampere on: February 25, 2015, 11:25:00 pm
Creed by default. Not great at all, but Ampere's sample was a horrid attempt at thrash/punk hybrid, and Nickleback is literally Satan incarnate.
5  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Did you like middle school? on: February 25, 2015, 08:32:11 pm
Frick no.
6  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Could the previous poster win a Senate election in their state? on: February 25, 2015, 08:29:37 pm
It's California, so possibly.
7  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Best year of high school on: February 25, 2015, 08:27:55 pm
First year after graduation. Not a cop out; it's just every year of life post high school is SOOOOOOO much better than high school itself.
8  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Have there ever been Senators that became Representatives? on: February 25, 2015, 07:25:28 pm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Wolcott_Wadsworth_Jr.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alton_Lennon
9  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Obama breaking out the veto pen today for Keystone on: February 25, 2015, 06:49:28 pm
"Obama breaking out the veto pen today for Keystone"

Congrats Phil!
10  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: BREAKING: Ron Paul still a racist on: February 24, 2015, 11:21:46 pm
Ron Paul says typically racist stuff reflective of octegenarian Texan. Forum internet libertards line up to defend him. Film at 11
11  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Senior Citizen Faces 3 Yr Minimum Sentence for Transporting 300-year-old Pistol on: February 24, 2015, 02:17:52 am
No one deserves to go to jail because they mistakenly "filed the wrong paperwork". However jury nullification is not a thing and should not happen here nor anywhere else.

Prosecutorial discretion is what is called for. Or, lacking that, a clemency from the governor and/or legislative action to eliminate the issue.

Yes and yes.
12  General Discussion / History / War of 1812: Win, Loss, or Draw for America? on: February 24, 2015, 01:33:55 am
I vote Draw, fwiw, based on the return to antibellum status in the Treaty of Ghent and rather mixed bag of military successes (and failures) on both sides.
13  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Cuomo refuses to condemn Giuliani's Obama comments on: February 22, 2015, 07:11:17 pm
Recall, Giuliani did not endorse Astorino in 2014. Several of his closest confidantes supported Cuomo. Considering Cuomo's past, very little would surprise me here.

Correct answer. Cuomo believes in NY guliani's support is more important than Obama's.
14  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Georgia considering ban on centaurs, werewolves, mermaids and other hybrids on: February 22, 2015, 07:02:05 pm
When reality is more bizzare than The Onion......
15  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Voting Booth / Re: February 2015 Presidential and Regional Senate Elections on: February 20, 2015, 03:28:04 pm
Pres:

1) Bore
2) Maxwell
3) JCL

ME Senator:

1) Windjammer
2) Spiral
16  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: UMass Amherst bans Iranian nationals from taking certain science subjects on: February 18, 2015, 04:14:33 pm
Bedstuy is correct. This is simple enforcement of US sactions against slowing development of nuclear arms. The same sanctions followed and supported by many international partners. Note the policy applies to Iranian nationals, not anyone of Iraiian descent.

That said, I wouldn't mind seeing an opportunity for individual exemptions after hightened background checks and the like.
17  General Discussion / Religion & Philosophy / Re: Young-Earth Creationism Justifications on: February 18, 2015, 11:03:56 am
I think JCL and Bushie are the only Creationists (YE or otherwise) active on the Forum, fwiw. Though come to think of it I wouldn't be surprised if relative newcomer Thomas from NJ was as well.
18  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: The Sam Spade Memorial Good Post Gallery on: February 18, 2015, 10:31:54 am
Wow, five posts in and not a single "good post" yet. This thread is off to a "good" start.

Seriously. And as much as Spade could make excellent points (when he occassionally would refrain from being needlessly cryptic or an outright a**hole), the above posts don't belong anywhere near ANY thread, let alone a 'Good Post Gallery'

Come to thing of it, that'll be fixed momentarily.....

Reported for trolling.

George my friend, it's times like this I wish I had ready access to a middle finger emoticon. Wink

Re: the other new posts here--the Gallery is saved. Smiley
19  Forum Community / Off-topic Board / Re: Has anyone heard of people crying at metal shows/metal bands crying on stage? on: February 17, 2015, 10:31:59 pm
This thread makes LeBron, Retromike, and Libertas's dream apartment look like the Bunny Ranch.

This is the best post of the decade.
20  Forum Community / Off-topic Board / Re: Lesley Gore (60s Teen Idol) Dies at 68 on: February 17, 2015, 10:29:11 pm
Too young. One of the greatest 50's female singers.
21  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Oklahoma tries to ban APUSH (& possibly others AP classes) on: February 17, 2015, 06:40:53 pm
Seems like a step in the right direction.

You're effing kidding, right? Care to elaborate?

And for extra masochism on my part, what would be the next 'right' step.
22  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Oklahoma tries to ban APUSH (& possibly others AP classes) on: February 17, 2015, 06:38:09 pm
My only surprise is that Oklahoma hasn't been beaten to this by other astates. The South sucks, exhibit number 378 12
23  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Gov. Bruce Rauner Declares War on State Unions Through Executive Order on: February 17, 2015, 03:19:37 pm
I stand with the African American community against integration

You mean the racial discrimination of affirmative action (because "reverse discrimination" is totally a thing). Get your right-wing slogans right, dude.

I THINK Monarch's joke was that Rauner's claim to "stand withh labor" by pulling this move is akin to a pol saying they "stand" with African-Americans by opposing what they near-universally favor.
24  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Death penalty halted in PA on: February 17, 2015, 01:11:27 pm

HP. Getting rid of the death penalty puts prison guards and prisoners in danger.

Convicts have killed prison guards or fellow inmates in full knowledge that they would exchange the misery of life imprisonment for a faster death if suicide is unavailable or if they are scared of something even worse (a literal Hell) in the event of suicide. Maybe even the promise of a Last Meal and Last Words in a life which has lost all meaning.      

That is such an unimaginably low exception to the rule, that it litterally doesn't merit discussion. Doesa con serving life (or the functional equivilent) wish everyday they were outside? Of course. Do the overwhelming majority turn into violent predators or otherwise in a sick way of thinking 'thrive'. You bet.

There are valid arguments against capital punishment, even if I disagree with many of them; but death penalty opponents need to be honest about the fact lifers will remain drastic threats to staff and other inmates, and most such inmates will gladly take the opportunity to do what they want without retribution rather than seeing capital punishment as a glorified form of suicide.

But then given the amount of anti-cop vitriol that runs endemic throughout the Atlas, I'm guessing the sympathy for threats to COs is limited, as the typical image of prison guards around here is more formed by movies like Shawshank Redemption (awesome though it is) than real life.

There. I said it.

So then Minnesota prisons must be WAY WAY more dangerous than Texas prisons then? And Canadian prisons have to be way more dangerous than in most states?

Yeah, no.

Please. I'm hardly saying capital punishment is the cure all for broken underfunded, understaffed prison systems. The fact remains a lifer in MN can kill a guard, staff member, or other inmate with total legal impunity. Think about that.

I'm not too sure I'd call being locked up in solitary confinement permently or sent to a Supermax facility (considering that Supermax prisons were built initially specifically for inmates deemed too dangerous for the general population) to be "total legal impunity". In fact I'd bet you'd find many if not most people would prefer going to death row than going to a Supermax which is not surprising if you have any clue what those places are like.

But honestly this is one issue where my view is it doesn't matter what I think personally, I find the death penalty completely incompatible with Christianity and I can't support it if I'm going to follow Jesus. I opposed it before, but there's no way I'm backsliding on that now.

First paragraph: I have practiced criminal law as either a prosecutor or defense attorney for over 20 years. Unlike you, I have been to prisons. I have investigated cases that occur in prison. I have dealt with clients, defendants, investigators, witnesses, and staff in prisons as my effing JOB for over two decades. And based on a couple tv shows and $hit you picked up on the internet you condensend to tell ME I don't know what the realities of prison life are??

Here's a plan, champ. While you're at it why don't you go teach Al a few things about the 80's miner strikes in England?> Or maybe educate Muon about physics or suburban Chicago politics? And while you're at it maybe you can tell Joe Republic what's what on the best places to really party in Vegas. Would that be pretentious and presumptives? Hell yes. But you couldn't possibly look more of an ass doing so than you do right now.

Second paragraph. That's fine. You and I can legitimately debate the theological differences we have there.

But DON'T accuse me of ignorance where you have exactly zero grounds to stand on.
I never said you were ignorant. I was just pointing out Supermaxes exist for exactly this reason, and the prospect of being stuck in one for decades is a lot more horrifying than death.

And with all this knowledge then if your statement that prisons in states without the death penalty are inherently more dangerous than states with it, then you should be able to provide some statistics to back it up. Much like how this is rather well cited.

Also as far as the point about Minnesota prisons go, consider that Pawlenty's proposal to reinstate the death penalty was voted down by a State Senate committee by a vote of 8-2, meaning that even two out of the four REPUBLICANS on the committee voted No. And these of course are State Senators, not posters on a message board who like to post things against cops and prison guards.

The last sentence of your post stated I would agree that lifer would prefer capital punishment if I had ANY idea (your empahsis) what conidtions in maximum security prisons are like. Yes, that's accusing me of ignorance. If you're going to walk that claim back, do a better job of it.

Second, what 'statement that prisons in states without the death penalty are inherently more dangerous than prisons in states without it' did I ever make? In fact, how did you completely ignore my post above where I said the EXACT OPPOSITE. I specifically stated there that capital punishment is not a panacea for prison violence compared to larger issues of sufficient staffing/funding.

The fact remains that lifers in non- death penalty states (actual and de facto), including those already in max security/admin seg, can kill with legal impunity.
25  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Attention: attention whore thread on: February 17, 2015, 11:56:29 am
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