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76  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Politico article on Trump finally has the balls to shoot straight on: September 16, 2016, 08:43:58 pm
Thank You for telling us the presses job to help Hillary win.

It is the press's job to speak truth to power, or to those seeking power.  Its job is to expose fact and counter falsehood, not to be "nonpartisan."  They have given Trump a free ride for 15 months now in pursuit of a false middle.

Meanwhile CNN and MSNBC would never do any such thing to Clinton. Oh wait. They already did. At least Fox presents opposing points of view in essentially every non-Hannity segment.

77  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Trump hates health, likes salmonella on: September 16, 2016, 08:37:29 pm
FDA food police? how dumb is this guy?

The FDA literally are the food police.  But Democrats can keep calling farmers who worry about it stupid and wonder why they are losing rural America.

those poor farmers, they have to make food people can actually eat without getting sick. if the shrinking-by-the-day rural america thinks that standard is too strict than I really don't care about their votes.

If you prefer our food to be grown by an ever smaller number of producers relying on tightly controlled factory farming, that's fine. But when the hollowing out of rural America is accompanied by declines in life expectancy, I question whether that is helpful to the goal of people not getting sick.

Life expectancy isn't falling because we aren't getting norovirus in our bacon.

try reading what I said again.

Your argument appears to be more food safety --> less farmers --> more people in cities --> less life expectancy, which isn't exactly wrong, but cutting regulations isn't the way to solve it. It would be better to clean up urban areas instead of trying to do what Trump wants, which wouldn't increase health at all.

It isn't actually about more people in cities.  It's about the people who remain in rural areas not having productive livelihoods or thriving communities, and people everywhere relying on a certain type of agriculture for their food.  I'm not against some sort of food safety regulation, I'm against the way the FDA has tended to approach it, especially since the FSMA passed by Congress.

The biggest threat to family farms isn't regulation per se, it's that flouting regulation is to a substantial degree permitted more for large agribusiness with powerful friends in government and corps of lobbyists that family farmers lack.
78  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Someone reassure me on: September 16, 2016, 08:30:55 pm
I've never quite understood the 'omg if we elect Trump it'll be so embarrassing' line of thought. I mean, consider the facts and the countries. Russia - ruled over by illiberal strongman Putin; China - a dictatorship; India - a country whose current Prime Minister is a Hindu Nationalist; Japan - has a cabinet composed primarily of historical revisionists often ill at ease with the idea that Japan committed any war crimes in World War II at all. Look at Europe, where in many countries the parties of the moderate middle are headlong decline/retreat - an FPO candidate stands a good chance of becoming the next Austrian President and Marine Le Pen is pretty much guaranteed a place in the second round of next years French Presidential Election, whilst hard right parties in the Netherlands, Sweden and Germany continue to gain considerable ground.

Really and truly, is Trump that embarrassing a leader in this context?

A) that list of deplorables, even over stated as it is for Japan, is embarrassing.

b) Even in that context, yes, Trump goes far beyond embarrassing.
79  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Who will win Iowa? on: September 16, 2016, 08:19:32 pm
I still predict Clinton. This is probably Trump's high crest.

Unless he "defies expectations" at the debate by saying REMOTELY on message and avoids a Nazi salute or calling Hillary an expletive. The odds of which are at least 50/50, so....
80  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Trump is back to Birtherism on: September 16, 2016, 08:16:45 pm
Even Fox News is saying that Clinton didn't start birtherism.

This speaks volumes.

Per Guardian, press pool now locked in ballroom after refusal to send cameras on hotel tour, now backdrop has collapsed

Wut? Srsly?? Link plz?
81  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Trump: Clinton's bodyguards should be disarmed; let's see what happens to her on: September 16, 2016, 08:12:32 pm
Unsurprising, considering most Republicans seem incapable of understanding that: (a) Clinton never proposed disarming or seizing arms from all American citizens, and (b) that there is an irrefutable difference between a political candidate aspiring to the Presidency and a regular citizen in terms of their likelihood of being a target of violence. Personally, while I find everything that Trump says and thinks deplorable, he is but merely the id of our authoritarian, bigoted Republican electorate with a demonstrable lack of self-regulation.

I'm not a Republican, but you have some Democrats and leftists that would LOVE gun confiscation. You can't deny it. That's why this issue is brought up. Some Democrats and far-leftists have to STOP talking about gun control, it's too divisive. Suburban women voters need to let it go as well.

That's a ridiculous reason to bring this issue up in relation to Hillary Clinton, however. She has never articulated any position that even resembles what the Republican Party and, specifically, Trump are suggesting. What other Democrats and Leftists propose is essentially irrelevant in this context. Also, I wouldn't deny that there are some (not even most) Democrats and Leftists who'd enthusiastically support mass firearm confiscation and laws similar to those found in countries such as England - myself included.

You shouldn't. Are you a weakling? Be strong. Why are you so afraid of a gun? Are you going to use your hands to attack the robber or the criminal? Harden up, my friend, harden up.

Ah, the machismo argument. If you are opposed to guns, then you must be afraid of them, therefore toughen up. Wouldn't the more civilized answer to a culture of gun violence, directly stemming from our nation's adoration of such toxic masculinity and ready access to firearms, be to de-emphasize and de-glorify violence while removing the primary tool of causing mass deaths? But, I guess that might be asking too much of many Americans.

Come on my man, how are people supposed to defend themselves? Come on, man. How are you going to defend yourself?

From what am I supposed to defend myself? I have argued that guns need to be confiscated and banned, except for in tightly regulated and highly limited situations (such as farmers and licensed hunters). In that context, from what am I defending myself? A man with a knife or a baseball bat? Then the answer is a knife, a baseball bat, my hands, or some other object or, ideally, the police. But, again, if we focused on de-emphasizing and de-glorifying violence, along with actually tackling poverty, then the threat of violence would not be so widespread. I'm not saying it's a simple process, but it is the only legitimate process.

I respectfully disagree. But if any Democrat or far leftist EVER proposes gun confiscation, there will be a civil war and only them will be to blame for anything that happens. I respectfully disagree with you, you're promoting weakness, in my opinion and this is why some people are saying that leftists are weak people. Come on man.

But they don't, and aren't about to. At all, despite NRA broadsheets to the contrary. That's the point.
82  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Trump: Clinton's bodyguards should be disarmed; let's see what happens to her on: September 16, 2016, 08:10:12 pm
I think Trump's secret service protection should be removed and have no bodyguards and then see how much of a tough guy he is.

Don't worry. His mobs of rally attendees would jackboot-stomp anyone that came near him.

Not joking.
83  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: National Fraternal Order of Police endorse Trump on: September 16, 2016, 08:09:19 pm
Per the tweet Clinton declined to even seek the endorsement?!? WTF?!?
84  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: National Fraternal Order of Police endorse Trump on: September 16, 2016, 08:08:05 pm
I don't think there should be unions, but it clearly makes sense for the police to support Trump, given the crazy anti-cop rhetoric of the left.

Jesus Christ......Roll Eyes
85  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Phyllis Schlafly dead at 92 on: September 16, 2016, 07:35:12 pm
I've thought about this long and hard. Schlafly's views were indeed horrendous, but the glory of America is that people are more than their politics. As I was reminded diving down a Wikipedia rabbit hole.

"After The People vs. Larry Flynt appeared, Falwell and Flynt began meeting in person to discuss philosophy. They visited colleges to publicly debate morality and the First Amendment, and exchanged Christmas cards and family photos. After Falwell's death in 2007 Flynt wrote, "the ultimate result was one I never expected ... We became friends".

86  General Politics / Political Geography & Demographics / Re: When will Allegheny county, PA go Republican? on: September 16, 2016, 01:27:20 am
To OP, you need a Corbett-style landslide (btw, his opponent in 2010, Dan Onorato, was then the sitting Allegheny County Executive). At presidential level, you'll need at least a Bush 88 size win nationally, and even that probably won't be enough.

Re: the 92 Senate election: I'd forgot about that. Yeakel suffered from the (then) sole newspaper in the County having an extended strike. It really hurt her campaign's ability to get her Philadelphia name out to Pittsburghers.

@ Bullmoose: Welcome back! Cheesy

Re: Cubby's question, I grew up in Allegheny just south of the Butler County line, my Dad worked there, and we have family in Westmoreland. Butler isn't nearly so blue collar as it is a mix of rural with a huge white collar influx. Even when Western PA was ubiquitously Democratic, Butler was always a staunchly (Atlas) blue county in north of a red patch. Historically it was far less industrialized, and thus far less unionized, than most of the region. It was much more rural and small town than factory town. In recent decades, however, especially since I-279 opened making commuting to the city a relative breeze, tons of white collar types migrated to southern Butler County. IIRC the Cranberry Township on the Allegheny line was for a period the fastest growing municipality in the country. Even folks who didn't earn much there still worked in the non-unionized service industries. Plus, the place has less diversity than a Brady Bunch episode.

Westmoreland is an odd duck. More than any other county it symbolizes Democratic decline in Western PA, and it's happened more there than almost any other county. Westmoreland went from being a Dukakis and Mondale (Shocked) county, to in 2000 being flipped GOP for the first time since 72, to Obama only cracking 37% in 2012! Yes, Westmoreland is more blue collar, but unionized industrial jobs of course have rapidly declined, and white collar McMansion suburbs have exploded throughout the county. So yes, more white collar relatively speaking, but most people would today think of Westmoreland as white collar suburbs.
87  General Politics / Political Geography & Demographics / Re: How do Portuguese Americans vote? on: September 16, 2016, 12:39:30 am
As a Portuguese-American, I can vouch for the fact that we vote generally Democratic.

But the question remains: why?
88  General Politics / Political Geography & Demographics / Re: Why is Minnesota so liberal? on: September 16, 2016, 12:36:20 am
The well educated wealthy suburbanites and farmers can't outvote the inner city folks and the blue collar whites up in The iron range.

You clearly know nothing about MN, politically or otherwise.
89  General Politics / Political Geography & Demographics / Re: Why are the "WOW" counties in Wisconsin conservative? on: September 16, 2016, 12:30:21 am
In most Urban areas, the surrounding counties have traditionally been rock-ribbed suburban conservative communities. The expansion of Democratic voting habits as these collar communities become more diverse and start suffering the same urban problems as the big cities (crime, decaying infrastructure, etc.) has only been relatively recent (see Philly, Chicago). DFB is correct that heavy industrialization can contribute to that spread from the core city, in places like Gary and Pittsburgh, but again those are the exceptions.

For the example he gave of Cleveland, the surrounding counties aren't especially Democratic due to Cleveland. Summit has Akron all to itself. Lorain is the closest thing to an exception here. Though Lake has enough African-American spillover/immigration from eastern Cuyahoga to now make it a swing county (albeit still with a slight R tilt). Geagua and Medina remain solidly Republican (though not as much as in past decades).

In all, the WOW counties are more in line with other counties surrounding urban areas. Compare Cinci, Columbus, Atlanta, Louisville, and the same pattern emerges.
90  About this Site / The Atlas / Re: Is this "nice guy, FF :)" behavior appropriate for the forum? on: September 16, 2016, 12:11:06 am
It was one of KP's best posts.

Seriously. It was funny and burned BRTD so bad because it's so close to real.
91  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: The Seriously? Theatre of Absurdity, Ignorance, and Bad Posts V on: September 16, 2016, 12:05:23 am
dear atlas forumers,

my friend krzysztof who you knew as ‘kalwejt’ died earlier today after bad accident. because he told me about this forum and how he liked some of other posters i feel i should inform you

The awfulness of this post goes far beyond what this thread is about.

True, but still glad Muon posted it. What vile trash would post that?

Um, tell me it wasn't Kal..... Sad
92  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: The Seriously? Theatre of Absurdity, Ignorance, and Bad Posts V on: September 15, 2016, 11:57:21 pm

Well, in his defense, the South sucks.
93  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Opinion of Buffalo Bill on: September 15, 2016, 11:56:27 pm
Needs banned yesterday.
94  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Trump:Obama was born in the USA on: September 15, 2016, 11:54:07 pm

The candidate for leader of the free world himself remains mum whether he rejects this literally deranged conspiracy theory.  
95  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Pres. Obama Looking to Shore Up Climate Change Legacy with Two More Agreements on: September 15, 2016, 11:49:54 pm
If President Obama is eroding the balance of power between the branches of government, the real culprit is the almost insane obstructionism that we have seen from Republicans in Congress since the beginning of his administration. 

Again, not liking the rules of the game doesn't mean you get to throw the Monopoly board on the floor and declare yourself monarch of Atlantic City and everyone is required to pay rent to you by divine right.

1) Name one way either of these agreements, negotiated within the scope of previously ratified treaties, violates the separation of powers or American law.

2) re: your metaphor, isn't that PRECISELY what McConnell and company did when they lost the election in 08 (and again in 12)?
96  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: 2 Muslim women, babies attacked in New York on: September 15, 2016, 11:47:00 pm
She's been charged and is held on bail.

Her FB page had numerous posts supporting Trump. Just sayin'
97  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Someone reassure me on: September 15, 2016, 11:44:27 pm
Debates, good organization, and attacks on Trump, rather than his supporters. One possible positive outcome from the tightening of the polls is that it may help Democrats realize that this race isn't over, and that we can't take victory for granted. Hopefully the threat of a President Trump will become more real to them, and energize them to come out and work hard to get Hillary elected.

If I were a Hillary supporter, I'd take solace in this.

As a Trump supporter, I take solace in Hillary's seeming inability to come off as sincere about anything.

If irony were light, you'd be the sun.
98  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: If the election was held today, who would win? on: September 15, 2016, 11:43:30 pm
Undecideds would swing Clinton. Firewall minus IA, and maybe Me-2.
99  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Pence with a gaffe: Refuses to call David Duke "deplorable" in CNN interview on: September 15, 2016, 11:28:12 pm
Pence is one of the best Vice Presidential candidates in the history of the United States.
He made no gaffes in the CNN interview.
Clinton is the one who has viscously and hatefully degraded millions of ordinary, hard working, tax paying Americans.

Millions of ordinary, hard working, tax paying Germans voted Nazi in 1932.

So you are now comparing millions of hard working, tax paying Americans to the German population of 1932.  
Shame on you.

Lincoln Republican,
Hillary did not call the "ordinary" Americans among us deplorables.
What the hell are you talking about ?
I thought you were one of the Atlas-blue avatars that could decipher 1+1.

Greedy Hillary (Powell's words) bitterly attacked about a quarter of Americans in a vicious tirade of unprecedented proportions.

Number one rule in politics, don't insult or attack voters.

By the way, I should report you for making a personal attack against myself, however, being as magnanimous as I am, I won't.

"Tirade of Unprecedented proportions"? "Don't insult or attack voters"?

Good God, man. Have you been living in a cave for the last year?

100  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Olbermann is back, on GOP base's "demonic messiah in Oompa Loompa’s clothing" on: September 15, 2016, 11:27:50 pm
He could say the most universally true thing ever, and I still would wish he'd shut his insufferable mouth.

Is that his fault or yours?

His, for being a pompous dick.

You realize this should go to the irony mine, right? Wink
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