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276  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Sanders: "Clinton is embracing Obama to pander to black voters" on: February 19, 2016, 02:30:40 am
Does this really need a dedicated thread?
277  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: MSNBC Las Vegas, NV Democratic town hall @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 18, 2016, 11:15:03 pm
Both did well in some parts and not great in others. Clinton getting booed was funny.

Real issue is how ridiculously biased these networks are.
Dem question: "Why do you want to make American healthcare huge and inefficient?"
GOP question: "What kind of music do you like?"
278  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Paint it Red: The Rise of the American Left (1908-) on: February 18, 2016, 09:54:49 pm

Franklin Roosevelt's Sudden Upsurge at the DNC Shook the Establishment

  On June 27th in Chicago, the Democratic National Convention began. Throughout the summer, though not everyone in the Democratic Party had supported him, Henry Ford ran unopposed. For instance, the Southern Democrats were quite open in their support of the Nationalist Party, as per John Garner. The Texan Democrat himself boycotted the convention in order to portray his anger and dissatisfaction with the president and the establishment. On the other side, the Left Democratic Coalition attended the convention in full, yet refused to allow for Ford to win the party's nomination so easily.

  Leading to the convention, Ford himself carried the endorsements of former Governor Al Smith of New York, former Secretary James Cox, and former President McAdoo. Henry Ford easily held the moderate establishment in tow, yet actual support was sorely lacking. Most every demographic which had once been attracted to the energy of William J. Bryan and John Fitzgerald fizzled out in '32. Farmers, progressives, minorities, intellectuals, and industrial workers stepped away from the Democrats and President Ford, regardless of who would endorse him.

  Therefore, when the Left Democrats announced that they would be promoting Representative Franklin D. Roosevelt (D-NY) as a challenge to the president, the convention delegates awoke. Franklin Roosevelt had previously served as Navy Secretary to his father-in-law and since 1929 led the House branch of the LDC. Roosevelt fought to introduce minor liberals elements into the Democratic Party, including the move to create temporary job programs and place regulations on financing. It had been, in part, thanks to Rep. Roosevelt that New York stayed the course in 1928 in voting for President Henry Ford, yet now in 1932, he referred to the lackluster incumbent as a "deer in headlights".

  Ford's establishment sect and the LDC debated fiercely on the party platform, yet the conservative leadership retained much of the text of the traditional platform: that the Democrats would stick to their free-market stance, anti-tariff policies, and continued support for law enforcement in regards to Prohibition. The Ford delegation underestimated the power of the grassroots FDR movement, and for ballot upon ballot, neither candidate reached the necessary nominating threshold.

DEMOCRATIC BALLOT1st Call2nd Call3rd Call4th Call5th Call6th Call1097 DELEGATES
Henry Ford726704701695703839
Franklin D. Roosevelt321367376381383254

  This sudden challenge to his reign was an embarrassment to the president. It took six ballots until President Ford finally (through what some speculate to be a 'backroom deal') won over the Californian delegation and reached enough votes to be nominated. FDR possessed highly committed liberal delegates from the coastal states, and they only backed down at the bequest of their candidate. The president was forced to move slightly to the left, going as far as to promote some sort of minor regulations in his acceptance speech and recommend Franklin Roosevelt be his vice presidential candidate, before the demoralized LDC backed down. In the end, incumbent Vice President John W. Davis, was renominated over Roosevelt in a 2-to-1 margin.

  Ford left the DNC in absolute shambles. He defended himself from the Left Democrats, but only barely. His image as an incompetent, unpopular establishment politician was already well ingrained in the American psyche, and the events of the national convention confirmed this perception as reality.
279  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Left-wingers only: Why do you hate Bloomberg? on: February 18, 2016, 06:33:04 pm
"You've heard the old saying about charity: If you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day, but if you teach him to fish, he'll eat forever. Michael Bloomberg's approach might go something like this: Buy the whole damn sea, make everyone pay you for the right to fish, then use some of the profits to give out some scrawny minnows and a pamphlet on healthy eating habits."
280  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Paint it Red: The Rise of the American Left (1908-) on: February 18, 2016, 02:38:35 pm

Speculated VP Nominee, Governor Alf Landon

  The Progressive contest narrowed during the summer, as polls demonstrated the field was split primarily between Herbert Hoover and Theodore Roosevelt. There was a definite division between those who supported Roosevelt's call for a federal jobs program and Hoover's more moderate "conscientious" progressivism. Hoover followed more in the tendency of President Ford that, although it was necessary for the government to act, the entire financial system was not at fault. Roosevelt did not hesitate to blame the unregulated banking industry for pushing the whole system into collapse.

  Representatives Raymond Haight and Franck Havenner would back out of the contest and endorse Hoover in early May, while Senator Wheeler eventually endorsed Governor Roosevelt. Taking notes from Secretary La Follette's ability to frame his opponents in a negative light while not seeming overtly defensive, Roosevelt routinely lashed out at Hoover's "lack of real political experience" and his "bought and sold" candidacy in '28. Hoover did not respond strongly to this accusation, not really having any defense for his change of tone four years earlier.

  Former President and current House member Hiram Johnson (P-CA) formally endorsed Roosevelt for president as the former spoke at a stop in San Francisco. Johnson stated that Roosevelt would promptly bring about the, "third Progressive administration" in United States history, and (taking a jab at his own legacy), "perhaps the single most productive." As the second Progressive president, Johnson's endorsement did hold a lot of weight to it, yet not until the National Convention did the matter finally settle.

  At the Chicago Stadium on June 14th, the Progressive National Convention opened its doors. There had been quite a bit of hype surrounding this convention because of its expectation to crown a winner, similarly to the '24 and '28 DNCs. Liberal foundations supported the Progressive Convention financially, including personal contributions from several governors and Congressmen. The party platform, almost identical to its 1928 version, provided statures to nationalize the rail industry and creating strict regulations on Wall Street. Both Hoover and Roosevelt supported the platform with open arms.

  The two chief competitors, along with Alf Landon, built-up sizable delegations and readied for the fight. Hoover, however, misjudged the long-term affect of Johnson's endorsement of Roosevelt. As the former president heavily supported Hoover in 1928 (prior to nomination), a collection of left-leaning New York Times articles had openly speculated that perhaps the Hoover Campaign was "up to its old tricks" when it came to trustworthiness and reliability that it would not be bought-out by the RNC or any other conservative group. The party delegates were not about to let their coveted nomination fall into the hands of someone like that.

  Therefore, Roosevelt won on the second ballot. The nominee personally invited Governor Landon to be his running mate, and the delegates followed suit.

Theodore Roosevelt, Jr.10331431
Herbert Hoover691419
Alfred Landon277180

Alfred Landon2056
Burton K. Wheeler13
Raymond Haight4.5
Gifford Pinchot4
281  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Three Way Race - How do you vote? on: February 18, 2016, 12:10:18 am
Jill Stein, yo
282  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Who will get second in SC? on: February 16, 2016, 08:17:28 pm
Bernie Sanders.
283  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Paint it Red: The Rise of the American Left (1908-) on: February 16, 2016, 06:26:44 pm

Representative Norman Thomas (S-NY)

  The Socialists had more of a competitive contest for their party's nomination than they had in many years. Representative and Minority Leader Upton Sinclair, who won 48 Electoral Votes and 16% of the Popular Vote in 1928, stated that he wished to allow for others to run in his stead. He claimed that he would be glad to run alongside a well-fitted campaigner, nonetheless. Senator Earl Browder (S-NV) announced his candidacy for president, as did Benjamin Gitlow, trade unionist James H. Maurer, and organizer William Z. Foster.

  Each of these candidates represented starkly differing tendencies within the party and on the American Left in general. Maurer trended in the Old-Guard line within the Socialist Party, believing the unionizing movement should be accelerated and remain the focal point of the SP. Gitlow and Foster were Loyalists who stood by Soviet leader Josef Stalin and advocated similar centralization and modernization efforts for America.

  John Reed, now serving as a Congressman from New York, during one of the Sacco and Vanzetti protest marches, stated that if he could handpick any person to be president, it would be Earl Russell Browder. Reed assisted now-Senator Browder greatly in his Nevada Senate race, as did Minority Leader Ashley Miller. Browder had been well known in Socialist circles, and he quickly became the new frontrunner for the nomination. However, a statement he released in September 1930 regarding the Soviet Union revealed his personal favoring towards Trotsky.

  Browder's statement unearthed a divisive wound within the Socialist Party. Debate between Browder, Foster, Gitlow and Maurer had been fierce and personal, and it lasted through the spring and into June. By the convention it became less about the candidates' differing doctrinal policies and more about experience and electability. There was no doubting that the party was losing great deal of momentum to the Progressives in recent years, and now with the rise of the Nationalists, even left-wing pundits were referring to the 1928 election as the "likely final high point" for American third parties.

  Regardless of this internal doubt and frustration, the Socialist Convention turned out to be the largest yet of any prior third party. Taking place in New York City, the streets were packed with activists and organizers seeking entrance. By 1932, an estimated 75% of the population was poverty-stricken, with an even higher number for minorities. The financial system built-up over many years by the Democrats, once called "impenetrable" by The Wall Street Journal, had failed in a thundering crash. To these starving, commonly unemployed, workers, revolutionary or democratic socialism seemed a brighter solution than depending on the benevolent forces of modern capital.

  Therefore, the Socialist Convention focused far more heavily on the theme of "class power versus the bourgeoisie" than scientific Marxism or issues pertaining to the Comintern. To be certain, the debate occurring on the first day was lengthy and forceful, and none of the delegates had held back to showcase some sort of joint-party unity as the major parties were so intent on accomplishing. Gitlow, who had eventually dropped out and endorsed Foster, debated frequently with John Reed regarding Stalin vs. Trotsky on their varying programmes. In contrast, Maurer denounced both ideas as "bastardizations of Marxist theory" and pushed forward the idea of "American socialism, not international communism."

  Roll call after roll call ended in no avail, with much of the party stuck between Foster's aggressive syndicalism and Senator Browder's call for a united front against far-right tendencies. After two days and sixteen calls, NY Rep. Norman Thomas took the floor and endorsed Upton Sinclair for president. He stated that the only cure for disunity was the "rightful successor" to the legacy left by Eugene Debs, and Sinclair would be the long sought-after means to fulfill President Fitzgerald's Age of Understanding.

  Rep. Sinclair finally agreed to be nominated for president, and he was chosen on the seventeenth ballot. Sinclair gave a brief, yet powerful statement on the dangers of sectarianism and the truths espoused by each candidate. He would complete his acceptance speech by quoting Debs' 1897 letter to the ARU, proclaiming, "The issue is Socialism versus Capitalism. I am for Socialism because I am for humanity. We have been cursed with the reign of gold long enough. Money constitutes no proper basis of civilization. The time has come to regenerate society — we are on the eve of universal change."

SOCIALIST BALLOT1st Call5th Call10th Call15th Call16th Call17th Call1088 DELEGATES
Upton Sinclair2022213280992
Earl Browder43145043345539966
William Foster43544041044239328
James Maurer2071712231592162

Norman Thomas1088
284  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Sanders drops line attacking Super PAC's from speech...uh oh on: February 15, 2016, 10:15:20 pm
Sanders' line, "I do not have a super PAC, and I do not want a super PAC" is correct with the right terminology. He hasn't tacitly sanctioned a SuperPAC and there is no affiliation or coordination between the Nurses' one and his campaign. That's the difference, even though it's still an outside group contributing to the nomination/election of Sanders.
285  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Paint it Red: The Rise of the American Left (1908-) on: February 15, 2016, 07:46:11 pm

Calvin Coolidge Retained His Popularity in 1932

  Regarding the Nationalist Party, they managed to rise in popularity after the Depression in a similar fashion to how the EIP did so. Leaders of the Nationalist Party, including junior Senator Benjamin L. Young (N-MA), copied much of the language utilized by the EIP in 1930-32 in regards to their theory of national rebirth. Senator Young, in 1932, would state in relation to the election, "...now we must choose our path. The road paved with liberty or the road of debt, disaster, and bankruptcy." Young would promptly endorse Calvin Coolidge for president.

  Coolidge had remained in the public eye throughout the early Depression years, appearing often in public demonstrations against the president. The former Massachusetts governor had joined with fellow Nationalists Irénée du Pont and John J. Raskob to found the American Liberty League: a "bipartisan" coalition made to uphold values ingrained within the American Right. The League would coordinate with the Nationalist Party to fund a number of candidates in the '30 and '32 elections, including Rep. John Stille of Pennsylvania.

  Stille had gained some recognition when he competed with Senator Walsh in the Democratic primary, only to go on to win a House seat as a Nationalist candidate. He would act as an effective microphone for Calvin Coolidge, espousing many of his campaign themes on the House floor. Stille, during a seven-hour filibuster, called for a concise "referendum on liberal democracy." This was a direct quote from Frank Lowden.

  Coolidge announced that he would once more seek presidency in March of 1932. He would run a hard-right campaign: pushing for the impeachment of President Henry Ford and demanding a restarted, "Blank Slate" Congress. The message for the Coolidge Campaign would be "Common Sense Laws for a Common Sense Country." This idea, later solidified in his party's '32 platform (the Nationalist Principles), called for a streamlined government, investments in mass media, and the establishment of a new federal agency to oversee the "eternal defense of American freedom and ingenuity." Basing much of his goals on the EIP, Coolidge stated that no man apart from Tommy Moran could fix the shambles of the British economy.

  Coolidge had also gotten friendly with the leadership of the Whig Party, eventually receiving the endorsement of the 1928 Whig presidential nominee, Senator James Watson. The Whigs as a whole would come to rally around Calvin Coolidge, eventually endorsing the candidate at the Whig Convention in August. Then, roughly a week later, the Republican National Committee would also endorse Coolidge. This cross-party candidate would turn out to be one of the most well-funded candidates of all time.

  The nominee-apparent was the sole candidate preaching economic conservatism this cycle, and it became evident at the Nationalist Party Convention when John Garner himself endorsed Calvin Coolidge, that he was drawing in new support from Southern Democrats. On June 5th in Sacramento, the Councilors got together once more and designated Coolidge as the Nationalist nominee for president. With new campaign promises to outlaw left-wing political organizations, expand the military sector, and boost the power of the U.S. executive branch substantially, Coolidge had roaring approval when he spoke.

Calvin Coolidge9

Benjamin Young4
Henry W. Keyes2
T. Jeff Busby2
John Stille1
286  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Paint it Red: The Rise of the American Left (1908-) on: February 15, 2016, 03:11:18 pm

Frontrunners for the 1932 Progressive Nomination: Roosevelt and Hoover

  The recipient for the fall of the Democratic rule had been the Progressive Party. Upon winning majorities in both the House and Senate in 1930, the party was greeted as a true 'voice of the people' against the comfortable, upper-class Democratic establishment. For a long time, the Progressives had been calling for federal regulations and a social insurance program, since way back under President Roosevelt. Not until 1929 did it become clear just how necessary such restrictions on Wall Street were.

   A plethora of Progressive candidates jumped in the race towards winter 1931. Everyone wanted a shot at the much-speculated "Progressive Government" of 1933. As each of these candidates would argue, keeping Congress Progressive would guarantee major reforms took place should someone from their party win the presidency. Presidents Theodore Roosevelt and Hiram Johnson had a difficult time passing legislation through because of the Democratic Congress. As the Bull Moose Party was expected to retain (or even expand upon) its 1930 gains, whomever would win in November would have the means to fulfill his mandate.

  Herbert Hoover was the first to announce his candidacy. Hoover, since 1928, worked with his Progressive colleagues in Congress to push through regulatory measures he himself initially proposed during his presidential campaign. He was as well-known as ever in 1932, yet the sour taste from his campaign-crushing RNC endorsement left many wanting more. Knowing Hoover was not an inevitability, Representative Franck R. Havenner (P-CA) also would declare his intention to dethrone Henry Ford.

  Hoover and Havenner would later be joined by Rep. Raymond Haight, Senator Burton K. Wheeler, and Governor Alfred Landon (P-KS). Each of these individuals would find some time in the national spotlight with their varying proposals for the nation. Landon, especially, would find a great deal of support from the business class in the industrial Midwest. Other big names like Senator Charles Curtis and Speaker William Stephens refused to run.

  Then came the serious competitor to Hoover's frontrunner status. On February 15th, Governor Theodore Roosevelt, Jr., of New York declared that he would be running for the presidency. Roosevelt was described often as a "rising star" within the party, and had masterfully mediated between the left and right-wings of the New York Progressives as governor. He instituted the nation's first modern Labor Standards Act and fended off Socialist challengers on multiple occasions: including a fierce 1930 fight with Rep. Norman Thomas (S-NY) which ended in a near-stalemate.

  Roosevelt proclaimed that if elected, he would do everything in his power to "bring an expedient end" to the Depression. The governor endorsed Progressive legislation calling for an increased income tax and internationally-friendly trade, claiming that any and all federal revenue would be utilized in a new public jobs program. Roosevelt decried President Ford as a "swell-hearted man with simply too much on his plate." He would charge against the president quite fiercely, yet keep prime his positive campaign message.
287  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Election What-ifs? / Re: Paint it Red: The Rise of the American Left (1908-) on: February 14, 2016, 03:14:51 pm

Secretary Garner's Resignation Had Some Question the Viability of the Ford Administration

Chapter Twelve: The Election of 1932: A New Deal for the American People

  As reports came out that the tariff bump had worsened the economy and industrial production was reaching new lows, the traditionally Democratic establishment began gearing up to oust Henry Ford. The president had previously followed the insistence of the J.P. Morgan banking empire and refused any reflationary policies. Back in early 1930, this had been the dominant call from Wall Street: that no protectionist measures be enacted and to continue down the road laissez-faire economics. Less than a year later, Ford's tone changed dramatically, and he began halfheartedly endorsing the mildest of reforms.

  President Henry Ford declared that he would be running for re-election in November of 1931. He announced that he would be competing as a moderate, in the same spirit as McAdoo had, and argued for the reinstating of the Democratic majority in Congress. Ford would state, "stability had been attained" under Presidents Fitzgerald and McAdoo, and a return to this "Democratic Stability" could only take place with a Democrat in the White House. Ford would rally behind "market-friendly" legislation to remedy the economy, and continuously reject any possibilities of clear-cut compromise with the "uncompromising" Progressives.

  Pundits had offered the notion in mid-1930 that Henry Ford was becoming the Democrats' Philander Knox. Both Ford and Knox had succeeded enormously popular presidents, each had lost their party's majority in Congress, and each vowed strict allegiance to market forces and the wealthiest Americans. Secretary John Garner resigned on December 10th, 1931, at the insistence of President Ford. Apparently the two disagreed fundamentally on how to repair the economy, but Garner began publicly speaking out against the incumbent much like State Secretary La Follette had when he resigned. In the midst of the election, Garner would famously call Ford, "about as insightful as John Taylor Adams and as effective as Phil Knox."

  The House of Morgan, a firm which had gone from supporting the Republicans to supporting Ford in 1928, backed away from the president when he started giving credence to federal regulations. Liberal Democrats in the LDC had long since walked away from President Ford, and there had been speculation that a separate candidacy would come into existence. Most moderates in the party still stood by Henry Ford, albeit reluctantly. Only the most conservative Democrats had been enthusiastically supporting the re-election of Henry Ford, and this demographic was slipping away with the Solid South.

  Still, Henry Ford did have the advantage of incumbency, as well as the financial backing of the largest political party in the United States and the private reassurance of former President McAdoo that the nation would stick with the Democrats. Regardless of any endorsements and financial supremacy, it took votes to elect a president. Judging by the state of the economy and the opinion of the mainstream press, these votes were headed to other candidates.

  Lloyd Russell, a journalist for the New York Times, wrote in November of 1928 that it would take, "a public policy disaster of unparalleled proportions to overturn the fixed Democratic presence in our republic." Russell, precisely three years later, published a piece highlighting the missteps of the Ford Administration entitled, "Unparalleled Proportions."
288  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Bernie Sanders releases powerful SC ad trying to win over minorities on: February 14, 2016, 01:34:58 pm
Its okay. I like the Erica Garner one better.
289  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Does the fact that Bernie Sanders is 75 years old bother you? on: February 14, 2016, 01:33:09 pm
Trump, Hillary and Sanders are all roughly in the same age bracket, and they all seem to be in good health. VP pick does matter quite a lot for Sanders should he be the nominee.
290  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Has Trump significantly damaged his campaign tonight? on: February 13, 2016, 11:36:59 pm
As a 106-year old on welfare, I was personally offended by Donald Trump.
291  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:58:53 pm
erm they're coming back??

Probably just to say, "Welcome back!" And then immediately "Good night!"

That's literally what happened. Ad revenue, nothing else.
292  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:43:34 pm
Rubio. Stop jacking off Ronald Reagan.
293  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:33:57 pm
I am so glad I am not a Republican right now.

It's not as if the Democratic candidates are much better this year lol

Um, yes they are.
294  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:32:22 pm
Can Rubio go one answer without mentioning Obama?

It's not in his programming.
295  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:29:53 pm
Does Reagan get 30 seconds to respond since his name was mentioned?
296  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of Justice Scalia on: February 13, 2016, 10:17:51 pm
297  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:16:08 pm
Today I learned that poverty will disappear when government regulations are repealed.
298  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:11:36 pm
Maybe we should vet debate go-ers before we talk about vetting immigrants.
299  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 10:08:48 pm
This is quickly turning into Jerry Springer.
300  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: CBS Greenville, SC GOP debate @9pm ET **live commentary thread** on: February 13, 2016, 09:43:42 pm
Calling out Bush and saying 9/11 happened under his watch is unprecedented in American politics.
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