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1  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: "Art of the Deal" Ghostwriter predicts that Trump will resign by end of year on: August 18, 2017, 05:22:41 pm
I have a hard time seeing Trump ever resign even while claiming it has Victory, as it is simply too thin of veil for his ego to disguise as anything other than defeat. However, I could totally see him making the same Victory claim in choosing not to run for reelection. But to do that he has to survive his full term.

Maybe he would only have to last until Pence has secured the nomination. Then he can play it as "handing off" things to Pence. (Because of course his anointed successor will win. Like changing CEOs. And if he doesn't, that's obviously not Trump's fault now, is it?)
2  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: "Art of the Deal" Ghostwriter predicts that Trump will resign by end of year on: August 18, 2017, 03:35:56 pm
The Trump Organization has 22,450 employees (Wikipedia).

Others: Wal*Mart -- 1.3 M in the US alone, 2.3 M worldwide
McDonald's 375 K  (not including franchisees)
Coca-Cola 123K
Wendy's 37K
Kohl's 140K
US Postal Service 675K
Bank of America 208K
Ford Motor Company 201K
Exxon-Mobil 73.5K
Los Angeles Unified School District 26,556 teachers alone
Berkshire-Hathaway 367K
Koch Industries 100K


You think Trump is going to be held back by a pesky thing like reality? If he wanted to say that, he'd count all the people his companies have ever employed, make upadd in an estimate for his total number of contractors, and then add more based on all the people 'who only have jobs because of his companies' and call it a total. After all, that's how he does his accounting.
3  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Edit: Trump Tells Aides He Has Decided to Remove Stephen Bannon on: August 18, 2017, 03:31:21 pm
 Got to wonder how much of the removal was due to personality rather than politics.  If Bannon had a much lower public profile, if Trump wasn't jealous of him, would Bannon still be there?  Perhaps the future of Stephen Miller (who I believe Trump was pleased with for his exchange with Acosta at CNN recently over the RAISE act), or Rick Dearborn the deputy chief of staff who is from Sessions staff, will be an indicator of this

Are we certain that it really was removal and that he didn't in fact quit? Trump certainly can't be trusted. And it makes a degree of sense that with access to the President blocked by Kelly (and maybe with an increasingly deranged Trump) Bannon could want to get out and go do something else.
4  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Missouri state senator wishes for Trump assassination on: August 18, 2017, 03:00:09 pm
Maria Chappelle-Nadal: ‘There’s No Way In Hell That I’m Resigning’
http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2017/08/17/maria-chappelle-nadal-no-way-in-hell-resigning-facebook/

Quote
Chappelle-Nadal told KMOX’s Carol Daniel, “There is no way in hell that I’m resigning. There are legislators who have cheated on their wives, they have smoked in the legislature, in the state capitol. If they have not been asked to resign for those acts, which I do believe that cheating on your wife or your spouse is immoral, I am not resigning for a mistake that I made and that I’m owning up to.”

She is doing the very opposite of owning up to her mistake. She needs to resign. If she will not, the Democratic party needs to spearhead a recall effort, in addition to expelling her from the party.

The Democrats cannot (and should not) attempt to succeed by acting like Trump only on the other side of the political spectrum.  They need to be better than Trump or his GOP cult. This should not be difficult. Accepting violence into our already-fraught and divided politics will doom us.


Does Missouri have recalls for legislative races?

It would appear not:
https://ballotpedia.org/Laws_governing_recall_in_Missouri

Maybe the MO Senate could expel her? (Although it's totally R dominated, of course.)
5  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: "Art of the Deal" Ghostwriter predicts that Trump will resign by end of year on: August 18, 2017, 02:54:25 pm
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/17/politics/art-of-the-deal-author-trump-resignation-prediction/index.html

Quote
The ghostwriter of "The Art of the Deal" thinks President Donald Trump will eventually call it quits.

Tony Schwartz, the man behind Trump's 1987 memoir, took to Twitter on Wednesday to vocalize his forecast for Trump's political future.

"The circle is closing at blinding speed," Schwartz tweeted. "Trump is going to resign and declare victory before Mueller and congress leave him no choice."

In a follow-up tweet, he added: "Trump's presidency is effectively over. Would be amazed if he survives till end of the year. More likely resigns by fall, if not sooner."

Does he know something we don't?

LOL. Victory over what? His own incompetence?


Oh, come on. A hypothetical Trump victory-resignation practically writes itself.
Quote
Such a huge crowd. This has to be the biggest crowd ever on the Mall. Everyone coming to see me, because I have done what no other President could ever dream of doing, because I'm so amazing. Because the American people elected me in a landslide election like never before. I won so big. A huge victory. And when I took over, the economy was terrible, the military - terrible. Economy terrible. Everything terrible after Obama. A nice man, I'm sure, but he just wasn't up to being President.

I have been the best and most successful President ever. <Recites a bunch of numbers his staffers came up with by throwing darts> Our enemies have been shown their place. Our friends are happier with us than ever before. Our trade deals have all been re-negotiated to benefit America First. We are more secure than ever. All due to me, and my great deal-making skills as President. Hugely successful Presidency!

But treasonous Democrats and Republican traitors are dragging the nation back into the swamp. Using Fake News as an excuse for their witch hunts that are hurting our great nation and its great people. Donald Trump will not allow himself, and the incredible job he has done, to be used as a distraction by the people who want to destroy our nation.

So, effective at [technically wrong date but no one cares] I am resigning from the Presidency to focus on my business interests, which I have neglected and have suffered terribly, while I've been serving the country. Did you know that Trump is the third largest employer in the United States? I've personally created more jobs with my companies that Obama did in his entire term as President. So many successful companies. Did I mention that I'm worth thirty billion now?  One of the most successful men on the planet. No other president has ever been so rich or so talented.

I have Made America Great again, by making America First in the world again. So many great deals I have made. I have made the military strong again, so strong. And the economy is up higher than it ever has been before, because I am just a great president. So I am leaving Vice-President Pence in charge, although he knows he can come to me if he needs anything, my door is always open. Although I may charge him, because I'm starting new company, Trump Consulting, showing everyone how to Be Great Again. And trust me, there's no one better, at anything.

You're Welcome, America!
6  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Will Trump be President on January 19th, 2021? on: August 18, 2017, 12:36:11 pm
'Art of the Deal' ghostwriter predicts Trump will resign

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/17/politics/art-of-the-deal-author-trump-resignation-prediction/index.html

Quote
"The circle is closing at blinding speed," Schwartz tweeted. "Trump is going to resign and declare victory before Mueller and congress leave him no choice."

In a follow-up tweet, he added: "Trump's presidency is effectively over. Would be amazed if he survives till end of the year. More likely resigns by fall, if not sooner."

"I surely believe that at some point over the next period of time, he's going to have to figure out a way to resign," Schwartz said. "The reason he's going to do that, as opposed to go through what could be an impeachment process or a continuing humiliation, is that he wants to figure out a way, as he has done all his career, to turn a loss into a victory. So he will declare victory when he leaves."
7  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Missouri state senator wishes for Trump assassination on: August 18, 2017, 11:36:39 am
Maria Chappelle-Nadal: ‘There’s No Way In Hell That I’m Resigning’
http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2017/08/17/maria-chappelle-nadal-no-way-in-hell-resigning-facebook/

Quote
Chappelle-Nadal told KMOX’s Carol Daniel, “There is no way in hell that I’m resigning. There are legislators who have cheated on their wives, they have smoked in the legislature, in the state capitol. If they have not been asked to resign for those acts, which I do believe that cheating on your wife or your spouse is immoral, I am not resigning for a mistake that I made and that I’m owning up to.”

She is doing the very opposite of owning up to her mistake. She needs to resign. If she will not, the Democratic party needs to spearhead a recall effort, in addition to expelling her from the party.

The Democrats cannot (and should not) attempt to succeed by acting like Trump only on the other side of the political spectrum.  They need to be better than Trump or his GOP cult. This should not be difficult. Accepting violence into our already-fraught and divided politics will doom us.
8  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Trump takes aim at courts (again) on: August 18, 2017, 09:49:00 am
It almost sounds like Deplorable Don is worried about the courts.


I have a few acquaintances who are convinced this is Team Trump's real plan. That they want to get things chaotic and violent to justify martial law.
9  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Trump Abandons Plan for Council on Infrastructure on: August 18, 2017, 12:21:25 am
To recap:

-No health care reform

-No tax reform

-No infrastructure

-No wall

-No defeat of ISIS

Are we tired of all the winning yet?

I'll... accept the wins the left has had. (GOP outing themselves as utterly partisan racists. Trump being an even bigger stupid, incompetent jackwagon than expected. No ACA repeal.  No more wars yet.)

I am getting a little tired of all the whining from the Twit-in-Chief.
10  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Will Trump Recover? on: August 17, 2017, 08:09:36 pm
I've generally been of the view that it's going to take far longer to get Trump out of office - via the 25th, impeachment, or him resigning - than we would like. That said, he term has more incompetence and self-inflicted wounds than I, a long-time Trump critic, ever thought possible.

Still, I think there's a real chance he's losing it. Maybe it's the pressures of the office, or maybe he's internally panicking over Mueller. Still I'd say odds of him recovering to his old net -16 or close to it for a while are three out of four.
11  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Longtime Trump business partner told family he and POTUS are both going to jail on: August 17, 2017, 03:58:48 pm
I certainly hope that this is true and that Trump is shaking like a sh1tting dog.

I've no idea if it is true or not. But it does fit my expectations. And if Trump really knows that this is coming, it could explain why he's been even more unhinged than usual lately.

Consider. News broke or leaked that Mueller is investigating Trump's finances on July 20th.

Since then we've had endless White House drama, the Transgender Ban, calls for police brutality, a stream of  threats and insults about ACA, the Korean ICBM Crisis, an attempt to make drug problems a rallying cry, threats at Venezuela,  and  the President publicly supported Nazis and then went and hid in Trump Tower for days. Since then, he's abandoned all of his efforts to work with the business community and ranted on twitter.

None of these individually are out of character for him. But I think they could be seen as signs of a panicked Trump who is losing it. Maybe because he knows (or thinks) his end is inevitable, now.



 
12  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: What Could Trump Do ... on: August 17, 2017, 03:36:51 pm
Serious answer.


As a President, nothing. Before I could or would support him, he would need to acknowledge his own mental health issues and other shortcomings. Doing so would be admitting he was unfit for office and lead to swift impeachment, even moreso if he started moving in directions that someone on the far left like myself would support.


He could publicly apologize, and announce that he was resigning for the good of the nation, and to seek help for his mental health issues. He could then spend some of his life and supposedly vast fortune truly helping to address the problems he has created and worsened as President. Useful criticism of the real flaws of our democracy would be a service he would also be uniquely positioned to do for his fellow citizens. I could then support him as a person and activist.

13  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Longtime Trump business partner told family he and POTUS are both going to jail on: August 17, 2017, 02:22:08 pm
I've said for a long time that past corrupt financial dealings were more likely to lead to his downfall than any possible contacts with Russia over the election.
14  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: When will Charlottesville be out of the news? on: August 17, 2017, 02:20:18 pm
Phoenix mayor wants Trump to stay away from city next week because of Charlottesville

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/08/17/phoenix-mayor-wants-trump-to-stay-away-from-city-next-week-because-of-charlottesville/

Quote
Phoenix Mayor Greg Stanton urged President Trump to delay a campaign-style rally set for the city next week, expressing fear that his appearance would “enflame emotions” while “our nation is still healing from the tragic events in Charlottesville.”

With Trump fanning the flames, I think Charlottesville just might stay in the public consciousness as long as Fort Sumter. (Or maybe Harpers Ferry?) Not really a good sign.
15  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Missouri state senator wishes for Trump assassination on: August 17, 2017, 02:07:10 pm
Shame on you, State Sen. Maria Chappelle-Nadal! I despise Trump and his administration, but that was uncalled for! 

(Without having read the post myself - I avoid facebook like the plague.)

Advocating political violence is a huge part of what is wrong with Trump. This kind of vile nonsense must be opposed at every step, no matter who does it. State Sen. Maria Chappelle-Nadal should resign her position immediately, and be removed from any and all positions in the Democratic party. Public servants calling for political assassination is utterly unacceptable, and the Dems need to say that, loud and clear.
You threaten the President all the time lol

That is a lie.

Put up or shut up.
16  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Missouri state senator wishes for Trump assassination on: August 17, 2017, 01:33:42 pm
Shame on you, State Sen. Maria Chappelle-Nadal! I despise Trump and his administration, but that was uncalled for! 

(Without having read the post myself - I avoid facebook like the plague.)

Advocating political violence is a huge part of what is wrong with Trump. This kind of vile nonsense must be opposed at every step, no matter who does it. State Sen. Maria Chappelle-Nadal should resign her position immediately, and be removed from any and all positions in the Democratic party. Public servants calling for political assassination is utterly unacceptable, and the Dems need to say that, loud and clear.
17  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Protestors Topple Confederate Monument in North Carolina on: August 17, 2017, 12:50:05 pm
>Implying George S Patton's political opinion is relevant to any of us

He's just an example of the point I'm trying to make. 1940s American men, including the ones who served in WW2, were not a very left-wing bunch. Plenty of them would sympathize with Trump and/or the alt-right today, contrary to what today's leftists apparently think.

Thomas, if you're trying to make the point that the men born in the early 20th century and (at least among officers) late 19th century are more socially conservative than the average person in the 21st century, you're not exactly giving us a hot take here. Nor a remotely relevant one.

I think it's relevant. Leftists and their sympathizers are posting memes all over social media showing photos of American troops who served in WW2 with captions like ''violent, alt-left thugs''. The memes imply that all of the men in those photos would sympathize with the modern left today, which is an absurd assumption to make.

No, the memes imply that smashing Nazis (and other fascists) is a good and noble goal to which the vast majority of humanity did and should aspire, no matter our other differences.
18  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Do you actually favour impeachment of Donald Trump? on: August 17, 2017, 11:10:54 am
I have always been in favor of impeaching Trump. He's in open violation of the Emoluments Clause, and has been for his entire term of office.

On top of that, he's grossly unfit as he has repeatedly demonstrated. And impeachment is ultimately "whatever Congress wants". There are ample grounds for it.

19  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Trump goes full Alt-Right and voids everything he said yesterday on: August 17, 2017, 09:49:23 am
Why does he single out Graham though? There were dozens of Republican congresspeople who have critcized him since Tuesday. Must be something personal.

Because Trump is a bigot against minorities /s

In reality, because railing against someone totally unpopular is likely to be a rallying cry.

Bingo. It's a grade school bully picking on who he sees as the geeky outsider.  Trump hasn't yet figured out that adults in modern civilization don't always function like that.
20  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Trump goes full Alt-Right and voids everything he said yesterday on: August 17, 2017, 09:39:47 am
Our great leader now goes after Lindsey Graham big league:

Quote from: @realdonaldtrump
Publicity seeking Lindsey Graham falsely stated that I said there is moral equivalency between the KKK, neo-Nazis & white supremacists...... ...and people like Ms. Heyer. Such a disgusting lie. He just can't forget his election trouncing.The people of South Carolina will remember!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/898127175525728256
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/898128290698989568

And then he did exactly that, again, three hours later by comparing Founding Fathers to Confederate leaders. Truly, all the mental acuity and self-awareness of a turnip.
21  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Why is there a false equivalence in Charlottesville? on: August 16, 2017, 09:42:49 pm
The Nazis are falling back to a false equivalence because their actions and their ideals are utterly indefensible.
22  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Protestors Topple Confederate Monument in North Carolina on: August 16, 2017, 07:12:21 pm
As long as we're talking failed regimes guilty of massive war crimes I'd like to see these get toppled too:
Lenin Statues in America
Las Vegas - outside Red Square Restaurant, Mandalay Bay Hotel - Headless
Atlantic City, New Jersey - in the Tropicana Casino
New York City - on top of the Red Square apartment building, E. Houston St. in the East Village[3]
Seattle - Fremont neighborhood (See Statue of Lenin (Seattle))
Head of Lenin, Los Angeles, California - outside a branch of the Ace Gallery, the Ace Museum, on the corner of La Brea Avenue and 4th Street.
Stalin:
A bust of Stalin is displayed at the National D-Day Memorial in Bedford, Virginia.

Lenin statues in vegas/atlantic city are probably more insulting to the man than tearing the things down would be.
Also In regards to the Op the statue at hand was put up in 1924 at a height of a KKK revival .
At least Seattle should go down then along with changes at these statues in the south - as well as Stone Mountain which was carved in 1916 by the Daughters of the Confederacy.

Stacey Abrams, a Democratic candidate for GA governor, has called for removing the Confederate faces from Stone Mountain.

This would be one where I might have to draw a line. That's the largest bas relief sculpture in the world, and it's not exactly one you can put in a museum. Plus, that's one that really does have a notable place in American - not just Confederate history: "Let freedom ring from Stone Mountain of Georgia." I mean, I get where they're coming from, but...

I was having similar sentiments, and flashback to the Taliban. And then I read this:

The Georgia code has a clear mandate for the memorial, saying it should be “preserved and protected for all time as a tribute to the bravery and heroism of the citizens of this state who suffered and died in their cause.”

Wikipedia also has this:

Quote
The carving was conceived by Mrs. C. Helen Plane, a charter member of the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC). The Venable Brothers, owners of the mountain, deeded the north face of the mountain to the UDC in 1916. The UDC was given 12 years to complete a sizable Civil War monument. Gutzon Borglum was commissioned to do the carving. Borglum abandoned the project in 1925 (and later went on to begin Mount Rushmore). American sculptor Augustus Lukeman continued until 1928, when further work stopped for thirty years. In 1958, at the urging of Governor Marvin Griffin, the Georgia legislature approved a measure to purchase Stone Mountain for $1,125,000. In 1963, Walker Hancock was selected to complete the carving, and work began in 1964. The carving was completed by Roy Faulkner, who later operated a museum (now closed) on nearby Memorial Drive commemorating the carving's history. The carving was considered complete[7] on March 3, 1972.

Carving and the Ku Klux Klan[edit]

The revival of the Ku Klux Klan was emboldened by the release of D. W. Griffith's Klan-glorifying film The Birth of a Nation,[8] and coincided with the August 1915 lynching of Leo Frank. On November 25 of the same year, a small group, including fifteen robed and hooded "charter members" of the new organization, met at Stone Mountain to create a new iteration of the Klan. They were led by William J. Simmons, and included two elderly members of the original Klan. As part of their ceremony, they burned a crude cross.[9]

Fundraising for the monument resumed in 1923. In October of that year, Venable granted the Klan easement with perpetual right to hold celebrations as they desired.[10] The influence of the UDC continued, in support of Mrs. Plane's vision of a carving explicitly for the purpose of creating a Confederate memorial.


The good people of Georgia can blow it right off the mountain and it will be fine by me.

23  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: One of the best articles I have seen on the GOP and Trump. on: August 16, 2017, 06:34:35 pm
I agree with the piece's general tenor, but I think the author is going overboard here:

Quote
Trump has taught the Republican Party a few unfortunate things. He showed that the penalty for overt racism, not to mention for admissions of habitual sexual assault, is a lot lower among the entire electorate than it is among cultural and business elites. (I say entire for a reason: Trump seems to have done no worse among black or Hispanic voters than Romney did.)

Trump showed the 2013 GOP Autopsy report was wrong, and that the party did not need to move to the center on immigration and inclusion to win elections. In fact, it could win by shifting in a nativist direction and winning even more support among white voters.


I strongly suspect that the above is only true if you add, when running against a high-profile Democratic nominee with high negatives who runs a bad campaign. And probably another conditional, and when no one realized how terrible President Trump would truly be.

Maybe I'm wrong. And maybe the Democratic Party will uselessly chase it's own tail and nominate another poor choice to be nominee. But my prediction is that anyone who thinks Trump's victory was more tactical than circumstantial, who thinks that mobilizing American Nazis and their fellow travelers is going to be a successful strategy for winning elections, is going to be disappointed. (Assuming we still have elections. They are Nazis, and following the Hitler route will doubtless come naturally.)

24  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Trump goes full Alt-Right and voids everything he said yesterday on: August 16, 2017, 06:22:37 pm
The Left demonizes white people, period. It's not fair that this rubs off on the Democratic party, but it does. Yesterday Nikkita Oliver, who came in third place in the Seattle mayoral primary, attacked the two women who made it into the runoff as "white." Of course this kind of behavior is inflammatory and nurtures the Trump-right. I wish both sides would cut it out, or a vital 'center' ideology would be resuscitated.

Saying "both sides" when comparing the President of the United States and head of the Republican Party to someone came in third place in the Seattle mayoral primary is disingenuous, at best.
25  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: North Korea Mega Thread on: August 16, 2017, 08:10:19 am
Donald J. Trump‏ Verified account @realDonaldTrump  28 minutes ago
 Kim Jong Un of North Korea made a very wise and well reasoned decision. The alternative would have been both catastrophic and unacceptable!

It's nice that at least one of the nations involved in this manufactured crisis has a leader capable of making wise and well-reasoned decisions.
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