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76  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Opinion of people who wear hoodies and baggy pants on: August 27, 2014, 06:32:20 pm
I'm not sold on the hats, but otherwise...
77  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Resumption of Paramilitary Activity on: August 27, 2014, 06:16:15 pm
I will follow this organisation's actions with interest.
78  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Regional Governments / Re: Pacific Legislative Council Speaker election on: August 27, 2014, 06:03:04 pm
The nominations period has ended. Members of the Legislative Council now have 24 hours to elect a speaker.

[ ] Devin (F-WA)
[ ] Write in: _________________
79  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Regional Governments / Re: Twelfth (12th) Pacific Legislative Council and Discussion Thread on: August 27, 2014, 05:55:42 pm
I hereby propose:


To mandate the display of retail prices inclusive of sales tax

Be it enacted by the Legislative Council of the Pacific Region assembled as follows—


1. This Act shall be called the 'Accurate Display of Prices (Pacific) Act of 2014.’

1. All retail outlets selling goods, of any sort, on which a regional sales tax is levied shall be required to display the price inclusive of the amount of sales tax levied on the unit sold.

2. Failure to abide by the provisions of this Act shall constitute false advertising and shall be treated accordingly by law.


1. This Act shall take effect on 1 March 2015.
80  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Regional Governments / Re: Twelfth (12th) Pacific Council and Discussion Thread on: August 27, 2014, 05:52:58 pm
I hereby propose:


To commemorate the momentous and historic day of the 26th of August

Be it enacted by the Legislative Council of the Pacific Region assembled as follows—


1. This Act shall be called the '26th of August Commemoration (Pacific) Act of 2014.’

1. The following roads shall be renamed "26th of August Avenue":
  • Broadway, San Diego
  • Seco Arroyo Parkway, Pasadena (to be named 26th of August Parkway outside of the city)
  • Del Monte Avenue, Monterey
  • Burnside Street, Portland
  • Fourth Avenue, Seattle
  • Washington Street, Phoenix
  • Menaul Boulevard, Albuquerque
  • Bannock Street, Boise
  • Palm Drive and University Avenue, Palo Alto
  • Shattuck Avenue, Berkeley

The renamings are to apply where the roads extend into other municipalities, unless otherwise noted.'


1. The following public squares and parks shall be renamed "26th of August Square":
  • Justin Herman Plaza, San Francisco
  • Grand Park, Los Angeles
  • Frank H. Ogawa Plaza, Oakland
  • St. James Park, San Jose
  • Symphony Park, Las Vegas
  • Park Blocks, Eugene
  • Washington Square, Salt Lake City
  • El Presidio Park, Tucson
  • San Jacinto Square, El Paso


1. $52 million shall be appropriated for the the costs of this renaming.
81  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: The Good Post Gallery II on: August 27, 2014, 04:59:39 pm
August 2006: "No one could beat Hillary in a primary."

The nice thing about being on a forum that's been online since 2003 is that you can actually test these theories and it's quite clear people here in August 2006 thought Mark Warner was a clear favorite over the Hillary for the nomination with Russ Feingold being the great liberal hope:


There's no real Warner or Feingold being pumped up at the moment. There's no Obama to be found anywhere either.
82  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Iowa Republican admits being bribed to endorse Ron Paul on: August 27, 2014, 04:50:35 pm
Why admit to it? He could be prosecuted for this, no?
83  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Update XVI: Sidejackin' it in the Train Room. on: August 27, 2014, 04:21:56 pm
Won't people in Oklahoma think bushie is...you know...if he doesn't get married?

A pedophile?  Well yes, but we've already told him about that mustache.

I meant a gay. I assume most people think something is wrong with you if you're over 22 and single in Oklahoma.

Southerners I've met in the Navy are stunned when they find out I'm a single 26.  Bushie is waaaaaaaaaay past that.  The pestering from his peers and family must be indescribable.

I mean I'm sure they look at him and understand why....
84  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Аverroës vs. PPT TNF on: August 27, 2014, 04:10:35 pm
Amicus Brief on behalf of Аverroës Nix by Governor Varavour

Your honours,

I would like to humbly submit the following historic contextual evidence, in support of the petitioner, for your consideration. As this case is rather unique- there does not appear to be any historical precedent for a President Pro Tempore attempting to cast a tie-breaking vote. This, by all means, appears to be a legal innovation- and thus unconstitutional and illegal.

First, I submit the following, which deals with Republic of Atlasia's predecessor, the United States of America, and comes from the official website of the United States Senate:

The Constitution provides for two officers to preside over the Senate. The Vice President of the United States is designated as the president of the Senate. In this capacity, the vice president was expected to preside at regular sessions of the Senate, casting votes only to break ties. From John Adams in 1789 to Richard Nixon in the 1950s, presiding over the Senate was the chief function of vice presidents, who had an office in the Capitol, received their staff support and office expenses through the legislative appropriations, and rarely were invited to participate in cabinet meetings or other executive activities. In 1961, Vice President Lyndon B. Johnson changed the vice presidency by moving his chief office from the Capitol to the White House, by directing his attention to executive functions, and by attending Senate sessions only at critical times when his vote, or ruling from the chair, might be necessary. Vice presidents since Johnson’s time have followed his example.

When we consider that the vice president used to be the Senate's regular presiding officer, we can better understand why the Constitution further provided that in the absence of the vice president the Senate could choose a president pro tempore to perform the duties of the chair. Pro tempore is a Latin term meaning "for the time being"; thus, the occupant of the position was conceived as a temporary presiding officer. Since vice presidents presided routinely in the 18th and 19th centuries, the Senate thought it necessary to choose a president pro tempore only for the limited periods when the vice president might be ill or otherwise absent. As a result, the Senate frequently elected several presidents pro tempore during a single session.

The Constitution is quite unspecific in its definition of the vice president's role as presiding officer, beyond casting tie-breaking votes. John Adams, the first vice president, attempted to influence the Senate’s decisions on legislation during his first term, but eventually came to see the presiding officer as a neutral figure. That role has remained constant since that time. Adams cast more tie-breaking votes (29) than has any vice president who succeeded him. By contrast, during his eight years of service as vice president, George H.W. Bush cast only eight tie-breaking votes, Al Gore broke four ties, and Vice President Dick Cheney voted eight times to break ties. The vice president is not at liberty to address the Senate, except by unanimous consent. Nor should any senator speak while presiding, other than to make necessary rulings and announcements or to maintain order.

As we can see, the vice president, despite it being a rather thankless role, and despite the increase in his executive authority, has always taken on the responsibility of breaking tied votes. The logical inference would be that this task, part of the reason one Vice President called the post "worth less than a warm bucket of piss", can be conducted by the Vice President and the Vice President alone. If an alternative was possible, the Vice President would have instructed the President Pro Tempore to cast the tie-breaking vote.

Further evidence for this view is found from this document, also the work of the United States Senate. As it shows, no tie breaking vote was cast during a Vice Presidential vacancy. This, again, would strongly suggest that only a Vice President can cast a tie breaking vote.

Other (but still quite reputable) scholarly legal sources provide more concrete concurrence. Gerard N. Magliocca, the Samuel R. Rosen Professor at the Indiana University Robert H. McKinney School of Law, writes that;

There have been a few stories recently speculating on how the Senate would function if the November elections resulted in a 50-50 split between Republicans and Democrats.  The standard answer is that that Joe Biden would have to spend a lot more time on Capitol Hill to cast his tie-breaking vote.  While the practice has always been that a vice-president must cast his Senate vote in person, I wonder if that should be changed.

There are good reasons for not allowing proxy voting by House and Senate members.  You might think part of the duty of being a member is to show up and cast votes.  Verifying the accuracy of proxy votes could also be a problem, especially if an absent member is ill or in some remote place.  Likewise, permitting proxy voting might give party leaders more power than they already possess by effectively delegating votes to them.  (In this respect, you might say that voting in Congress is simply non-delegable.)

The Vice President, he says, must be the one to cast a tie breaking vote. He would like to see this changed, but it is firmly established this is the case.

William Josephson, a retired partner at a Philadelphia law firm, writes for the University of Pennsylvania's law school in a paper that,

Of course, in those situations when the vice presidency was vacant, that officer would not be available to break any tied Senate vote for Vice President. Nor would the Vice President be available “when he shall exercise the Office of President.”

It is made clear here, again, that the a tied vote would be left tied by the vacancy of the office of Vice-President. And finally, a page by the Indiana University at Bloomington Law School answers the question of "What happens in the event of a tie vote in Congress? If the tie vote is in the Senate, and the Vice-President is not there to break it — what is the outcome?" by writing that;

A tie vote means the proposal loses, whether it be in the House, Senate, on the floor, or in committee.

Only the Vice-President has the authority under the Constitution to break a tie vote, and only on the Senate floor. Of course, he would only need to come to the Senate to do that if the Administration favored the proposition. In that case, he would vote aye, tipping the scales from 50-50 to 51-50 [if all Senators were present and voting.]

If the Administration opposed the matter, then his vote would be unnecessary. If the vote were tied at 50-50, the matter would lose automatically.

I am sure there is a great many more examples of this out there in the body of legal scholarship, but I consider this a sufficient selection. I hope my brief helps settle the matter that the action taken by the President Pro Tempore constitutes a gross violation of the constitution and that the "election" of Tyrion as Vice-President did not take place.

Governor Varavour
85  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Regional Governments / Re: NE3: Forever Alone Act (At Final Vote) on: August 27, 2014, 03:19:38 pm
"we recognize incestuous relationships"
86  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: Keaton House Polling: Lawsuit Opinion Poll on: August 27, 2014, 02:27:35 pm
The polls are skewed!
87  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Elections / Re: BIOPOLITICS with Foucaulf - 96.3 FM, Minneapolis on: August 27, 2014, 01:31:36 pm
Coincidentally, 96.3 FM used to be WQXR, the classical music station, until a few years ago. Good choice.
88  Forum Community / Forum Community / Re: Atlas Forum IRC Channel on: August 27, 2014, 01:23:41 pm
89  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Austrian Vice-Chancellor & Finance Minister & ÖVP-leader Spindelegger resigns on: August 27, 2014, 12:22:01 pm
The continued OVP-SPO coalition bothers me a fair deal.
90  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: Ukraine Crisis on: August 27, 2014, 12:14:45 pm
George Shultz and William Perry had a good piece in the Journal today; I completely forgot about that thing called the "Budapest Memorandum"... ugh.
91  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Nine year old kills gun instructor with Uzi on: August 27, 2014, 11:36:43 am
They should be banned, maybe except for certain people paying above a certain (very high) amount of taxes.

Your bizarre "arm only the rich" argument is somewhat worrying, Simfan.

Why? They should be protected from people like TNF, seatown, Bandit, and their Occupier ilk. For the rest of us, it should be banned, across the board.
92  Atlas Fantasy Elections / Atlas Fantasy Government / Re: Аverroës vs. PPT TNF on: August 27, 2014, 11:24:23 am
I would like to submit an amicus for the petitioner dealing with precedent, if I can find any.
93  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Nine year old kills gun instructor with Uzi on: August 27, 2014, 11:22:10 am
The kid couldn't handle the gun. She's not to blame. "Got what was coming to him?" What is wrong with you? What is wrong with all of you?
94  General Politics / Individual Politics / Time to feel young on: August 27, 2014, 10:37:42 am
Cleopatra was closer to us in the present day than she was to the construction of the Pyramids.
95  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Romney: "Circumstances can change" on: August 27, 2014, 10:34:37 am
Can the establishment recognize that they have to let the non-establishment side have this one after having the ones since Reagan and spitting the bit (HW exempted because he actually was decent) on all of them.

Who would you suggest?
96  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: U.S. Weighs Direct Military Action Against ISIS in Syria on: August 27, 2014, 10:32:54 am
In hindsight, it may have been a mistake to disarm Assad because he could have used those chemical weapons against ISIS. That would have slowed the operational tempo of the battlefield, but it would have given the anti-terrorism forces a boost.

The hell?
97  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Government social program for low income families regarding automobiles on: August 27, 2014, 10:31:16 am
The money would be better invested in the development of affordable public transportation.
98  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Opinion of Irish abortion laws on: August 27, 2014, 10:30:34 am
You guys realise literally no-one thinks Irish abortion laws are "generally positive"? Even the pro-life lunatics dislike them.

My view is that they're a heck of a lot better than the laws in my barbarous nation. They may not be ideal, but they're a Western laws that significantly restrict abortion, and for that I am glad.

What would you prefer? I quite like them as is.
99  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Women in Combat on: August 27, 2014, 10:28:30 am
Yes, and like dead0man said they should be held to the same physical standards as men.
100  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Nine year old kills gun instructor with Uzi on: August 27, 2014, 10:25:13 am
There's no reason all but a handful of civilians should be so heavily armed; this isn't Somalia.
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