Update XVII: I Ate The Strawberry (The REAL, AUTHENTIC Update)

[J-Mann]

I'm not going to debate my views on the end time.  I was just answering a question.  Anyway, I am just relaxing tonight trying to make sure I'm feeling better to go down to my parents tomorrow afternoon for the weekend and several family dinners.  I'll be back to Tulsa Sunday.  I'll have my laptop and I'll put the resume on the cloud so I can still job search during the days Thursday and Friday.  If by some chance I have an interview one of the two days, I'll come back up here in the morning and go back after the interview.  Then, I have a weekend vacation to see my uncle in Kansas City next weekend.  We'll leave Friday and come back Sunday.

I live in Kansas City. How about meeting for breakfasts, lunch or dinner (just one, not all three)?

Doubtful I could pull that off.  Ill be with my parents and it'd be just a quick trip.

We'll make it work. I'm flexible. It'll be good to have a little coaching session face-to-face. Don't worry about the cost of eating out ... it's on me.

[J-Mann]

I'm not going to debate my views on the end time.  I was just answering a question.  Anyway, I am just relaxing tonight trying to make sure I'm feeling better to go down to my parents tomorrow afternoon for the weekend and several family dinners.  I'll be back to Tulsa Sunday.  I'll have my laptop and I'll put the resume on the cloud so I can still job search during the days Thursday and Friday.  If by some chance I have an interview one of the two days, I'll come back up here in the morning and go back after the interview.  Then, I have a weekend vacation to see my uncle in Kansas City next weekend.  We'll leave Friday and come back Sunday.

I live in Kansas City. How about meeting for breakfasts, lunch or dinner (just one, not all three)?

Doubtful I could pull that off.  Ill be with my parents and it'd be just a quick trip.

32 years old and can't leave his parents sight for one meal with a friend. Unbelievable.

I'll pick you up, Jeff. Based on your typical updates, you won't have a totally action-packed, non-stop weekend planned. Name the time.

[J-Mann]

Fellas, you know the exchange will go nothing like that.  I'm not sure I want to do it as the purpose of the trip is spending time with my aunt and uncle.  Maybe one of these days I'll drive up there and share a meal with him.  I'm close enough to KC being in Tulsa that if I get time I can drive up there.

As far as the cooking, Mom and my Aunt both help Grandma, so really, it's a 3-person effort.  Either my uncle or I helps by putting the ice in the glasses and pouring the tea.  If there's any carving to do (like the turkey at Thanksgiving), Dad always does that with the electric knife.

I don't mean to criticize you for yet another thing, but let me take a look at your reasoning:

 - You'll be coming to Kansas City for, what you previously described, a weekend; let's just say it's a full, human-style day of 16 waking hours that you're here. I don't know what activities they may have planned, so I'm speaking somewhat out of turn, but based on many previous descriptions of family get-togethers, the activity is mostly sedentary ... a couple of dinners, maybe a few hours of talking, and ... what else is there?

 - You wouldn't -- and shouldn't -- ever drive from Tulsa to Kansas City solely to see a member of an internet forum. That's a four-hour drive one way and represents the total illogical thinking that you display when it comes to spending idle time in vehicles. You should maximize your time while you are in Kansas City rather than plan a return trip.

 - You saying "If I get time I can drive up there" did make me laugh out loud. Literally. So, thanks for that. If it was a joke, bravo. If it was a serious comment ... ugh.

 - I'd take a couple of hours of your time at most (or less or more, depending on you) -- we can get lunch, we can chat, and you can go back to your uncle's. If there's any thought whatsoever to simply sit idly while at his house, you'd be better served by taking me up on my offer.

 - You are turning down a free meal (although, to be fair, all of them at your uncle's house would be free, as well).

Memphis is probably right -- I've put enough time and effort into you that I think it'd be a lost investment to walk away now. So pick your restaurant now.

[J-Mann]

J-Mann, you should take Bushie to Oklahoma Joe's. Appropriate moniker plus pretty much the best place to eat in the KC Metro.

Oklahoma Joe's (or soon-to-be "Joe's Kansas City Barbecue") is the best in KC, and trust me, eating there DID cross my mind. I'll take any excuse to get a Hog-a-maniac platter.

On the other hand, I've spent so much time encouraging Jeff to eat better that I'd have a guilty conscience if we went there, and he and I both would take a beating on here for it!

[J-Mann]

Have you picked a restaurant yet?

[J-Mann]

Jeff, keep working hard where you're at. You had a rough performance review but have had a number of good days since then, as well. That's what performance reviews are for -- to tell you where you need improvement and to help you get better.

If Jeff was truly as dispensable as everyone is claiming and his boss was really that over him, they'd let him go now. It's a really small company. Even without factoring in a burden rate, equipment costs, management time or potential turnover costs, Jeff will be a $12,960.00 investment for this company over the next 27 business days. Why would they throw that away if he's as useless and doomed as you all assume?

Plus, it doesn't seem like this place has it's sht together at all. When they moved offices, no one had ensured the phone system would be transferred at the same time, meaning Jeff's boss needed to hang back at the old office to answer phones. I wouldn't be surprised if his offer of a week off for a funeral was due to either a) a small, familial atmosphere, or b) a relief in his boss's own management duties -- and I don't mean that because Jeff is a bother, I mean because this guy probably can't manage his way out of a paper bag, and any employee causes him stress.

I can't predict the future, but their continued investment in Jeff would be foolish if he's truly doomed. Don't be blind to the atmosphere around you, Jeff, but don't get distracted from continuing to grow and learn, too. They seem to want to continue investing in you for the time being.

Thank you J-Mann, for calming down our chaotic barnyard of Chicken Littles.  IMO, CADD job lives! 

Lies.

Maybe his boss reads Update and realized the cost of keeping him on through the full 90 days?

[J-Mann]

I'm trying to decide what I want to do this evening.  Do I want to watch an ALDS doubleheader from 1630-2300 or do I want to watch a college football doubleheader from 1800-0100 or do i want to watch the Vikings vs. Packers from 1925-2230?  What would you choose?

I hope between all the napping and football-watching, you do take some time to do interview prep!

[J-Mann]

Grumps, when you're sick, rest is your best friend.  Don't knock me for the naps.  Not today.

Tell me about it, I have severe bronchitis right now.  I think I'll leave work at 4PM and make it a shorter day.

I didn't go into the office today because I had a fever this morning. On the other hand, I just finished an hour-and-a-half Skype interview with a sales candidate and will work off-and-on all day. The achiness sucks, though, and I looked like sh[inks] via Skype.

[J-Mann]

So, you've chosen not to get a job tomorrow. Great.

When did I ever say that or imply that?

How much interview prep have you done today?

[J-Mann]

J-Mann,

Have you been able to check out the website?

I did look it over. There's nothing concerning about the company itself, and they do indeed have a position that they call "Entry Level AutoCAD Drafter." I think some key questions to ask during the interview should be around on-the-job training and mentoring, given the last experience with a CADD position.

The company seems well-put-together enough that I really doubt you'll be in a position to hide, clock-watch, etc. And, I hope you really did learn from the last experience: there are training materials available all over the place online, and you'll need to access those and actually embrace them if you plan to make this a true career.

[J-Mann]

J-Mann, what do you make of when they say "immediate positions available"?

That they have open positions and are trying to fill them. I wouldn't interpret that as walking out tomorrow with an offer.

[J-Mann]

Damnit, I'm starting to read all his posts in Droopy's voice again.

[J-Mann]

I don't believe that the "official checklist" is used religiously, given some of the people that I've seen on it. The fifth question alone should disqualify anyone, given that homes for people with mental disabilities often put their residents to work doing something.

If you consider that the criteria are probably not applied too harshly, you may well meet the conditions, Jeff:

1. You are not currently performing a substantial gainful activity.

2. Your impairment is severe -- you have constant headaches, suffer from body tics that increase under stress, constant illness exacerbated by excessive weight and an inability to keep it under control, and (according to your latest medications list) arthritic and suffering from blood-pressure issues.

3. I don't know the answer to this one, but my guess is "yes."

4. You've been let go from every position youve held over the last four years; the reasoning can be traced to your myriad health problems, among other deficiencies.

5. This is questionable. Even the lowest on the totem pole need to follow basic direction, learn from mistakes and show up to work.

I don't think it's a lock that your be denied by question two.

[J-Mann]

We'll see who is right.

I'm not going to argue your point, but I'm just going to get out there and do my work and let my performance do the talking!

You've never failed in either of these respects before. I see no reason to be concerned.

(Sorry, my rant broke the Update. Just imagine angry muttering in my head.)

[J-Mann]

Hooray for leaving the ridiculously stretched page behind!

Yeah, sorry about that whole thing. My brain just sort of stroked off and I couldn't stop typing. I'll happily accept whatever the hell an "infraction point" is.

---

As for the job -- I have posed a number of questions to Jeff and find it completely unnecessary to accept a position which is essentially customer service wherein he'll have to learn entirely new skills when he possesses the beginnings of CADD knowledge and enough other basic skills to land a position that won't require yet another "challenge."

If it's the type of organization that I suspect it is, they likely would hire him, because they look for bodies, not talent and capabilities. Having a pulse gets you hired ... not retained.

[J-Mann]

My old man told me this evening not to ever go back to customer service!!

He obviously doesn't know what he's talking about. What a negative he is!

[J-Mann]

Here is why I rarely listen to the forum.  Most of the forum thinks I can't do anything, or can't do anything significant.  Friends don't think their friends can't do anything.  That's where most of the forum utterly fail.  They never give me a chance and try to discourage me from EVERY friggin job I come across.  Shut up, will ya.

Here's what I don't get ... some of us, you PM specifically for advice, yet when it's not what you want to hear, you simply ignore it. There's no additional questioning, no attempt at reasonable discussion ... just blatant disregard for the very direction that you asked for.

Whether you like it or not, Jeff, I'm basing my feedback to you off of both my own experiences (which have been quite successful) and yours (which have not). I don't think you can't do anything; I think you're ill-suited for SOME things, and try to give you appropriate direction to that end. Those "friends" who blindly encourage you no matter what are, in actuality, worse than those who may try to have serious conversations with you about what's right for you.

The job description makes very clear that the position for which you're applying now is customer service. Not only that, it's technical customer service with lots of new stuff to learn. You think we should all cheer because you have a can-do attitude? We've seen this episode before, Jeff -- a dozen times. Even your father is saying stay away from customer service. I don't understand why you're insistent on taking the first thing that comes along (which will almost always be customer service positions looking for warm bodies) and desperately trying to prove yourself qualified in areas where your own experience has proven otherwise again and again and again.

Some of us are willing to give you thoughtful and heartfelt direction, but it may not always be what you want to hear. And asking my advice and then telling me to shut up when I share it is the absolute height of disrespect. Always wanting respect, never giving ... your hypocrisy is incredible.

[J-Mann]

We shall see won't we, Franzl!!

You asked me to spend my time and effort to look at an opportunity, you blatantly disregard my input and don't even acknowledge it. Offensive. Promise me when this position falls flat, I can personally come down to whatever new city you've temporarily moved to and beat you with a sock full of batteries.

[J-Mann]

I'm excited for this new challenge.  Despite it's flaws and warning messages, I feel hopeful that I'll get an offer tomorrow.  If and when I pass this A+ certification, I will have a long term, open-ended contract at my disposal.  This may be a temporary job, but I have the power to make this a one year, two year job.  It would springboard me into a bigger IT career.  This is part customer service, but mostly IT.  I'm good at IT.  Despite your concerns I'm excited. In fact, your concerns make me even more sure this is a good path to go down at this time.

Jeff, what is wrong with you?

If you were some Richard Branson / Elon Musk-type who had repeatedly proven the world wrong with new inventions and investments that flew in the face of reason, this statement would make sense.

As is, you're an unemployed, morbidly obese 32-year-old man with the "smart cookiness" of a kindergartner and repeated failures in relationships, in employment, in decision-making and in life. Other than blatant, sinful, shallow and blind pride, what makes you think doing the opposite of what we tell you is the right thing to do?

I don't give you advice or opinions, Jeff. I give you experience. And it is baffling why you refuse to learn from that of others and that of yourself.

[J-Mann]

Here is what I just shared with J-Mann about why I keep going back to customer service.  Any friendly advice would be helpful.

I have had a little success in the call centers, especially technical support call centers.  I was at Dell for an entire year with no problem and was only let go because I couldn't pass the Security+ Certification.  I was also at ONG for 2 years with no problem and that was customer service all the way, though not all call center.  I don't really want call centers, and I want CAD jobs, but those are hard to come by and I need a job.  So, I feel I have to open myself up to jobs that are less than pleasant.  I don't want to stay on my parent's financial ledger, and a lot of times I choose desperation over preferred.  I know there are other jobs out there, but I don't know what to look for.

This, by the way, is a much more real response than the "I'll show all of you!" junk that we normally get. It's more open and honest and, I believe, portrays the real desperation that comes with Jeff's history. I feel better about helping someone who's hit this point and admits it than someone who puts on rose-colored glasses.

[J-Mann]

Bushie, you should become a bank teller. I did that for awhile. I didn't have experience to land it, though I did have "money handling" experience as a grocery store cashier that apparently helped.

Also, check into non-teaching education jobs.  I worked for the registrar office at a university for a bit. It was good easy data entry work.

Rather than stabbing blindly on job sites that might be filled with scams, I suggest making a list of nearby businesses and going directly to all of their own career sites.  Find a company you'd like to say you work for and find the easy looking job available.

Man... why do I keep getting duped into giving you advice?

Don't worry, I'm not going to bite your head off tonight.  My spirit is much too broken tonight to lash out.

I would love a bank teller position.  I have thought about that several times, but get discouraged by the cash-handling experience and the very low pay.

I was going to go to the Tulsa Public Schools job fair back in early August, but never did because of the CAD job.  I wish I had now.

I'm usually pretty careful about weeding out the scams on those sites.  My problem is I have too little faith that I will even get a nod if I don't put in through a recruiter or a job search engine.

Jeff -- while I'm saddened to read that your spirit is broken, that admission goes a long way toward getting on a better track in the job search. I think the Update readers will have a lot more patience and respect for you if you accept the reality of your situation and hear us out legitimately on some suggestions. It'll be a more-fruitful path than tumbling head-on into another counterintuitive challenge, no matter how optimistic of a picture you may want to portray.

You had previously been open to some accounting / processing-type positions ... not where you'd necessarily be in charge of a payroll, or something like that, but be looking out for details lining up, ie: does PO A match invoice B, etc. I think there may be those types of positions available that could, at least for a while, provide you with more stability and less pressure than you're feeling in other positions. The bank teller idea isn't too bad, either.

[J-Mann]

I haven't spent much time looking through here, but have you considered government work? There are plenty of back-office type jobs to be had there:

http://jobs.ok.gov/OK/

[J-Mann]

Bushie likes to change the narrative to whatever is going to work best/sound nicest for the situation. 

Are we lambasting him for throwing away a steady job to chase a scam?  It's okay, guys.  I was on my last legs at ONG, anyway, and Dad said yadda yadda yadda

Now we are confronting him about looking into customer service AGAIN after he swore it off not one week ago?  It's okay, guys.  I was a model customer service representative at ONG for TWO years, and all I have to do is believe in yadda yadda God blah blah Dad. 

It's classic Update material. 

(I'm sorry for being more caustic than normal with you, Jeff, but you really need a reality check right now.  Take a spa day and have some herbal tea and reflect.  I'm serious.)

Actually, this isn't a bad idea, Jeff. Would you be open to finding some outside activity ... day spa, massage, sporting event, something relaxing ... that you'd enjoy and would get your mind off of things?

[J-Mann]

A trip to a day spa, J-Mann? Paid for by whom?

That was my question, too.  I appreciate the thought, but I don't have the money to spend on a day spa and do it right.

Honestly, I would have paid. Here's my read on where Jeff is at:

He's exceptionally depressed -- moreso than the hints we've seen here and there over the past day, and due to much more than just the events of the last few weeks. The weight of years' worth of poor decisions or missed opportunities would weigh heavily on one's mind.

When Jeff said that his spirit was broken, it was an admission of sorts that he didn't have all the answers (despite his supposed and baffling confidence) and that there was a lot of truth in how we were defining his experiences. But I took no joy in that admission. It's sad to see someone broken, even if that admission is the first step toward being more honest about the future.

I lost a job in April of this year, and it was devestating in a lot of ways. I knew what I had to do to get back on my feet, but that didn't stop the reality of being unexpectedly unemployed any less raw and painful. I took a day for myself, whether I deserved it or not. It helped. The next day, I got to "work," and three-and-a-half weeks later, I was starting my new job.

So the suggestion was rooted in a possible need for Jeff to disconnect from the reaility of his situation (and yeah, I get it ... he's seemingly disconnected enough from reality as it is, but you know what I mean). I suspect he's more bothered by his situation than he ever lets on, and as much as he probably should simply follow some of the expertise shared with him here, there's something to be said for briefly stepping away from a situation to breathe, refocus and begin anew.

[J-Mann]

J-Mann, I am beginning to question your judgement here.

How hard does a person have to break to satisfy you? Profuse apologies in public? An eating disorder? Suicide?

All I'm saying is that his admission of how serious his problems are is a first step toward reality, and if someone's problems weigh on them to the point of emotional breakdown, stepping away to get a clearer head can help.

Jeff's financial and social situations are so dire that, as of this morning, he couldn't even do that. Since that time, he's won a trip to Albuquerque, which he'll probably enjoy much more than a spa trip, anyway.