Israel-Gaza war

[AtorBoltox]

'You can't destroy the Tamil Tigers'

[AtorBoltox]

For f***'s sake! Hamas cannot be "destroyed."

All that's been literally destroyed (other than Gaza and the lives of its residents) is Israel's reputation.

If there is a deal, and all hostages are released, the priority should be rebuilding Gaza. Keep security around the border if necessary, but this needs to end.

Why can't Hamas be destroyed?

As said before, they're more of an idea, if anything. And there will probably always be a perpetual force in Palestine that wants to exterminate Jews and Israel, especially after this conflict.

Deeply shocking for you to suggest that exterminationist anti-semitism is an inbuilt and eternal character trait of Palestinians

[AtorBoltox]

‘There will always be a perpetual force in Palestine that wants to exterminate Jews’ sounds like something written by Ben-Gvir

[AtorBoltox]

Can GMac or Ray explain where the Palestinians in Rafah are supposed to go? Egypt isn’t taking them, and Rafah is the southernmost town.

I mean, you basically just summed up the problem here. The people who ostensibly should be advocating for them are fine with them dying.

If you'll look carefully at what Israel is doing, they're going sector by sector rather than trying to take the whole city at once with overwhelming force. I think they're far more interested in dismantling Hamas infrastructure than anything else right now, and that essentially allows the civilians to evacuate to other areas of Rafah, shuttling them around as needed.

It's far from the ideal solution that could happen if Palestinian civilians actually had any friends in the Arab world, but what's unfolding is far from the worst-case scenario either.

Egypt should not take in the Palestinians, because Israel would never allow them to return to Gaza. We've had this debate in this thread a dozen times. We had actual Israeli politicians say this and official plans drawn up

You’ve made this argument before, sure, but it was obvious nonsense then and remains so. In any other Situation no one would even pretend to believe an excuse like this. If Chad closed its borders to Darfur tomorrow and then claimed it was for humanitarian reasons as ‘if we let them come the Sudanese won’t allow them to return,’ not a single NGO, UN spokesman or anyone else would believe this was their motivation, or accept it as a valid reason to turn away refugees.

[AtorBoltox]

Can GMac or Ray explain where the Palestinians in Rafah are supposed to go? Egypt isn’t taking them, and Rafah is the southernmost town.

I mean, you basically just summed up the problem here. The people who ostensibly should be advocating for them are fine with them dying.

If you'll look carefully at what Israel is doing, they're going sector by sector rather than trying to take the whole city at once with overwhelming force. I think they're far more interested in dismantling Hamas infrastructure than anything else right now, and that essentially allows the civilians to evacuate to other areas of Rafah, shuttling them around as needed.

It's far from the ideal solution that could happen if Palestinian civilians actually had any friends in the Arab world, but what's unfolding is far from the worst-case scenario either.

Egypt should not take in the Palestinians, because Israel would never allow them to return to Gaza. We've had this debate in this thread a dozen times. We had actual Israeli politicians say this and official plans drawn up

You’ve made this argument before, sure, but it was obvious nonsense then and remains so. In any other Situation no one would even pretend to believe an excuse like this. If Chad closed its borders to Darfur tomorrow and then claimed it was for humanitarian reasons as ‘if we let them come the Sudanese won’t allow them to return,’ not a single NGO, UN spokesman or anyone else would believe this was their motivation, or accept it as a valid reason to turn away refugees.

You arguing aganist the consensus of this forum. The consensus of the US state department. The consensus of the entire global community.

And I am Palestinian btw. How are you going to argue aganist me?

I do not actually think it is consensus that Egypt should turn away refugees. If it is, I’m absolutely shocked at the callousness of the ‘global community.’ You’re also Palestinian? So America accepted your family as refugees? Absolutely outrageous, how dare the us immigration department assist in Israel’s ethnic cleansing!!! Now, can you respond to my point? Is Chad in the wrong for accepting refugees from darfur?

[AtorBoltox]

I guess Viktor Orban is actually a humanitarian social justice hero. Unlike Merkel, he refused to assist ISIS’s genocidal campaign 

[AtorBoltox]

Again, this is not a principled stand in favour of the dignity of the Palestinian people, it's Egypt not wanting to handle a bunch of refugees. The level of doublethink needed to believe that the Palestinians are currently victims of a genocide but also it would be morally wrong for their neighbour to take even a single refugee is staggering

[AtorBoltox]

Saying it’s a genocide is literally Islamist propaganda and it’s beyond disgusting that Belgium is doing this

Imagine i'd say something was Jewish propaganda... i would instantly be called an antisemitist.

While you can without consequences say something is Islamist propaganda...

I do not believe you don't know the difference between Islam and Islamism

[AtorBoltox]

Israelis don't give a crap because they've never faced any consequences and they never will until the United States elects a leader that doesn't suck. Unfortunately, the two candidates running are by far the worst possible candidates for each party, so again, why should Israel care? They can be the favorite country of every sociopath who enjoys dead Muslims, while facing no repercussions for bombing cities and destroying culture for at least the next four years.

Not to nitpick but Haley was unquestionably worse on foreign policy and probably on domestic stuff too. But other than that I completely agree. Israeli society has been very pampered.

The chutzpah it takes for someone living in Georgia to say a people subjected to constant invasions, knifings and suicide bombings over decades is ‘pampered’ is breathtaking

[AtorBoltox]

The second Trump wins the election (if he wins, which looks increasingly likely) Netanyahu will withdraw all troops from Gaza. Biden only gave him 99% of what he wanted, and that's not enough for the most pampered, entitled country on the planet.

The fact that supposed moderates like Gantz still haven't pulled their war cabinet support to stop this madness reflects awfully on their character too. This is a very sick society.

Leftists are completely delusional about what Palestinian culture is. They think this is some indigenous, peaceful tribe like Mayan civilization in 3000 BC (of course they are wrong about this too) when you listen to some of their language. Unfortunately, reality on the ground suggests if given the capacity they would kill every Jewish person they could.

I'm sure bombing refugee camps will totally change their culture.

Both Gantz and Galland gave a three week deadline that hasn’t passed yet

Not holding my breath.

What is your solution to the conflict then? Eliminate Israel's Jewish majority?

Yeah.

End of minority rule (apartheid).

Glad you finally just came clean about the end game. You danced around it for months. Why is it that Israel gets eliminated but other countries like the Netherlands, Hungary, Romania don't? Couldn't at all be because of the country's Jewish majority? There is no minority rule because the West Bank and Gaza are to be part of a Palestinian state, not Israel.

It must be a scary prospect for Jews to be treated by Palestinians the way Palestinians are treated by Jews right now.

If you treat others the way that you want to be treated, it wouldn't be so scary when the shoe is on the other foot.

Yes, the Jews need to know what it’s like to be oppressed, they’ve never known that before

[AtorBoltox]

Israel was formed as an act of contriteness by Europeans for their monstrosities in the 1940s.

What is the legitimacy of Israel if it becomes a monster itself?

Can you just come out and say Israel should be destroyed rather than dancing around it like this