City of Hudson's weighed voting system under scrutiny

[Torie]

The correct ward populations, on which the City Clerk and myself agree, are posted here by Carole Osterink. She got that screenshot from me. The numbers assume that all of the Fireman's Home population goes to the 5th ward, which involves 85 people.

Everybody knows the population counts are wrong, everybody. The Mayor disingenuously expresses some confusion about the details, but is stonewalling and vetoing, because he wants the ward lines to be changed to match were folks are currently voting improperly.

[Torie]

The next few months will be most interesting in Hudson on this issue. The Common Council went one way in the recent election, the Mayorship the other. It does seem to be seeping through the synapses in the hood that weighted voting has to go. So now there may be maneuvering for advantage.

[Torie]

This is the previous attempt to switch to equal population districts.

March 18, 2003 Common Council minutes. Resolution for equal population wards is at Page 15 of PDF

Gossips of Rivertown has suggested that it was a vote to switch to 6 districts, and has produced a map drawn by the city clerk, which was indeed based on 2000 census numbers, but I have not found any official record. There is a glitch in the common council minutes beginning in about August of 2003, with a couple of months missing, so it is conceivable that there was a replacement in the few months before the November election. The results of the referendum are on the Columbia County BOE web site.

This is my interpretation of the text.

Yeah, that is the map. The City clerk went on a hunt for me, since it was missing from the minutes, and found it in another file. Of course, given the population errors for the split census tracts, the map if a fail because the population numbers are wrong, but that will all be fixed soon. See below.

[Torie]

This is the map that I drew that I think is best, and following my advice as the premier map junkie in the City of Hudson (you would be of course, but you don't live in Hudson, so thus I assume the honor ), it has been approved by the appropriate cabal. The split of the census block involving the projection of Fifth Street maintains the status quo. The split of the Hudson Terrace Apartments census block also hews to the status quo, and using Warren Street as a dividing line, is politically almost required absent compelling reasons to depart from that line, and there are no such compelling reasons. The census block population splits were carefully calculated by the City Clerk using data from the assessor's office as to the number of residential units per legal parcel, and I am accepting her numbers.

Below is the legal description of the wards. Fun stuff. I am writing the balance of the referendum now, although it is still unclear what text goes on the petition and/or the ballot, and what not. That is the toughest part. Nobody seems to have gone the referendum by petition route before in New York State, and thus, now going where no person has gone before, there is a lack of a suitable template that has been legally tested, or at least used in the past. The Home Rule Law provides little guidance. I fear that at the minimum the whole darn text will need to go on the petitions, above the signature lines. Ugh!

A.  First Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then southwesterly and then northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the First Ward.

B.  Second Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street in a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the Second Ward.

C.  Third Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where the center line of Worth Avenue intersects the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then easterly bounds of the City to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the center line of Fairview Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in a northwesterly and then westerly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a northeasterly, direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Third Ward.

D.  Fourth Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction  to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along the center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street n a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and easterly bounds of the City to where said boundary line intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in  southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fourth Ward.

E.  Fifth Ward.   All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and running thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in an easterly and then southeasterly direction to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the easterly bounds of the City in a northerly direction to where said boundary intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fifth Ward.

[Torie]

The division of Hudson Terrace Apartments splits  ...

I know all of the above, but I am sticking to the existing map here for political reasons.


Below is the legal description of the wards. Fun stuff. I am writing the balance of the referendum now, although it is still unclear what text goes on the petition and/or the ballot, and what not. That is the toughest part. Nobody seems to have gone the referendum by petition route before in New York State, and thus, now going where no person has gone before, there is a lack of a suitable template that has been legally tested, or at least used in the past. The Home Rule Law provides little guidance. I fear that at the minimum the whole darn text will need to go on the petitions, above the signature lines. Ugh!

A.  First Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then southwesterly and then northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the First Ward.

Missing article

Yeah.

B.  Second Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street in a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the Second Ward.

Census Tract numbers are relative to counties. I am pretty sure that the road you are following is now considered to be Second Street (it is by the Census Bureau). Presumably, you will have a map, inventory of census blocks, and populations associated with your plan. The tax office also shows this as being 2nd St, but they are using Google as part of their mapping application, and Google is likely getting their maps from the census bureau.

No, 2nd street goes all the way to the end to the factory facility, and this intrudes into census block 1000.

In addition, the intersection of Second Street with Block 1000 is ambiguous since Second Street forms the boundary of Block 1000 from Strawberry Alley northward.

I don't think so. When 2nd street intersects census block 1000, you then depart from the 2nd street boundary line, and follow the census block line to the city border.

I believe that North and South are parts of the proper names of the numbered streets.

Yes, I agree, although the existing legals for the wards don't use north and south.

I would substitute the following for the text in red.

"thence along the center line of North Second Street in a northeasterly and northerly direction"

If you look at the map used for the 1940 Census at the very edge of map it says "to brick works", and the boundary of the enumeration district is described as being formed by Second Street and the road to the brick works. The area to the east of the road was used for mining clay for bricks, and then was used a a dump. The area is now capped to prevent leaching into the groundwater and into the Hudson. The city want to do something with the area, but hasn't figured out to avoid penetrating or eroding the cap. Your secret trail is the remnant of an access to the dump from the east.


C.  Third Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where the center line of Worth Avenue intersects the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then easterly bounds of the City to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the center line of Fairview Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in a northwesterly and then westerly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a northeasterly, direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of North Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of North Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Third Ward.

Extraneous comma. That little tab bounded by 6th, Rope Alley, Dodge, and State Street is not needed. Personally, I would start the description at 5th and Warren. It is easier for me to understand the lines that separate wards, and use the city limits for a middle portion or final part of the description.

Where is the extra comma? Oh, I see. What do you mean the tab is not needed? Are you suggesting that the map be changed. The tab is there to equalize populations better.

D.  Fourth Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction  to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along the center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street n a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and easterly bounds of the City to where said boundary line intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in  southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fourth Ward.

I think the starting point is odd. I'd start at well known point such as 5th and Warren, and then when you get to Washington and 5th, you can use 5th and 5th extended to Harry Howard. See the comments above regarding the Dodge-Rope tab, and North 2nd Street above.

I did it because that is the way the existing legal starts, albeit from the city boundary of the fifth street extension rather than the intersection of Harry Howard avenue.

E.  Fifth Ward.   All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and running thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in an easterly and then southeasterly direction to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the easterly bounds of the City in a northerly direction to where said boundary intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fifth Ward.

I would start at 5th and Washington, or 6th and State, and go counter-clockwise.

Ditto to the above.

[Torie]

Can you see this?

It said I requested permission, so you have to approve me I guess. The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

Nice map above, but it is not happening, and the population variances are too large. The variances may be legal (I think for any population variation under federal law, you need some reasonable rationale for the departure from perfect equality (other than just because you feel like it), and having nice rectangular lines may not be enough), but I don't want to go there, either legally or politically. You also excised a heaving black census block from the 2nd ward (the one with 158 people in it, perhaps the most run down side of a block in all of the city of Hudson), which will cause consternation. That block was specifically mentioned by one the 2nd ward alderpersons.

Oh, per Google Earth, you are right about the N. Second Street affair, so I changed my legal descriptions for the 2nd and 4th wards accordingly. The other 2nd Street is called 2nd Street Extension.

[Torie]

I am just going with N. 2nd street and abandoning the reference to the census tract. Nobody lives in this area anyway. The census must have thought the dirt road was a road. Zillow calls the paved road past Mill Street N. 2nd Street Extension. Google maps (even more clearly than Google Earth) clearly calls out as N. 2nd Street the paved road to the dirt road and then the dirt road. 

Anyway, I have jogged on that dirt road a few times. I like getting out into the country, and communing with nature, day dreaming impossible dreams, which bucolic bliss is but one block away from my old disheveled brick house. Now I know I was jogging on N. 2nd Street!

[Torie]

You should read this opinion - lots of interesting thoughts about electoral and representation equality.

Calvin v Jefferson County (PDF)

Ignore that the decision is about prisons, and that Hudson has a prison - but focus on the underlying principles.

Interesting reading. Mirror, mirror on the wall, is the 5th ward screwed after all (more folks per alderperson, thus less "access," or "unfairly" benefitted (because it has more critical votes than it should assuming its two alderpersons do not vote randomly vis a vis each other)?

[Torie]

The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

What is the constitutional or statutory basis for local initiative?

I came across some proposed constitutional amendments that would provide for both statewide and local initiatives, but none appear to have made it out of the legislature.
The estimates of the split block are estimates. Your actual deviation is probably greater. Did the city clerk provide error estimates? In the past, Hudson was stuck making estimates, but is it rational city policy to split blocks deliberately going forward?

I told the City clerk to ask for split census block totals from the census bureau in 2019, so Hudson will not need to do estimates in the future. The split blocks reflect the status quo, and I don't want the small wards to do anything but expand out, as part of a least change regime, and I don't want to cross Warren Street.

[Torie]

The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

What is the constitutional or statutory basis for local initiative?

I came across some proposed constitutional amendments that would provide for both statewide and local initiatives, but none appear to have made it out of the legislature.
The estimates of the split block are estimates. Your actual deviation is probably greater. Did the city clerk provide error estimates? In the past, Hudson was stuck making estimates, but is it rational city policy to split blocks deliberately going forward?

I told the City clerk to ask for split census block totals from the census bureau in 2019, so Hudson will not need to do estimates in the future. The split blocks reflect the status quo, and I don't want the small wards to do anything but expand out, as part of a least change regime, and I don't want to cross Warren Street.

The Census Bureau only releases block data following the census. They only use visible feature, and political boundaries for defining census block boundaries. Before the 2010 census they did permit states to propose use of artificial boundaries for VTDs, which would in turn cause creation of a new census blocks, but explained that state law might not permit that. In New York, VTDs correspond to election districts, and state law strongly is opposed to election districts that an ordinary decent citizen can determine without special equipment.

Following the 2020 census you will likely have to come across Warren to maintain equal population wards.

Ah, whether the ward lines can be changed after the 2020 census is itself an interesting issue that I needed to fitness. Wheels, within wheels, within wheels.

And nobody knows how to frame the petition. The law is that much of a mess. So to be cautious, it will be full dress, as if a constitutional amendment to the state constitution. At least the AG's office reassured me, that the abstract will not be subject to their vetting (the actual law in unclear).

[Torie]

I am pretty confident that the 10% benchmark will not be exceeded with the 2020 census. There is no land left on which much can be built. A few units go up, and some units are lost (for example, a gay man (gays are one of the main culprits of gentrification) bought a 5 plex on State St near 5th and is converting it into a single family home. And given that in NY, redistricting can occur but once a decade, absent the exceeding of the 10% benchmark, it may be illegal under state law to change the lines after the 2020 census given a change in 2017 (unless federal law requires it because there is no reasonable justification for the population variances, and that is unlikely to occur, where the lines are not changed at all - stability is a reasonable reason not to reduce population variances I strongly suspect). So odds are that if this map passes, it will hold until the 2033 election, when I shall be 82 years old.

The 10% benchmark under the weighted voting regime was not exceeded in 2003, btw, and thus there was no change in the weighed vote at that time. The building of Crosswinds, the change in the way prisoners were counted, and a housing development at the top of the hill at the end of Rossman, did upset the apple cart after the 2010 census, giving the 5th ward a larger share of the pie, and increasing the resentment in some quarters of the weighted voting system. And then I arrived! And Jimrtex got interested, and the rest is history in the making.

[Torie]

Where is the once per decade language that makes it clear, that it is not a 10 year time frame? I live in Hudson. I am pretty confident about the relative population stability in each ward at present. The census block split estimates, will only have minor errors if split for the next census which I am urging the City Clerk to do. 

[Torie]

Nobody has said whether they can see this.

Can You See This?

I'd be interested in what they see.

Oh, that is very nice!  If you can find a nice street map (with the street and alley names) of Hudson showing its boundaries without aerials, that would be grand. That is the map format that I want to use. I appreciate all your hard work Jimrtex, but my map is not changing.

[Torie]

Here you go. On google earth, do I just delete temporary places, and then start drawing again, using the ruler? How do you change the color of the lines?  I would prefer a map that did not have an aerial, but rather was just a street map. Thanks.

[Torie]

The KML file is a text file, so you could edit it, but it might be hard to do that way (open the KML file in Wordpad and you will see why).

You can also enter addresses using a variety of files, including XLSX.

Open an XLSX file, and put column headings in Row 1.

For example, you might have columns headed:

NAME and ADDRESS, plus other columns with various attributes.

In the address column be sure to include the city and state. You can use the attributes to style the markers. I loaded the Hudson voter roll, and was able to control the marker display by party affiliation.

If you will pick a polling place for each ward, I'll show you an example.

You are way beyond my pay grade here. What is an XLSX file? Is that what you sent me?

The polling place for Wards 1-3 is 301 Allen St, Hudson, NY 12534 (St. Mary's Academy).

[Torie]

The KML file is a text file, so you could edit it, but it might be hard to do that way (open the KML file in Wordpad and you will see why).

You can also enter addresses using a variety of files, including XLSX.

Open an XLSX file, and put column headings in Row 1.

For example, you might have columns headed:

NAME and ADDRESS, plus other columns with various attributes.

In the address column be sure to include the city and state. You can use the attributes to style the markers. I loaded the Hudson voter roll, and was able to control the marker display by party affiliation.

If you will pick a polling place for each ward, I'll show you an example.

You are way beyond my pay grade here. What is an XLSX file? Is that what you sent me?

The polling place for Wards 1-3 is 301 Allen St, Hudson, NY 12534 (St. Mary's Academy).

I sent you a KML (Keyhold Markup Language). Google Earth was originally called Keyhole Earth Viewer, which was developed by Keyhole, Inc., a company that was acquired by Google.

XLSX is an Excel workbook file.

This is the file I created:

Ward      Address   Location
1   301 Allen St, Hudson, NY 12534   St.Mary's Academy
2   41 N 2nd St, Hudson, NY 12534   Hudson Housing Authority
3   520 Warren St, Hudson, NY 12534   Hudson City Hall
4   51 N 5th St, Hudson, NY 12534      Hudson Armory
5   102 Harry Howard Ave, Hudson NY 12534      Montgomery C Smith Intermediate School

It is for illustrative purposes only, so I picked a building in each ward. I don't know that they are suitable for polling locations. Google doesn't always do a super job of locating address, so I had to drag the markers.

What I really need is a nice pretty map, with all the streets and alleys marked where the ward boundaries are, that can be increased in size some, and laminated, to pass out to voters (or at least show them while trolling for petition signatures). How about helping me my friend. Please? Pretty please? I will send you a fruit basket for Xmas or something.

I have the docs all done, so the next step is to get the blessing of the City attorney, particularly about the abstract language that he writes (which includes the ballot language), but which I wrote for him. That way, once we get the signatures, we will know in advance what the abstract language will be, so that there are no surprises, or contretemps. Man, this was complicated! NY law is a total cf - just horrible.

That is why I don't any law has been passed ever, by petition, without the cooperation of the Common Council or County legislative body, in the state of NY. It is all just too daunting. So not only will Hudson have the distinction of being the only city in the nation with weighted voting, but will also be the first to pass a new law by petition in NY, not written by the Common Council or a County body, designed to get rid of that singular distinction.

Just because it has proven too tough for others, doesn't mean that it is too tough for me. I am one determined little prick, when I feel animated by something. I am going to make this happen by sheer force of will.

[Torie]

I like that map, particularly from a selfish political standpoint (well other than for me), but again, we are not crossing Warren Street, and I want to minimize population variances.

The alleys don't have sidewalks. In fact, my garage encroaches on the alley by a couple of feet.   Which means that when I rebuild the wreck (it is a ferrel cat haven at the moment), it will need to be moved off the alley. Hopefully I can keep the aspect of the configuration where it runs lot line to lot line, which makes it roomy.

[Torie]

I like that map, particularly from a selfish political standpoint (well other than for me), but again, we are not crossing Warren Street, and I want to minimize population variances.

The alleys don't have sidewalks. In fact, my garage encroaches on the alley by a couple of feet.   Which means that when I rebuild the wreck (it is a ferrel cat haven at the moment), it will need to be moved off the alley. Hopefully I can keep the aspect of the configuration where it runs lot line to lot line, which makes it roomy.

What are the street addresses of the two units facing 3rd St, between Rope Alley and Robinson? (west side of the street)?

65 N 3rd, and then there is one building with 3 doors, the middle one has 61 on it, so it may be the three doors are 63, 61, and 59.

Did the city clerk take into account the unit size when making her estimate of the division of the Hudson Terrace Apartments. Can you get the number of residents directly?

No, just number of units. No, you cannot as of 4-1-2010 get the number of residents.

Why is the number of registered voters per unit south of Warren 33% higher than north of Warren?

I have no idea, and was unaware of that.

[Torie]

The map which shall make history, and become legendary, if I have anything to do with it.

[Torie]

Yes, there are, and they are very hard to follow, with no precedents. But I followed it all to the letter, and found a template of a petition, without common council involvement, that gave me some comfort. The City Clerk prepares the ballot language and the abstract, but I wrote it out, and will be meeting with the City Attorney to get him to sign off on it, and so advise the clerk, so what I wrote will be the text they use.

[Torie]

Yes, there are, and they are very hard to follow, with no precedents. But I followed it all to the letter, and found a template of a petition, without common council involvement, that gave me some comfort. The City Clerk prepares the ballot language and the abstract, but I wrote it out, and will be meeting with the City Attorney to get him to sign off on it, and so advise the clerk, so what I wrote will be the text they use.

What is confusing me is why would these be necessary?

A06321
A04929
S04441

Current bills before NY legislature.

What are these bills about?

[Torie]

That's your best map so far, but not as good as mine.

[Torie]

That's your best map so far, but not as good as mine.

15% of the voters is quite a large number in most cities.

If the Common Council were placing the matter on the ballot, they may provide alternatives, which can go way beyond different boundaries. For instance, they could propose a seven-member common council, that perhaps might be elected from single-member districts, or perhaps would continue to have a council president and one at-large member along with five aldermen elected from districts.

Hudson is quite unusual among New York cities having two aldermen per ward.

I don't understand why you insist on drawing ward boundaries through someone's home.

Because it doesn't matter. The BOE can put the home in either ward. I find continuing to split that census block makes the map work better, and I don't want wards that must expand to lose existing territory. I want to hew to a least change regime.

[Torie]

"Splitting blocks is horrid public policy, and arguably in violation of state law."

Citation please.

[Torie]

"Splitting blocks is horrid public policy, and arguably in violation of state law."

Citation please.

ELN § 4-100

That section deals with election districts (precincts), and not ward lines. It further says a block may be divided as long as the addresses are appropriately identified that belong in each election district. So its 1) inapposite, and 2) does not prohibit dividing blocks (meaning street blocks), much less census blocks.