Cluster Bombs

[JSojourner]

Absolutely.  They are unecessary and brutal.  Just another black mark on this country's foreign and military policy.

111 nations signed the agreement.  The U.S., China and Russia did not.  Ridiculous.  It's not like the Chinese and Russians have Gatling Guns and we are left with muzzleloaders. 

[JSojourner]

Absolutely.  They are unecessary and brutal.  Just another black mark on this country's foreign and military policy.

111 nations signed the agreement.  The U.S., China and Russia did not.  Ridiculous.  It's not like the Chinese and Russians have Gatling Guns and we are left with muzzleloaders. 

Hmm.

CBUs were extensively used in Viet Nam to clear landing field for choppers in the jungle (ever hear of daisy cutters).

Yes, I have.  In fact, our church sponsored a medical missionary who treated a number of children who'd lost limbs because of unexploded daisy cutters. 

[JSojourner]

Absolutely.  They are unecessary and brutal.  Just another black mark on this country's foreign and military policy.

111 nations signed the agreement.  The U.S., China and Russia did not.  Ridiculous.  It's not like the Chinese and Russians have Gatling Guns and we are left with muzzleloaders. 

Hmm.

CBUs were extensively used in Viet Nam to clear landing field for choppers in the jungle (ever hear of daisy cutters).

Yes, I have.  In fact, our church sponsored a medical missionary who treated a number of children who'd lost limbs because of unexploded daisy cutters. 

Hmm.

You previously said "unneccessary," and implied their only use was killing.  If you have an alternate, quick, and effective means of clearing landing fields for helicopters, I (and the armed forces) would like to hear of them.

How about cleaning up your messes when you leave?  Oh but wait, that's okay.  It's just little brown people who lose their legs and arms. 

I'd be willing to allow the use of such ordnance, if those responsible for clean up and remediation could be tried and punished justly for failing to removing it when we decide we have no further use for the brown peoples' land.  In other words -- the hypocrisy of the worlds' superpowers is showing once again.

[JSojourner]

Not until every other nation does as well.

That's a great philosophy, now, isn't it?

Until China, Russia, and Pakistan do so, we cannot afford to give up anything.

Why can't we give up cluster bombs?  Because they might use them on us?  Don't we have other weapons that easily trump cluster bombs? 

[JSojourner]

Well they are effective and we do use them/need them or we would have signed the treaty.  You guys don't think we signed it just because W. Bush is pure evil do you?

Actually...pretty close, yes.

I mean, I would bet my left nut the folks who make the cluster bombs have contributed mega-bucks to his various candidacies.  And both he and Dick likely have oodles of cash invested in these companies.  I think that was reason number one for the Iraq War, frankly.  Not oil, not saving Daddy's reputation, not WMD's or spreading democracy...but money.

[JSojourner]

Well they are effective and we do use them/need them or we would have signed the treaty.  You guys don't think we signed it just because W. Bush is pure evil do you?

Actually...pretty close, yes.

I mean, I would bet my left nut the folks who make the cluster bombs have contributed mega-bucks to his various candidacies.  And both he and Dick likely have oodles of cash invested in these companies.  I think that was reason number one for the Iraq War, frankly.  Not oil, not saving Daddy's reputation, not WMD's or spreading democracy...but money.

I don't know, any of that could be true or untrue, we'll probably never know.  But the weapons work.  And the next generation are safer (post war) and more effective against enemy targets.

Safer is good.  Failing a ban or an absolute, ironclad commitment to remediate theaters where we use them, I would be very pleased to know that we were manufacturing safer devices that were extremely difficult to set off post deployment by civilians or conditions.

[JSojourner]

No way would I want to ban cluster bombs. What I do want is for the military to be able to protect themselves with whatever weapon they might need, whenever they have to go fight some evil asshole.

What advantage do cluster bombs give us over bunker busters, incendiary bombs or other ordnance?