The Present Israel-Palestine Conflict Thread

[Franzl]

Depends on the synagogue in question of course. I'm sure there's many Reform ones that aren't comfortable with many of Israel's actions, but there are many others that are pretty Likudnik in their outlook, and protesting one of those isn't anti-Semitic. The Israeli embassy obviously is a more relevant thing to protest, but unless you live in the capital of the city that's not an option.

It's kind of like protesting a church that's quite outspoken against homosexuality and gay marriage. That's fair game. Protesting just some random church without even looking up their position on gay marriage on the other hand would be dumb.

Molotov cocktails have been thrown at synagogues. This is no longer a protest, this is the opening stage of a pogrom.

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/2014/07/20/propalestinian_youth_attack_two_synagogues_in_paris_suburbs.html

A fairly awful thing to do, but torching a synagogue somehow doesn't seem as bad as maintaining an open air prison to use as a shooting gallery every couple of years.

And somehow you've failed to notice that the one shouldn't have anything to do with the other. The Jewish people going to the synagogue in Paris have nothing to do with Israel or its government's policies.

Of course, these are (thankfully) isolated incidents and claiming Jews suffer widespread persecution in Europe is absurd, but isolated as they may be, they are clearly worthy of our condemnation.

[Franzl]

The former director of the American Jewish Congress has offered his take in Politico, though I doubt Ray Goldfield, dead0man and others will like what he has to say.

I don't like or dislike what he has to say.  He made his complaints and critiques without the subtle (or not so subtle) racism we see way too often from others on the subject.  I can understand being against the invasion (I'm not FOR the invasion, but I understand the reasons why).  I can understand thinking it's fine to just hide under the now effective Iron Dome and let the world watch while the angry impotent dogs fire their weapons of terror at civilians by the thousands while doing limited physical damage.  I don't agree with it and think targeting of the launchers is a valid response, but it's a valid argument.

Sorry I'm not as foaming with hate as so many here on the other side.

As critical as I often am of Israel, I don't disagree with you that Israel would theoretically have the moral high ground in so far as they certainly have a right to attempt to stop rockets being fired at them.

The problem I have is that they seem to show very little regard (at all?) for civilian casualties. It's hard for me to feel extremely sympathetic for a side that holds civilians on the other side in no higher regard than vice versa.

[Franzl]

Which is weird because they do more THAN ANY NATION IN HISTORY at limiting civilian casualties.  What other nation calls the building before bombing it to warn the people inside?  What other nation drops a small bomb first after the phone call to show they are serious?  Yes, mistakes have been and will be made.  It's especially hard to limit casualties when the local bad guys force civilians to stay in certain places at gun point.  It's especially hard when the bad guys use their hospitals, schools, ambulances and UN facilities (all 4 of those are documented have happened in the last week) to hide or launch their terror weapons.


The IDF cares and SHOWS they care more about civilians in Gaza than the people in charge of Gaza.  I don't understand how any thinking person can come up with any other conclusion.

Well hate to agree with Snowstalker, but I think it's rather clear there is quite a discrepancy between words and practice regarding civilians on the other side. But I suppose I'm not a member of the exclusive club of "thinking persons" for failing to reach the correct conclusion.

But then again, I would think that thinking persons would also have a better way of describing complex issues than speaking of "good guys" and "bad guys" all the time.

That said, Israel is entitled to self-defense, and except for anti-semites, it's hard to come up with a reason why they wouldn't have that right. But Israel is a good example for how someone can be in the right but take things to a point where even neutral people start to disagree. (Naturally, you won't agree with this, but that's ok )