Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
July 28, 2015, 12:52:49 am
HomePredMockPollEVCalcAFEWIKIHelpLogin Register
News: Atlas Hardware Upgrade complete October 13, 2013.

  Show Posts
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 262
1  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Gubernatorial/Statewide Elections / Re: Kentucky 2003 on: July 27, 2015, 11:55:17 pm
It's so weird when these time capsule threads get brought back from the dead.
2  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Palestinian right of return on: July 27, 2015, 09:45:55 pm
Do Israeli citizens from Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon, Jordan, S.Arabia, Iran, Libya, Tunisia..(you get the idea) get "monetary compensation" in this scheme of yours?


(and does your lists refer to all their descendants too?  I assume so, cause "special", if so, add that to the question too)

Well, they have citizenship and have not been living in refugee camps for the time being. Their situation is very different. A Jew who was expelled from an Arab country or left voluntarily and moved to Israel did not face anywhere near the loss of economic and social capital that a Palestinian who was expelled from Israel [or left voluntarily, you seem to have missed part here] to a neighboring country has faced.
Indeed, and it seems like nobody involved has learned a damn thing from this situation.  Do you think Jordan, Lebanon, etc would be better off today had they had been as accepting as Israel?  Would the refugees be better off?

(and I'm going to need a cite that the average Palestinian lost more "economic and social capital" when forced to flee than the average Jew that was forced to flee, that seems dubious)

I'm not sure why you think Jordan or Lebanon are under any obligation to accept Palestinian refugees unconditionally. Israel wanted to get as many Mizrahi Jews into the country as possible to tilt the demographic scales in their favor. The Mizrahi Jews, in return, got citizenship and a crash course in living in a developed country. Conversely, having a bunch of Palestinians suddenly move in didn't really fit with Jordan or Lebanon's long-term goals. Do you think if Hungary invaded Austria, Germany should simply let all the Austrians come live in Germany since they're all German-speaking? That's the kind of flawed logic you're using here. You think it's perfectly reasonable for a Syrian Jew to throw a Palestinian Muslim out of their house and for the Palestinian Muslim to simply shrug and go live in Syria. The Syrian Jew has no inherent business living in Israel and the Palestinian Muslim has no inherent business living in Syria.
3  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Gilmore to announce candidacy "later this week" on: July 27, 2015, 01:18:26 pm
Last call, folks. There's still time to get into the consolation prize debate.

Sarah Palin? Bob Ehrlich? John Bolton? Anybody? Mitt, sure you don't want one more shot? What about Louie Gohmert, you only live once.
4  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: George W. endorsing brother Jeb: would it help Jeb or hurt him? on: July 26, 2015, 11:50:47 pm
None of the blue avatars are willing to explain why more jobs were created under eight years of Bill Clinton than under eight years of George W. Bush. Or why Obama surpassed Bush's job creation record barely halfway through his time in office.

To say nothing of the fact that a higher percentage of Americans lacked health insurance when Bush left office than they did when he took office.

dudeabides, Saddam sent weapons into Syria to hide them? You really are even stupider than your avatar would automatically suggest. Syria and Iraq hated each other for decades. Syria participated in the coalition that attacked Saddam during the Gulf War. Syria backed Iran during the Iran-Iraq War. You think Saddam would let the Assads keep his weapons safe for him? You are just retarded. You are an idiot, pure and simple. People like you are the reason Fox News stays on the air when half the stuff their commentators say can be disproven in five minutes on Wikipedia.
5  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Jihadist states on: July 26, 2015, 09:41:05 pm
Qaddafi, Saddam and the Assads were all members of the Non-Aligned Bloc during the late 20th century - they refused to ally with the West or the Soviet Union and instead played both sides to get money and weapons. They rarely kept their word to either side.

Saudi Arabia and the Gulf States didn't have this option. The backward, religious, monarchical nature of their countries meant a Soviet alliance would never be in the cards, so they had to plant themselves unconditionally in the American camp.
6  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Mike Huckabee: Obama Marching Israelis "To the Door of the Oven" on: July 26, 2015, 08:41:39 pm
The irony is that Iran and Israel have a common enemy -- ISIS.

Netanyahu believes Iran is the equivalent of ISIS.

I used to think Likud's whole "There's no difference between ISIS and Iran and Hamas! Muh monolithic Islam!" schpiel was just a ruse to get AIPAC and the Christian Right all riled up. But given Netanyahu's behavior, I think he really does believe his own BS.

Israel needs a Nixonian figure to come to power who is smart enough to realize that the various parties that hate Israel also hate each other and could be played against each other to Israel's benefit. They did a pretty decent job of this in Lebanon in the late 20th century, but eventually lost their influence there.
7  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Role of the Western world in the refugee crisis i on: July 26, 2015, 03:02:18 pm
1) Should the Western world try to stop countries from falling apart (we have not been very good at it, but what is the alternative? More failed states means ever more refugees).

I do not see how this is actually possible in practice. You cannot make a first-world nation out of third-world human capital.

Quote
2) Should it be possible to seek asylum in rich countrues by arriving there? Or should application for asylum in the West be handled by the UN in refugee camps in the areas bordering conflict zones?

As it is now we reward traffickers and it becomes a matter of money where you get in - not need. Generally mentally and (severely) psychically ill, disabled, severe torture victims  lone women, children,gays/queers should have preference.

They should only be allowed asylum in rich countries if they would otherwise qualify for permanent residency. If they do not qualify, refugees can take asylum in overseas territories (e.g. St. Helena, Reunion, Diego Garcia, ...)


You want them to be treated the same way as Napoleon?
8  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Palestinian right of return on: July 26, 2015, 03:00:48 pm
Do Israeli citizens from Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon, Jordan, S.Arabia, Iran, Libya, Tunisia..(you get the idea) get "monetary compensation" in this scheme of yours?


(and does your lists refer to all their descendants too?  I assume so, cause "special", if so, add that to the question too)

Well, they have citizenship and have not been living in refugee camps for the time being. Their situation is very different. A Jew who was expelled from an Arab country or left voluntarily and moved to Israel did not face anywhere near the loss of economic and social capital that a Palestinian who was expelled from Israel to a neighboring country has faced.
9  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Mike Huckabee: Obama Marching Israelis "To the Door of the Oven" on: July 26, 2015, 02:45:46 pm
Somehow, I don't see his numbers going down. It plays well with the narrative that Obama is actually a Muslim Nazi. It's a pity that people continue to believe that though.

I don't blame Huckabee for this. He's just been fed on a steady diet of the Evangelical Revisionist History that Muslims and the Third Reich were in cahoots with each other, despite the fact that in reality Hitler just viewed them as subhuman Asiatic brown people but wanted to exploit their dislike of British/French occupation.
10  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Lame duck period on: July 26, 2015, 01:13:13 am
It should be 1-2 weeks. That's more than enough to pack your stuff and get out.

Of course that entails adopting first-world vote counting procedures.

How would you handle overseas ballots that can be mailed up to election day?

How would you handle provisional ballots that have to be checked against voter lists by the same people who are certifying the vote totals from regular ballots? There's actually a lot of required cross-checking of precinct data before a count is certified.

That's why it's unrealistic to do it in less than 3-4 weeks.

How does every other country in the developed word manage to count all its votes within 24 hours with virtually no errors? Well, do as they do.

Muh voter fraud. Muh local control. Muh barebones election budget. Muh gubmnit bureaucrats havin' too much of muh information.
11  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Lame duck period on: July 26, 2015, 01:00:11 am
It should be 1-2 weeks. That's more than enough to pack your stuff and get out.

Of course that entails adopting first-world vote counting procedures.

How would you handle overseas ballots that can be mailed up to election day?

How would you handle provisional ballots that have to be checked against voter lists by the same people who are certifying the vote totals from regular ballots? There's actually a lot of required cross-checking of precinct data before a count is certified.

That's why it's unrealistic to do it in less than 3-4 weeks.

If we outsourced our voting operations to Google or Amazon, all of our votes could be counted in well under 3-4 weeks. All the archaic paper-based systems and the redundancies they entail would be out the window. I'm not saying doing so would be a good idea. I'm just saying that we're perfectly capable, from a technological standpoint, of having every American anywhere in the world vote and having their votes tabulated in a fraction of the time it takes today.
12  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of Jonathan Pollard? on: July 26, 2015, 12:56:11 am
Also, considering that the U.S. spies on allies consistently, I think that it's hypocritical to completely play the victim card. In 1987, I believe a year after Pollard was arrested, Israel arrested an American spy in Haifa.

Spying isn't the problem; it's just a fact of foreign relations. But spying on your own country for another country is an extremely shameful thing to do. The fact that he was doing it for financial gain just makes him an even more disgusting person.
13  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Presidential Election Trends / Re: 2016: Clinton v. Bush v. Sanders v. Trump on: July 26, 2015, 12:30:15 am
Assume Sanders and Trump both run successful insurgency candidacies, but fall just short at the convention. Perhaps Hillary relies on super-delegates to overturn a delegate count favorable to Sanders. For whatever reason, both Sanders and Trump decide to launch independent candidacies. They manage to get on the ballot in all 50 states. What does this election look like?

I would expect Hillary and Sanders to split the black vote about 60-40, and the Hispanic vote to be split about in thirds by them and Jeb. Sanders to max out the liberal activist base, Trump to max out the low-information/poor white voter. Hillary and Jeb vying for the remaining whites. Draw a map with this scenario.

Here's my map, for fun.



214 Hillary
209 Bush
58 Sanders
57 Trump

I don't know why you would give TN/KY/WV/SC to Trump: the South is extremely inhospitable to third party candidates in general - Perot, Anderson, Nader, etc. (Wallace's "I'm a Democrat but I hate black people as much as you do" candidacy doesn't really count.) He would probably overperform in places like Montana and Alaska, though.

I don't know why all of you think RI would vote for Sanders over Hillary.

Yeah, Rhode Island is the sort of place that would vote for Dick Cheney for president if he were the Democratic candidate.
14  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Party for Socialism and Liberation nominates La Riva and Puryear on: July 26, 2015, 12:23:18 am
I read an article a while back that I can't seem to find atm that said that many socialists thought Bernie was too conservative for them and he panders to the Democrats too much.
Probably the same crowd that thinks Palestine is more important than Social Security and Medicare

Is that really any less irrational than Republicans who think Israel is more important than tax reform or protecting the Second Amendment?

As for the comments about socialist/Leftist parties in the US, part of the reason socialists never gained a sustainable following in the US was precisely because the American socialists were so much more radical than those in Europe. A lot of the European socialists who opposed building coalitions with "bourgeois" reform movements emigrated to the US. Combine that with the fact that American industrialists were often even more hostile to socialist activism than conservative European aristocrats were (hiring private security guards to gun down striking workers, for example) and you ended up with an American socialist movement that was very violent, anarchist and confrontational in nature.
15  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Could 2016 be a 1992 Repeat? on: July 25, 2015, 10:25:03 pm
Trump won't perform anywhere near as well as Perot did, but from Clinton's vantage point, that isn't as big of a deal since Trump basically gets all of his support from people who would otherwise vote Republican, whereas Perot did "steal" some votes from the Democrats.
16  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / Gubernatorial/Statewide Elections / Re: Democrat Gubernatorial Election Trends on: July 25, 2015, 09:26:27 pm
Arizona. It's only been since 2006 that they've elected a Democratic governor. Utah hasn't since 1976 IIRC, and I'm not even sure Idaho has ever had a Democratic governor tbh.

Idaho elected one in 1990. And they had Democratic governors for most of the late 20th century.
17  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Lame duck period on: July 25, 2015, 03:37:25 pm
A lot of it is when our elections are.

Move the inauguration up any more and you're up against Christmas/New Year.

It would be a bad idea to try to coordinate all that stuff when so many people are traveling or otherwise not at work. (Even more so for government offices that have sane holiday policies.)
18  General Politics / Political Debate / Re: Palestinian right of return on: July 25, 2015, 03:32:17 pm
Palestinians from present-day Israel who currently reside in the West Bank or Gaza: will continue to reside in the West Bank/Gaza

Palestinians from present-day Israel who currently reside in Jordan: will continue to reside there and be granted Jordanian citizenship; Israel will pay the Jordanian government an indemnity to compensate them for this transfer

Palestinians from present-day Israel who currently reside in Lebanon or Syria: return to Israel and receive Israeli citizenship; alternately can take a lump sum "buyout" from the Israeli government in return for assistance emigrating to a third country

Palestinians from present-day Israel who currently reside in Egypt: follow the Jordan method above

Palestinians from present-day Israel who currently reside elsewhere and do not have refugee status: monetary compensation

Israeli citizens residing in West Bank settlement blocs not adjacent to Jerusalem: option to take Palestinian citizenship or relocate to Israel
19  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Obama wants to renew the Export Import Bank on: July 24, 2015, 05:46:25 pm
The Export-Import Bank turns a profit.  How is something welfare if it actually makes money?

Because it's a subsidy in the sense that the big corporations get lower interest rates, then they would from a private lender. It only makes money if one ignores the time value of money, to wit that the Feds could earn interest on the money other loaned. And in an omega, economic collapse situation, that hits every 10-20 years or so, the scheme could lose a lot of money. Shorter term profits are not a good indicator of the long term financial return of this sort of program.

The corporations aren't getting the loans. Foreigners are getting loans to buy goods from the United States. Every other country does this.
20  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: Young TV host advocates for full out war during tirade on: July 24, 2015, 05:45:30 pm
And Iranians are going to show this video as evidence that America is full of "Death to Iran! Death to Islam!" fundies, which will do so much to improve our relations or make people any less susceptible to recruitment by Islamist groups...
21  General Politics / U.S. General Discussion / Re: US Preparing to Release Convicted Spy Jonathan Pollard on: July 24, 2015, 05:43:01 pm
He was eligible for parole. It's not like the White House or the Justice Department actively decided to let him out of jail.

In situations like this, I think the logical thing is to strip him of his citizenship and deport him to any country that will have him (presumably Israel). He was basically just a Fifth Columnist anyway. No sense keeping him around.
22  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: GOP donor calls for debate boycott if Trump included on: July 23, 2015, 11:52:19 pm
It's not just one donor
Quote
Many national Republican officials are increasingly resigned to Mr. Trump’s looming presence. At a meeting of the Republican Governors Association this week in Aspen, Colo., donors and operatives mused about how to prevent him from hijacking the debate.

One idea that came up was to urge three leading candidates — Jeb Bush, the former Florida governor; Mr. Walker; and Senator Marco Rubio of Florida — to band together and state that they would not participate in any debate in which Mr. Trump was present, using his refusal to rule out a third-party bid as a pretext for taking such a hard line. The thinking, according to a Republican involved in the conversations, was that the lesser-funded prospects who have been eclipsed by Mr. Trump would follow suit, and the TV networks airing the debates would be forced to bar Mr. Trump in order to have a full complement of candidates.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/23/us/politics/donald-trump-stealing-spotlight-with-caustic-comments-eclipses-his-rivals.html?ref=politics&_r=0

By that standard, Ron Paul should never have been let on a debate stage in 2008 or 2012. Hell, he wouldn't release his delegates or endorse the eventual nominee either time.
23  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: Jeb's Wife on: July 23, 2015, 11:47:36 pm
I would imagine that most of her accent is not a result of a lack of knowledge, but simply a lack of practice (living in Coral Gables and all). That's something that can be remedied.

Too late at this age, probably. It is, actually, pretty difficult to correct an accent once it sets - unless the person has particularly good musical abilities, which she, probably, does not. Might be partially doable with some acting training, but not worth the effort, really. And, in fact, it does seem quite likely that they speak a lot of Spanish at home. Probably, a lot more than I do in Mexico Smiley

Maybe Jeb needs to sequester her in their house for a weekend with a vocal coach and have them give her the Eliza Doolittle treatment.
24  Questions and Answers / The Atlas / Re: Atlas Forum Feedback on: July 23, 2015, 08:56:46 pm
Quote
I would like the forum software modernized
Use of likes/dislikes or upvotes/downvotes, as well as the ability to create subthreads (i.e. you can reply to a post and have your reply appear right below it rather than quoting someone to reply to their post 10 pages away), are my two main suggestions.

Quote
The points system is doing more harm than good.
        
I really don't see what the "point" is.

Quote
Moderation is too strict
Strict and arbitrary. Some animals are more equal than others around here.

Furthermore, accept the fact that an Internet forum about politics is going to primarily attract an 18-35 year old male demographic. You're going to have profanity. You're going to have sexual innuendo. If you can't handle that, go collect stock photos of cupcakes and vintage furniture on Pinterest or something.

Quote
Moderation stifles debate with censorship
There should be no value judgments regarding content. Someone might have political views that are totally illogical or irritating to you, but that doesn't make them "trolling."
25  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion / 2016 U.S. Presidential Election / Re: GOP donor calls for debate boycott if Trump included on: July 23, 2015, 07:33:42 pm
All that is doing is playing right into Trump's hands and, if anything, pushing him toward an independent bid.

He can say, "See what those Republican elites do? When the common folks have the audacity to support someone they don't approve of, they shut down the debate altogether!"
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 262


Login with username, password and session length

Logout

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines