Flint's water issues

[dead0man]

Why no thread?

CNN link

This seems like the kind of story you guys would eat up!  GOP Gov poisoning black children's water!  Order of events as I see it.
1.Flint is a disaster, for the same reasons it's big brother Detroit is, but worse somehow.
2.State takes over the city and appoints and Emergency Manager who has, basically, unlimited power and he only answers to the gov
3.To save a bit of coin, the EM makes a series of stupid, idiotic choices.  Turns off the cheap, clean water from Detroit.  SELLS THE PIPES FOR SCRAP that connected the two.  The new Flint water plant gets it's water from the Flint River instead of Lake Huron, the river is more acidic than the lake, this kills the city's pipes.
4.When the locals start having problems, they deny, they lie, they cherry pick data.
5.Now the story is OUT, and the sh**t is starting to hit the various fans.

[dead0man]

Indeed, somebody (actually I'm sure it's AT LEAST several people, if not more) needs to go to jail.

[dead0man]

I know I started this thread, and started it bashing the Governor and the Emergency Manager*, but it wasn't a GOP Gov that was governing Flint for the many decades before that put them in the financial hell they find themselves in.  In 2011, every city resident would have had to pay 10k in taxes just to cover unfunded legacy costs (read:pensions).  That is no doubt much higher now.  I'm not defending Snyder or the GOP, I'm just saying it would be stupid to reward the Democrats for this and it's quite odd that of all the politicians involved, only one has been repeatedly singled out here.



*anybody have any theories as to why he (the EM) isn't taking more heat from the left?  I've got a couple.

[dead0man]

Did the Republicans in Lansing get them into pension trouble or locally elected officials?

[dead0man]

So, what you're saying is that if a white GOP town ran itself into stupid amounts of debt, so bad that it had to be saved by a Dem gov, who then appointed a white GOP guy to run the town, who then did the same serious of stupid things as happened here....you guys would only be bitching about the Dem gov?  Dubious.

[dead0man]

That's part of the problem with American municipal governments - local governments shouldn't have to shoulder that kind of debt because they are so susceptible to capital flight. I don't doubt that the local government (being a town in Mchigan) was corrupt as hell (as local governments tend to be) but even with a squeaky clean reputation, municipal government as it is structured in America is built to fail.

Perhaps, but why isn't every local govt about to fail?  Are there any other cities whose citizens own 10k each just to cover unfunded legacy costs?  There are local govts out there that haven't been forced by unions to swallow ridiculous pensions.  Add a little of The Curley Effect and you get the disaster that is Flint.  Sure, there are a lot of local govts on the verge of collapse, but...as far as I know, everyone of them is there because of unfunded pension problems.  It's certainly Omaha's biggest financial obstacle.  Cops, firemen and other local union asshats are greedy mofos.


Or perhaps it's all entirely Snyder's fault.  The EPA (for ignoring the problems), Detroit (for shutting the water off, for gouging Flint for years), 50 years of one party politics (gots to protect those corrupt politicos), the voters of Flint (for being idiots and voting in the same morons over and over agin), GM/Ford/Chrysler (for building sh**tty cars no sane person would want to own), the locally elected Flint officials that approved the plan before the EM even got to Flint, no, none of those groups get any blame, only the Governor.


note-I'm NOT saying Snyder deserves no blame, I'm just saying it's odd as hell that he's the only person or group taking any sh**t.

[dead0man]

Actually, it wasn't done to save money, it was done to "create jobs".  Sticking with Detroit water was the cheapest option (despite what I said in the OP, I was wrong).

cite and cite

Looks like Dems found another story they can turn their back on once all the facts come out.

[dead0man]

Oh there are plenty of people and things to blame, but austerity isn't one of them.

[dead0man]

Still incorrectly blaming austerity I see.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Nevermind that getting water from Detroit was the known cheaper option.  The change was done to "create jobs".  I understand some of you don't want to blame govt "job creation" for this, but we really need to stop the falsehood that it's austerity that's at fault.  If they had gone the austerity route we'd have just ignored Flint the entire time, instead of paying attention to them for 20 minutes before quickly going back to ignoring them and the horrible position public employee unions got them in the mess.  (yes I know they aren't the only town being held hostage by the unions)

[dead0man]

but, AGAIN, it wasn't austerity that caused this problem.  If the Michigan Dems are planning on running on a lie, well, I suppose that's what they always do.

[dead0man]

I dunno, wasn't the water switch because the emergency manager wanted to save money and switched sources, then added chemicals to the water that corroded the pipes?

no, the switch was made to create jobs.  Staying with Detroit's water would have been cheaper than building a new system for a shrinking customer base.  That should be obvious.

cite and cite

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I believe that is the case, yes.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

What should have done when he found out?  What's been done since this became a big story?  Last I heard Flint residents were still being asked to pay for sh**tty water....at some of the highest rates for water....in the world!

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I agree, much of our infrastructure sucks and it's both Pubbies and Dems fault.


and we keep forgetting what got Flint into this position in the fist place.  sh**tty pension deals for public employees.  Again, every resident of Flint has to cover $18000 of unfunded money the city owes.  These poor people are screwed, but hey, the lawyers that work the many lawsuits that will come out of this will make MILLIONS!  And every other American will get to pay for all the idiocy in Flint and Lansing.

[dead0man]

I don't know.  All I do know is that it's silly and wrong to only blame Snyder and the Michigan GOP for this, no matter how well it aligns with ones larger agenda.  Yes, they suck, but they didn't force Flint voters to vote the same assholes in generation after generation.  Same with Baltimore, Cleveland, Detroit, etc.  You have one party city, you're going to have stupid pension deals, you're going to have corruption and they're going to make stupid choices like this.