Austrian Elections & Politics 2.0 (Presidential runoff re-vote: 4 Dec. 2016)

[Omega21]

Who will young Austrian voters (aged 16-29) vote for on Sunday ?

500 young Austrians were polled in the first half of April by the Austrian Institute of Youth Culture Research:

42% Van der Bellen (Greens)
20% Hofer (FPÖ)
12% Griss (Indy)
11% Hundstorfer (SPÖ)
10% Khol (ÖVP)
  4% Lugner (Indy)

http://www.profil.at/oesterreich/analyse-junge-maenner-wahl-bundespraesident-6322799

Shocked by this, sad that such a nice Culture is being exterminated by it's youth, as I think 60% of  these Vdb voters are one of those "FPO Raus, Fluchtlinge willkommen" type of people or in other words "Yeah we can do 100 k Refugees a year, 900 Euro a month/each."



Can't wait fot the elections, in your opinion is the final 6 candidate Debate going to have some influence on the elections?

[Omega21]

Alright, my (probably crappy) prediction for Sunday:

Chainsmoker - 23%
Smiling Nazi - 23%
Wallflower - 21%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 12%
Clown - 5%

Run-off predictions come only when it's clear who will be in it.

Smiling Nazi - 24%
Anti Democrat - 22%[/b]
Wallflower - 19%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 15%
Clown - 4%

[Omega21]

Alright, my (probably crappy) prediction for Sunday:

Chainsmoker - 23%
Smiling Nazi - 23%
Wallflower - 21%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 12%
Clown - 5%

Run-off predictions come only when it's clear who will be in it.

Smiling Nazi - 24%
Great guy I'd definitely vote for!  - 22%
Wallflower - 19%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 15%
Clown - 4%

If you are going to empty-quote me, try to do it a little less passive-aggressive next time, dankeschön.

Just do as most people, ignore Bigot21.

Is not swearing in a majority goverment because of a personal grudge towards a party not anti democratic?

[Omega21]

Alright, my (probably crappy) prediction for Sunday:

Chainsmoker - 23%
Smiling Nazi - 23%
Wallflower - 21%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 12%
Clown - 5%

Run-off predictions come only when it's clear who will be in it.

Smiling Nazi - 24%
Great guy I'd definitely vote for!  - 22%
Wallflower - 19%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 15%
Clown - 4%

If you are going to empty-quote me, try to do it a little less passive-aggressive next time, dankeschön.

Just do as most people, ignore Bigot21.

Is not swearing in a majority goverment because of a personal grudge towards a party not anti democratic?

If he was elected by being honest about that, no.

Then you are not democratic, the president must accept the decision of the people, the majority must rule, no matter how much he hates the Fpo and how much he wants an Eu superstate..

[Omega21]

Alright, my (probably crappy) prediction for Sunday:

Chainsmoker - 23%
Smiling Nazi - 23%
Wallflower - 21%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 12%
Clown - 5%

Run-off predictions come only when it's clear who will be in it.

Smiling Nazi - 24%
Great guy I'd definitely vote for!  - 22%
Wallflower - 19%
Comrade pin-stripe - 16%
Nazi-Enabler - 15%
Clown - 4%

If you are going to empty-quote me, try to do it a little less passive-aggressive next time, dankeschön.

Just do as most people, ignore Bigot21.

Is not swearing in a majority goverment because of a personal grudge towards a party not anti democratic?

A) The FPÖ is never getting elected to a majority government of their own. Not going to happen, honey, so no point in discussing a hypothetical with a .0% chance of happening.
B) If the FPÖ in '18 ends up with, say, 35% and they wanted to form government, there would still be 75% of the population NOT voting for those literal Nazis. In contrast, Van der Bellen would, in the eventually of being elected president, have an absolute majority of 50% of the population behind him.

So maybe next time, if you have no clue about stuff, shut the f up.

You are a big smartass considering you dont knoe how to subtract two numbers, 100-35=65 my boy..

Also if Ovp got 25,Fpo 35% that means 60% of Voters support that goverment, Vdb could get 55 but not above 60, so he would be going against the 60% of Voters that support that Goverment.

[Omega21]

Looks like Austria is becoming Poland 2.0

First a right-wing President, then a right-wing government ...

Wouldnt have happened if the goverment didnt let 90 k people just enter and stay, it just isnt sustainable..

I saw sam talk on Oe24 that if Hofer is above 35 that could really shake up the goverment, in what sense?

[Omega21]

Saying that 44% of your town is stupid is very rude, why dont you stop every person in your town and tell him he is stupid..

[Omega21]

How likely is it that Hofer wins the 2nd round?

[Omega21]

Why is the left more extreme than the right? At least the youth..

[Omega21]

Why is the left more extreme than the right? At least the youth..

How are you defining "extreme"?

Mass protests with signs saying "FPO/Nazis Raus", also a lot of times there is also violence between the Right/Left Wing groups..

Why are they calling out the Right if they themselves are violent..

Ofcourse this is the minority but Offensive against the Right seems to me a bit odd, as they can't be the one to decide that Left is better than Right, only the voters can do that, and they mostly did in this Election.

Also in Sweden there are now a lot of problems with the Extreme Left, you can just google it..

[Omega21]

Quick question Tender, who are you (or did already, iirc you said you'd too vote via Wahlkarte) going to vote for? My intentions should be clear to you, I guess, but I'm interested in yours.

He said he would vote for Vdb even if he doesnt like him that much... He said so a few pages back

[Omega21]

Quick question Tender, who are you (or did already, iirc you said you'd too vote via Wahlkarte) going to vote for? My intentions should be clear to you, I guess, but I'm interested in yours.

I posted this a few pages before:

I cannot bring myself to ever vote for an FPÖ candidate, sry.

But VdB is like ... meh.

But I hold my nose and still vote VdB in the runoff.

Most in my family will vote for Hofer though.

Also, I will vote by postal ballot again because my little niece has first communion on that Sunday, which means going to church early on, then dinner and then coffee-talk in the afternoon.

So, no time really to vote at my precinct

PS: I now think Hofer will win in a landslide (something like 56-44). My family and friends are usually a good indicator of what's going to happen and there are a lot of FPÖ-voters among them and they seem extremely motivated to go out and vote this time ...

Also the huge migrant crime wave in Vienna and other Urban communities will help probablly, today a Kenyan asylum seeker stabbed and killed a 50 year old Woman in public, without any clear motive.

http://m.oe24.at/oesterreich/chronik/Frau-mit-Eisenstange-getoetet-Festnahme/234320284

Plus Praterstern has 7 crimes a day, and most of the problems there are with African/Arab men raping and commiting violence in general.


In your opinion how much do these thinga reflect on the election?

[Omega21]

There has been a constant stream of brutal (sex) attacks by Arab/African immigrants recently, most of them from impoverished wastelands like AfPak, Chechnya, Iraq and African countries - but hardly any Syrians though.

Just yesterday, there was a 2-page story in a major newspaper about a 70+ year old Austrian grandmother who was brutally beaten down and raped by 2 young Afghan men - who told police as an excuse that "they did not have sex for 2 months now" ...

And the report in the newspaper showed pictures of the clearly broken, traumatized old woman next to her daughter who described how these Arab rapists destroyed her family and how hard it is to explain this to her grandchilds that her grandmum is now cowering in a chair unable to do simple things or talk ...

Stuff like this makes people EXTREMELY angry.

PS: Norbert Hofer's wife works in a retirement home and is a care professional for old people.

So you get a sense of what's going to happen on May 22, because on the one hand you have a candidate who tries to care about the "average folk", while on the other hand you have a Green representative of the destructive Merkel-ish "welcome policy" which led to all these recent horrible crimes ...

If all Lefties thought like you i wouldn't ever vote for the Right..

I read in DiePresse an article about Cologne yesterday, and in one part it said Wien is not like Cologne, Yet.

[Omega21]

My postal ballot for the runoff has arrived today ...

I will send in my ballot for Alexander Van der Bellen tomorrow.

You didn't already order your second-round ballot with the first one?

But good that you vote for VdB! I voted a few days ago (I already had my second round ballot), my choice should be obvious.

You said your family all will vote Hofer? How is your circle of friends voting?

My friends are basically 100% Van Der Bellen, which is kind of self-explainatory if you consider my and their backgrounds: young, suburban-ish, middle-class to upper middle-class, nearly all with families with a high-education background, on road to higher education themselves (currently having the Matura this week, most will go on to study at a uni).

My family is more split: my sister, her fiancée and my mother are all Green-voters, so naturally VdB. My dad is more pro-ÖVP, but he voted blank in the first round; my mum and I persuaded him to vote VdB now though, it was more of a vote against Hofer. My grandparents are all very much ÖVP (rural-ish Tyrol, so naturally), and I suspect my dad's parents will vote Hofer. I'm not sure about my maternal grandparents, they are generally very anti-FPÖ, especially grandpa, so I hope they will vote VdB, but if not, don't vote at all or vote blank.

And why is it that Middle/Upper class people usually vote extreme Left?

Are they ignoring the mass rape/violent attacks and/or killings or what?

I get it that most don't want to vote FPO, but its just Extreme Left vs Extreme Right, there is no right side really, although Hofer has been playing nice in the recent past as Tender said...

I don't know, you Austrians should be proud of your culture and you People, the amazing country your ancestors built, except for a few ugly years (Nazism) i don't get why you are importing a ton of uneducated people from totally different cultures who don't want to fit in and just form parallel societies.. And you cant tell me it is not like that, it is. Yes you should help them, but only until they country is safe, unless they fulfill the legal Immigration requirments..

A street full of women in burkas is not Austria, I live with muslims, but they are a integral part of my country, being Slavs that adopted Islam a few centuries ago. Islam's not bad, but African/Middle Eastern Wahhabism is bad.

I know you probablly don't live anywhere near these problematic areas such as Praterstern, which gone to sh**t with all the recent Muslim gangs fighting/raping there. 7 crimes a day at just Praterstern..


And this is coming from me, and both my Great Grandparents were executed in '41 for being Slavs..

Most of you will probablly call me a bigot but whatever...

[Omega21]

  I'm wondering what smaller cities or towns have a big working class and have historically been SPO strongholds but might very well give Hofer a big majority?

That would be the Mur-Mürz-Furche, an industrial region in northern Styria. It became a hub of the the Austrian iron and steel industry in the 19th century. Even today, most jobs in the region are in this sector. The Mur-Mürz-Furche was hit hard by the steel crisis in the late 20th century that resulted in job losses and migration of younger people. Like the Rust Belt in the US, it's a region that has to reinvent itself.

How major towns in the Mur-Mürz-Furche voted
2013 legislative election versus 2016 presidential election, round 1
Mürzzuschlag (2013 results, 2016 results)
Kapfenberg (2013 results, 2016 results)
Bruck an der Mur (2013 results, 2016 results)
Leoben (2013 results, 2016 results)
Judenburg (2013 results, 2016 results)

Also, on the other side, wealthier smaller cities and towns which have historically gone to the OVP perhaps, but now might swing to VDB.  

Some affluent suburbs of Vienna:
Klosterneuburg (2013 results, 2016 results)
Perchtoldsdorf (2013 results, 2016 results)
Maria Enzersdorf (2013 results, 2016 results)

If im correct I look at it this way, wealthy people living in wealthy areas will mostly go Vdb, because they don't face the safety problems like Blue-collar workers in some parts of Vienna where Migrants caused a spike in rape and violence, also wealthy people are mostly higly educated and they lean towards the left..

Lower income families that live in these problematic areas face these problems hand to hand, like this woman who was assaulted and almost by an Algerian today, at Praterstern ofcourse: http://www.oe24.at/oesterreich/chronik/wien/Sex-Attacke-von-Asylwerber-am-Praterstern/235335648

These people face these problems and have had enoguh of the Green/Red politicians telling them about the beauty of multiculturism even though they live in wealthy and safe White neighborhood's, while these normal people suffer for the mass immigration of uneducated Muslim men pouring into Austria.


Also, first reports of Sharia "police in Vienna are in.

http://www.krone.at/Oesterreich/Islam-Sittenwaechter_verpruegeln_Rosenkavalier-Stoert_Religion-Story-509740

Everything I see in the news really only benefits Hofer/FPO..

[Omega21]

Your argumentation is very one-sided. Rudolfheim-Fünfhaus is a district of Vienna with a relatively high percentage of immigrants (especially from majority Muslim countries), but the FPÖ share of the vote is usually below the average in this district. Although there are relatively few foreign nationals in the Mur-Mürz-Furche, Hofer's results are above the average in this region. So it's not that simple.

I'm saying in general it could be like this, plus the Rural countryside is more conservative of course and will go for Hofer like in the 1st round..

Also, could any of you tell me if this is true?

https://www.wochenblick.at/steyr-asyl-familie-bekam-5-118-euro-pro-monat/

Asylum family gets 5800 Euros a month, boy you Austrians must have 30 000 Euro paychecks/month if you're giving a family that never payed into the system that kind of money.. (sarcasm)

[Omega21]

I need to ask, is this true?

https://www.wochenblick.at/steyr-asyl-familie-bekam-5-118-euro-pro-monat/

Asylum family gets 5000 Euro/month

If it's true I dont get how Vdb could make up the money he would throw away like this by making contracts like the current president. That just would make up <5% of the money the taxpayers pay out to refugees..

[Omega21]

What is the FPO's economic platform currently like? I know people always talk about them having working class support but I was under the impression, correct me if I'm wrong, that their economic policies have never been as populist as the Danish People's Party or the Party for Freedom. I thought they were more anti-tax, pro-business, owing to their origin as a semi-legitimate liberal party.

It's a very, very strange mix of pro-business, pro-welfare state cuts policies and handouts to certain groups of people (literally handouts, former leader Haider used to, as Governor of Carinthia, give 500€ in cash to people upon turning 18, for example). During Haider's times they gravitated more towards a populist policy also in theory, but since then have turned back to their liberal, pro-business roots. It's sort of a "preach water, drink wine" situation, as they claim to be a party that's in favour of the welfare state, but they routinely vote for every cut and simply just economically liberal bill.

I need to ask, is this true?

https://www.wochenblick.at/steyr-asyl-familie-bekam-5-118-euro-pro-monat/

Asylum family gets 5000 Euro/month

If it's true I dont get how Vdb could make up the money he would throw away like this by making contracts like the current president. That just would make up <5% of the money the taxpayers pay out to refugees..

The fact that this only appeared in a very FPÖ-near new newspaper whose money-givers apparently (?) even have connections with the Kremlin and definitely with some right-wing Burschenschaften, and nowhere else should answer your question. (Unless you're one of these "Lügenpresse!!1!1!1!" types, which I shall hope not)

It is true that a family with 8 children could theoretically receive a relatively large sum in Mindestsicherung + child benefits, maybe even up to 2k (just a guess, I really have no clue - single persons in OÖ get about 800€, a couple 1200€ with 150€ per child, but less from the fourth child on - that in quick calculation brings me to 2000 if we say 70€/child from child #4 on), but 5.000? If they claim such stuff they should at least use more realistic numbers.

Oe24 not being a right-wing website I find this very disturbing:

http://www.oe24.at/oesterreich/chronik/Wirbel-um-8-252-Euro-Sozialhilfe-fuer-Familie/233657966

I don't get some people, why do you work for your paychecks and pay your taxes just to pay 2+k to some Middle Eastern man that just makes children all day long, hoping just the state will care for it..

Thats part of the reason I would rather elect Trump than Vdb, I don't like either, but I hate people who give out hard-working people's money to outsiders who have no interest in ever putting a cent in to the system.

[Omega21]

You are comparing apples to oranges here - people from Syria and Afghanistan are war refugees,  "white Swedes" and "liberal Americans" clearly are not. Of course you can now say "I'd voice the same concerns" when we both know that such a scenario will never happen.

But good, let's get the "racial lense" out of the way. An easy solution to this: give refugees access to the labour market as soon as they get (at least a temporal) permit to stay in the country. They find a job, they no longer get Mindestsicherung and instead actively pay into the system. Problem solved? Now why is it that the right shouts, and apologise my usage of German here but that fits just so well, Zeter und Mordio when anything of the like is proposed?

Is Slovenia a safe country? Oh, yes it is.

I get you want to help but you are only destroying your country. Race is not a problem, being Black or White or Brown makes no difference. But do you know what makes a difference?


Do you think all of these people are familiar with democracy, familliar with living a life which is not dictated by religion, no they are not.

That is why you see women in burkas, and yes it is their free choice to wear it, but if you teach a child from its infancy that they must believe in Allah and that they must wear a Burka, is that free choice?

Please don't argue the last statement, a documentary by ZDF (It cant get any more Left wing than that) covered Islam and parallel societis in Germany in 2014, please watch it before replying, if you have the time ofcourse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVWAIKoatWM

Notice that the brother and father doesnt let the girl live a normal life, and that none of them would be in a relationship with a non-Muslim.

German born Muslim kid: "The woman must be totally obedient to the husband", and guess what, all of his Muslim class mates agree. T

hese are not some extreme cases, it is almost every second person.

[Omega21]

It's over.

Painful to watch.

Hofer constantly tied VdB to Juncker and the EU and as having only the political elite on his side, while Hofer saw himself as an advocate of the Austrian voters.

VdB: "Juncker is a man who had great achievements in his life !"

Hofer: "And these great achievements are what exactly ?"

Long pause from VdB ...

Would you say Hofer won the debate?

[Omega21]

It's over.

Painful to watch.

Hofer constantly tied VdB to Juncker and the EU and as having only the political elite on his side, while Hofer saw himself as an advocate of the Austrian voters.

VdB: "Juncker is a man who had great achievements in his life !"

Hofer: "And these great achievements are what exactly ?"

Long pause from VdB ...

Would you say Hofer won the debate?

Nobody won. Everyone lost ...

Thankfully ATV is a small TV channel with lower ratings, so I'm more interested about how the newspapers will spin it.

I bet the Papers will lean Left, as always, should be fun to see though..

[Omega21]

Scandal for VdB

Known Islamist endorses Vdb on his website.

http://www.aymanwahdan.at/index.htm

In 2010 he wrote:

Reinige dein Haus von allen Kreuzen, denn sie sind Symbole der Christen. Und die Christen nutzen sie für ihre Interessen. Es gibt versteckte Kreuze in Kinderspielzeug, Kleidung und auch auf Teppichen

Also he posted many things like these in the past, although he didn't call for violence directly.

Source:

http://www.krone.at/Wien/Hass-Prediger_vergleicht_Kreuze_mit_dem_Teufel-Anti-Christen-Hetze-Story-223715

I'm sure Vdb will grant him some nice Social income goodies for this if he wins.

[Omega21]

Scandal for VdB

Known Islamist endorses Vdb on his website.

http://www.aymanwahdan.at/index.htm

In 2010 he wrote:

Reinige dein Haus von allen Kreuzen, denn sie sind Symbole der Christen. Und die Christen nutzen sie für ihre Interessen. Es gibt versteckte Kreuze in Kinderspielzeug, Kleidung und auch auf Teppichen

Also he posted many things like these in the past, although he didn't call for violence directly.

Source:

http://www.krone.at/Wien/Hass-Prediger_vergleicht_Kreuze_mit_dem_Teufel-Anti-Christen-Hetze-Story-223715

I'm sure Vdb will grant him some nice Social income goodies for this if he wins.

Could you quit posting racial hatred around here ? We already have Tender for that, and we kind of like him for other reasons so we tolerate him, but nobody likes you.

Big shock, Extreme leftie telling me to shut up and not to voice my opinion and facts.

I have my right to voice my opinion, even though you think I should not be able to.
 
And you stand behind this Islamist. He is the one preaching hatred, not me.

Plus, noone needs you to tolerate them or like them. We are free to speak our mind and if you don't like it, tough luck. Tender is a leftie too, but he's aware of the problems of uncontrolled immigration and that doesn't make him a Racist, and same goes for me.

[Omega21]

Scandal for VdB

Known Islamist endorses Vdb on his website.

http://www.aymanwahdan.at/index.htm

In 2010 he wrote:

Reinige dein Haus von allen Kreuzen, denn sie sind Symbole der Christen. Und die Christen nutzen sie für ihre Interessen. Es gibt versteckte Kreuze in Kinderspielzeug, Kleidung und auch auf Teppichen

Also he posted many things like these in the past, although he didn't call for violence directly.

Source:

http://www.krone.at/Wien/Hass-Prediger_vergleicht_Kreuze_mit_dem_Teufel-Anti-Christen-Hetze-Story-223715

I'm sure Vdb will grant him some nice Social income goodies for this if he wins.

Could you quit posting racial hatred around here ? We already have Tender for that, and we kind of like him for other reasons so we tolerate him, but nobody likes you.

In what language does his post constitute "racial hatred"?

Thank you.

For those of you who don't speak German the post on his site in 2010 was in rough translation:

"Clear your house of the Cross, because it is the simbol of Christians, and they use it for their interest. There are hidden crosses on toys, clothes and rags."

[Omega21]

Will surely be a close race, 2 completely different idelogies which could polarize and split the Austrian voters in half..

Btw, Tender.

Did Vdb really say that he would like a "United States of Europe" or is it just Right propaganda?