Terry Shiavo Poll

[The Duke]

I'm using heart attack, which isn't a true medical term, generically. Technically, she suffered from hypoxia, which has caused mental impairment.

I'll forgive you.  After all, only a complete jackass would make a big deal over someone using a term that was technically inaccurate but whose intended meaning was still obvious to all.  Right?

Yes, both could. After four years of continious attempts at therapy and even experimental treatment, it became clear that there was no chance of improvement. Any hope that Mr. Shiavo had of seeing his wife improved vanished.

BTW, that's the reason the Schindler's claim for their problems with Mr. Schiavo. Well, at least initially, as they've changed their story soooooo many times, it's hard to know what there story is now.

Mr. Schiavo claims that it's because the Schindlers wanted money. Of course, Mrs. Schiavo was still getting therapy when the Schindlers filed their suit, which was 4 months later. Kinda makes you wonder about the Schindler's motivation in all of this, dosen't it?

No no no, you're not getting away with that.

You've spent 17 pages insisting that she is in PVS and has always been universally diagnosed as such, and anyone who suggests otherwise is a quack, and that PVS (Permanent!) is irreversible.

If she was always in an irreversible state, and he always knew what her wishes were if she was ever in such a state, he'd have asked the feeding tube be withdrawn sooner.

What is their allegation of abuse? Is this another example of the "abuse" that Mr. Schiavo didn't want her to spend money to change her hair color again?

You'll have to read the Times article.  I read the print version, so I don't know where the weblink is.  Earlier you asked if there were any credible sources for this or that, well, now there is.

This doesn't mena I endorse the accusation, but its important to bring up that the JJ approved type sources are now reporting the things that your opponents have been saying all along.

[The Duke]

I'm not even going to address the first point.  You're one sick person, though.  I'd hate it if you worked for a company that I ran, because you incapable of taking responsibility EVEN WHEN IT DOESN'T MAKE A DIFFERENCE IF A MISTAKE WAS MADE!!

It completely exposes your pretension to objectivity when you concoct these convoluted explainations as to why somebody did something, or why such and such doesn't really prove this or that.

[The Duke]

Today's Times (print version, again) had a story where Terri's brother talks about Terri's thoughts to get a divorce and he alleges evidence of abuse.

[The Duke]

Your effusive praise of Michael and his lawyers is becoming more and more untenable.

George Felos, Michaels attorney, said of Terri's condition, "In all the years I've seen Mrs. Schiavo, I have never seen such a look of peace and beauty upon her," and "She looked beautiful".

Well, starvation work on supermodels, why not Terri Schiavo?  I see it now.  Move over Atkins diet, make room for the Schiavo Startion System!

[The Duke]

I didn't admit the life insurance didn't exist, I  said I used the term life insurance when referring to the malpractice trust fund, and freely admit I used imprecise language that caused confusion.  The malpractice fund did exist and was raided by Michael Schiavo in direct contravention to a court order demanding that it be spent on Terri Schiavo's medical care.

He also lied in that court case, saying he'd allow Terri to live out her natural life expectancy.  He obviously is not doing that.

You keep up these attacks on the Schindlers.  I haven't seen you produce one lie except those that appear to be brought on by extreme distress.  Their view that Terri was in her final hours, for example, turned out to be wrong.  But they can hardly be called liars, for they were under extreme distress and their comments were likewise extreme.  I think its safe to say they probably believed Terri was in her final hourse, if someone says something that turns out ot be wrong, it isn't necessarily a lie.  I haven't seen you produce any actual lies.

We all get it by now, you can quote the Wolfson report.  Its an argument to authority, and not a very good one.  As WMS has demonstrated, simply saying someone is unbiased doesn't make them so.  Simply being court appointed doesn't make someone unbiased.  A lot of your argument rests on the idea that the courts are infallible, which is obviously wrong.

He may be right; he didn't know her 15 years ago.

That's pretty sad that you actually think that.  Its really sick that you'll actually defend anything this guy says no matter how deranged it might be.  THE WHOLE POINT IS THAT WITH EACH DAY, SHE DRAWS NEARER TO DEATH!!!

[The Duke]

It actually is deranged to defend Felos for saying Terri looks beautiful while she is being killed by starvation/dehydration.

I think I've made my view clear that most of what the Schindler's are doing now can be chalked up to desperation, and they should be given reprieve from attacks on their honesty for acts of desperation.

[The Duke]

It actually is deranged to defend Felos for saying Terri looks beautiful while she is being killed by starvation/dehydration.

I think I've made my view clear that most of what the Schindler's are doing now can be chalked up to desperation, and they should be given reprieve from attacks on their honesty for acts of desperation.

Gee, nearly everyone that is party to a legal action, criminal or civil, is "desperate."  Under this twisted logic, any party to a suit is given an excuse to lie in court filing because of desperation.  A witness who is 'desperate" to keep his friend out of jail should be able to lie about an alibi.  The doctors in the malpractice suit should have lied so that they didn't have to make the pay out.  Mr. Schiavo should be permitted to lie because he's "desperate" to carry out his wife's wishes.

I guess that it would be okay for someone getting welfare benefits to lie about income because they are "desperate" to get more money.

You've now sunk to a new low in defending the Schindler's dishonesty.

Your boy Michael is killing their daughter.  That's where their desepration comes from.

What they did wasn't a lie because they believe it to be true.  Its up to the judge to determine if their evaluation of their world at this point in their lives is fit for a court room, and he said no.  Its unnecessary piling on to now say that they're liars.  They believe she said she wants to live.  You can't call someone a liar for saying what they truly believe.

[The Duke]

The cause for the falling out was that the Schindler's wanted to use the money for rehabilitation, and Schiavo used it to litigate the end of Terri's life.

There is a very dark place inside you, it seems, as you defend the absurd and outrageous from someone who is trying to kill his wife, and reserve harsh judgement for the parents of a dying girl.  Its a very sad thing to see someone like that, and in a sense I pity you for that.

[The Duke]

Why does Michael "the beater" Schiavo want his wife immediately creamated and has a court order not allowing the family to get involved in the burial ceremony? Why did Mikey "the beater" Schiavo not allow his wife to recieve last rights from the family priest. He actually had a COURT ORDER out to stop the family.

She actually has received last rites, when the tube was removed.  She received the Communion yesterday.

I would never want pack of liars at the funeral of my wife, the Schindlers, or perhaps The Swindlers.

You'd rather the man that beat his wife be there, right?

You'd rather have the family that pimped out their daughter when they told their son-in-law to start dating?  You have a daughter; would you do that to her?

Just for the record, prior to cremation, Mr. Schiavo is requesting an autopsy.  Just reported on CBS.

This is a recent position change for him then, as he had previously petitioned the court to deny such autopsy.

[The Duke]

I didn't say that he wasn't allowing an autopsy, I said it was a change from his previous position.

[The Duke]

Not to revive this thread, but here's a pretty disturbing article on bioethics.

http://nationalreview.com/smithw/smith200503290755.asp

[The Duke]

I took at a look at how my church defines personhood and on moral grounds Mrs. Schiavo isn't really human anymore.

This doesn't surprise me.

It's unclear whether what I edited out of this post was directed towards J. J. or not, but if it was, please don't do that again. -Alcon

[The Duke]

JJ,

The words of a Catholic theologan talking about removing the feeding tube has nothing to do with the article.  Thea rticle talks about bioethicists who call infants, the retarded, and alzheimer's patients "non-persons".  One advocates harvesting people's internal organs while they're still alive.  Another advocates the killing of anyone who does not have a certain level of cognitive ability.  Another advocates an aggressive organ harvesting policy, taking anyone who is a "non-person" and taking their organs in a deranged utilitarian scheme.  Another advocates classifying those with major brain injuries as dead so their organs can be harvested without anyone's permission.

Your response?  "Not too disturbing".

Address the issue presented instead of going off on tangents about Catholic theology.

[The Duke]

"If I ever go like that just let me go.  Don't leave me there.  I don't want to be kept alive on a machine,"

Why did you put quotes around that?  That's not a quote from Terri Schiavo.