Should the US and Candadian dollars be fixed to each other? (user search)
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  Should the US and Candadian dollars be fixed to each other? (search mode)
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Poll
Question: Well?
#1
Yes
 
#2
No
 
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Partisan results

Total Voters: 16

Author Topic: Should the US and Candadian dollars be fixed to each other?  (Read 1938 times)
DanielX
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,126
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -4.70

« on: September 21, 2007, 04:26:57 PM »

No, because neither the United States nor Canada issues very many genuine dollars anymore.

A true dollar is a coin massing roughly 20-30 grams, and is made primarily of silver - or its equivalent value in another material, such as gold, or a certificate guaranteeing exactly that amount of silver. Early examples include the "Spanish dollar" (actually 8 Reales - the famed "Pieces of Eight" - later known as a Peso), Thalers produced by various German states, and the Dutch Daalder. The United States, between the 1790s and 1930s, also produced Dollars - I have one, and I'm sure some of you have one or a few. Canada also produced them, although mostly they didn't go above 50-cent coins until the age of fiat currency.

Now, the US and Canada issue mostly so-called "dollar" coins - the Canadian "loonie" is made of nickel plated with copper-tin bronze, the US dollar coin is copper alloyed to manganese, nickel, and zinc - and the coins are considerably smaller than in a true dollar. And while it is perfectly alright to issue paper reserve notes, which the US does for dollars, they're fiat money - which means that any government instability can render them worthless.

Only their commemoratives fit the definition of genuine dollars - and given the ridiculous amount of inflation over the years, there is the amusing fact that a dollar's worth of silver is now about $15 US.

Another thing: the Dollar is roughly equivalent to the original Peso, Thaler, Daalder (that's Dutch - 1.5 true Guilders), or British Crown (5 shillings, 1/4 of a Sovereign - the true Pound) or about 5 Francs.
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DanielX
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,126
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -4.70

« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2007, 05:52:07 PM »

Amero. Economic nationalism is 20th-century.

1 Amero = 1/100th oz. of gold, perhaps? Wink
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DanielX
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,126
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -4.70

« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2007, 09:47:22 PM »

Amero. Economic nationalism is 20th-century.

1 Amero = 1/100th oz. of gold, perhaps? Wink

If you want to be buying things in hundredths of Amero-pennies, sure. There's not enough gold to sustain a gold-based currency in the long term.

Gold is, at present, about $700 per ounce. Consider that, until the early 1930s, the Mint issued 1-ounce Double Eagles, 90% gold coins worth $20 (traditionally US coins, except the penny and nickel, were either 90% silver/10% copper or 90% gold/10% copper). While the value of gold has gone up since then - gold's value has more than doubled in comparison to silver, for example - the value of the US dollar has plummeted to less than a tenth of its former value. Things are even worse with other currencies - a century ago, a British pound was at about $4, and a farthing (1/960th of a pre-decimal pound) of the era was worth more than a decimal penny is now.

a century ago, no coin smaller than the 1-cent/penny existed in the US. The dime, quarter, half dollar, and dollar were silver (the dollar was still a genuine dollar coin); there were gold $2.50, $5, $10, and $20 pieces (the quarter eagle, half eagle, eagle, and double eagle). A hot dog from Nathans, when it first opened in 1912, was a nickel. A bare-bones Model T Ford, in the 1920s, could be had for as little as $290 new.

1/100th of an ounce of gold is roughly $7 US. Its unlikely that you'll need any coin smaller than a mill (that's a tenth of a cent) anytime soon; heck the smallest coin will probably be a half-cent. 

An alternative is 1/5th of an ounce of silver (1 oz silver is at roughly $15, so that's about $3), but silver prices are much more volatile than gold prices. Its possible that a mixed-specie standard might be best - but that gets complicated.
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DanielX
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,126
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -4.70

« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2007, 10:18:56 PM »

Amero. Economic nationalism is 20th-century.

1 Amero = 1/100th oz. of gold, perhaps? Wink

If you want to be buying things in hundredths of Amero-pennies, sure. There's not enough gold to sustain a gold-based currency in the long term.

Gold is, at present, about $700 per ounce. Consider that, until the early 1930s, the Mint issued 1-ounce Double Eagles, 90% gold coins worth $20 (traditionally US coins, except the penny and nickel, were either 90% silver/10% copper or 90% gold/10% copper). While the value of gold has gone up since then - gold's value has more than doubled in comparison to silver, for example - the value of the US dollar has plummeted to less than a tenth of its former value. Things are even worse with other currencies - a century ago, a British pound was at about $4, and a farthing (1/960th of a pre-decimal pound) of the era was worth more than a decimal penny is now.

a century ago, no coin smaller than the 1-cent/penny existed in the US. The dime, quarter, half dollar, and dollar were silver (the dollar was still a genuine dollar coin); there were gold $2.50, $5, $10, and $20 pieces (the quarter eagle, half eagle, eagle, and double eagle). A hot dog from Nathans, when it first opened in 1912, was a nickel. A bare-bones Model T Ford, in the 1920s, could be had for as little as $290 new.

1/100th of an ounce of gold is roughly $7 US. Its unlikely that you'll need any coin smaller than a mill (that's a tenth of a cent) anytime soon; heck the smallest coin will probably be a half-cent. 

An alternative is 1/5th of an ounce of silver (1 oz silver is at roughly $15, so that's about $3), but silver prices are much more volatile than gold prices. Its possible that a mixed-specie standard might be best - but that gets complicated.

The difficulty comes in printing currency. All currency printed must be backed by gold, which means that the amount of currency the US could print would be determined by how much gold we have stockpiled. We have a lot of gold stockpiled, to be certain, but not nearly enough to maintain anywhere close to as much money in circulation as there is now. A small supply of currency coupled with high demand means the value of currency (and gold) would rise uncontrollably, and within a few years we'd be paying for things in hundredths or thousandths of ameros (or dollars, if you like).

This is why I am considering a basket currency. Keeping silver and platinum in addition to gold should allow greater stability in currency value. Of course, it would be difficult to do this and have pretty gold/silver coins, which would have differing values...
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