Bush Wins 3rd Debate
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Author Topic: Bush Wins 3rd Debate  (Read 5920 times)
The Duke
JohnD.Ford
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« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2004, 01:03:45 AM »

Education is Bush's strongest issue.  He feels more passionately about it than any other.  Of course he thinks its a near cure-all.  If it were me, I'd have brought terrorism up for half the economy questions, because I think anyone who expects a strong economy without defeating terrorism has their head up their @$$.  Repeating the refrain doesn't weaken the point, it reinforces the point.
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2004, 01:06:01 AM »

Education is Bush's strongest issue.  He feels more passionately about it than any other.  Of course he thinks its a near cure-all.  If it were me, I'd have brought terrorism up for half the economy questions, because I think anyone who expects a strong economy without defeating terrorism has their head up their @$$.  Repeating the refrain doesn't weaken the point, it reinforces the point.

OK, but in this context it made him look like he didn't have answers to any other issues.

But the generally juvenile way he acted I thought was a much bigger minus anyway.
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TheWildCard
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« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2004, 01:25:08 AM »

Hey Ronald Reagan, is it really a positive to mention that Jessica Simpson is a Republican?  The girl is an idiot.  Is that your message for America?  "Come on everyone, be dumb."  That isn't much of a message.

You're so right Wakie! I mean Cho has her own hit reality T.V. show she had a bunch of top 20 music videos and she sells a lot of CD's!!!

...Oh wait no That's right Jessica Simpson is that person not Cho... Cho is only famous for saying Hitler would make a better President than Bush... What a sign of amazing spectacular intelligence!
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Wakie
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« Reply #28 on: October 14, 2004, 01:51:01 AM »

Hey Ronald Reagan, is it really a positive to mention that Jessica Simpson is a Republican?  The girl is an idiot.  Is that your message for America?  "Come on everyone, be dumb."  That isn't much of a message.

You're so right Wakie! I mean Cho has her own hit reality T.V. show she had a bunch of top 20 music videos and she sells a lot of CD's!!!

...Oh wait no That's right Jessica Simpson is that person not Cho... Cho is only famous for saying Hitler would make a better President than Bush... What a sign of amazing spectacular intelligence!

You're right.  I'm sold.  Jessica Simpson is a genius.  Buffalo really do have wings.  There really are chicken in the sea.  If you are more attractive that means you are a better person.

If you really wanted a solid example of celebrities supporting each candidate you would have Natalie Portman on the liberal side.
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Gustaf
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« Reply #29 on: October 14, 2004, 03:52:59 AM »

Note on jokes: the audience isn't actually allowed to laugh at anything the candidates say.

THe polls seem to indicate that Kerry won, but I didn't see it myself.
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opebo
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« Reply #30 on: October 14, 2004, 04:01:36 AM »

Kerry clearly won, much bigger than in the second debate.

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Democratic Hawk
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« Reply #31 on: October 14, 2004, 08:00:28 AM »

Kerry won the first debate 6-1 [I'm being charitable to the President mind you], the second debate 7-6 (8-6) and the third debate 6-3!

All Bush did was to castigate Kerry as a 'liberal' in the old-tax-and-spend tradition and, frankly, he's in no position to criticise any one on fiscal responsibility. It got somewhat tiresome! Nevertheless, he gave a confident performance, which would appeal to his base.

Kerry, on the other hand, more or less matched the success of the first debate; however, it didn't came across as signifigant as it did then because Bush performed relatively better. The improvement was noticeable in Bush, while Kerry held his own and was, thus, able to win this debate.

I think Kerry really hit home on many domestic issues, rightly criticising Bush's record as well as offering his own policies. Bush berated them as being unaffordable without hiking taxes on the middle-class. However, Kerry countered by making it perfectly clear that he would cost his plans in accordance with the fiscally responsible "pay as you go" ethos. In effect, he would only do things once they were more or less affordable. Bearing in mind the state of the budget deficit, a President Kerry should not be expected achieve his goals too quickly. It's called being realistic! I'm sure Kerry will pursue a pragmatic approach to achieving his goals.

Kerry was right in that other US presidents didn't botch domestic issues in the face of problems of an equal, or greater, magnitude than today.

I'm certain that a President Kerry will fight for the increasingly squeezed middle-class and working families. He won't raise taxes on them because it would be political suicide if he did - but Bush has to scaremonger on that one by misrepresenting Kerry time and time again! Give me a break, George!

Dave
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MODU
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« Reply #32 on: October 14, 2004, 08:06:47 AM »

Hey Ronald Reagan, is it really a positive to mention that Jessica Simpson is a Republican?  The girl is an idiot.  Is that your message for America?  "Come on everyone, be dumb."  That isn't much of a message.

I was actually thinking that the other day.  Cho (though not necessarily pretty) is quite smart, while Simpson (being very pretty) isn't very smart.

However, a similar parallel could be drawn between Bush and Kerry.  Kerry is all window dressing yet lacks the ability to form and convey his "plan" to America (which means he most likely doesn't have one), while Bush looks "dumb," yet has been able lead out country out of a recession and terrorist attack and put our economy back on the upswing.

Guess you can't judge a book by it's cover.
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Andrew
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« Reply #33 on: October 14, 2004, 01:23:04 PM »

Kerry is all window dressing yet lacks the ability to form and convey his "plan" to America (which means he most likely doesn't have one) . . .

He does have a plan:

http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/our_plan_for_america.pdf
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #34 on: October 14, 2004, 01:47:10 PM »

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lidaker
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« Reply #35 on: October 14, 2004, 01:58:56 PM »

How has your opinion of John Kerry/George W. Bush been affected by the debate? Is your opinion of Kerry -- more favorable, less favorable, or has it not changed much? [Names rotated.]

Kerry: more favorable 42%, less favorable 15%, not changed much 43%

Bush: more favorable 27%, less favorable 17%, not changed much 56%


Thinking about the following characteristics and qualities, please say whether you think each one better described John Kerry or George W. Bush during tonight's debate. How about -- [Random Order]?

Expressed himself more clearly: Kerry +32%
Showed he cares about the needs of people like you: Kerry +12%
Had a good understanding of the issues: Kerry +12%
Agreed with you more on the issues you care about: Kerry +7%
Showed he shares your values: Kerry +4%(!)
Was more believable: Kerry +3%
Was more likable: Bush +5%


Next, regardless of which presidential candidate you support, please tell me if you think John Kerry or George W. Bush would better handle each of the following issues. How about -- [Random Order]?

Healthcare: Kerry +14%
The economy: Kerry +5%
Education: Kerry +1%
Taxes: Bush +3%(!)


These numbers are not good for Bush.
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Silent Hunter
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« Reply #36 on: October 14, 2004, 02:37:20 PM »

I've mentioned something about a focus group in the other forum.
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Bogart
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« Reply #37 on: October 14, 2004, 03:06:16 PM »

The early polling, like that for the other 2 debates, doesn't really say a lot. Too early to tell. I say Bush won. He had Kerry on the defensive much of the night. Bush forced him to defend his record in terms of numbers of bills passed, numbers of tax increases voted for and costs of his proposed programs. By contrast, I felt Bush tried to focus on his own proposals/programs.

Much of what Kerry had to say was the same thing. Repeatedly accusing Bush of losing nearly 2 million jobs (not true) and of raising taxes on the poor and middle class (not true) while cutting them for the rich (also not true).
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MODU
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« Reply #38 on: October 14, 2004, 03:52:46 PM »

How has your opinion of John Kerry/George W. Bush been affected by the debate? Is your opinion of Kerry -- more favorable, less favorable, or has it not changed much? [Names rotated.]

Kerry: more favorable 42%, less favorable 15%, not changed much 43%

Bush: more favorable 27%, less favorable 17%, not changed much 56%


Thinking about the following characteristics and qualities, please say whether you think each one better described John Kerry or George W. Bush during tonight's debate. How about -- [Random Order]?

Expressed himself more clearly: Kerry +32%
Showed he cares about the needs of people like you: Kerry +12%
Had a good understanding of the issues: Kerry +12%
Agreed with you more on the issues you care about: Kerry +7%
Showed he shares your values: Kerry +4%(!)
Was more believable: Kerry +3%
Was more likable: Bush +5%


Next, regardless of which presidential candidate you support, please tell me if you think John Kerry or George W. Bush would better handle each of the following issues. How about -- [Random Order]?

Healthcare: Kerry +14%
The economy: Kerry +5%
Education: Kerry +1%
Taxes: Bush +3%(!)


These numbers are not good for Bush.

Are these from the USA Today?  Link?
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A18
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« Reply #39 on: October 14, 2004, 04:48:51 PM »

I'd also like to see a link

Can someone post one?
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lidaker
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« Reply #40 on: October 14, 2004, 05:35:47 PM »

No, they're directly from Gallup

http://www.gallup.com/poll/content/?ci=13642
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A18
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« Reply #41 on: October 14, 2004, 05:45:19 PM »

Thank you!

Expressed himself more clearly
61% Kerry
29% Bush
Kerry +32

Was more likable
48% Bush
43% Kerry
Bush +5

Education
48% Kerry
47% Bush
Kerry +1

Taxes
50% Bush
47% Kerry
Bush +3

Who expressed himself more clearly is naturally going to be the one you say won the debate
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lidaker
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« Reply #42 on: October 14, 2004, 07:08:22 PM »

Thank you!

Expressed himself more clearly
61% Kerry
29% Bush
Kerry +32

Was more likable
48% Bush
43% Kerry
Bush +5

Education
48% Kerry
47% Bush
Kerry +1

Taxes
50% Bush
47% Kerry
Bush +3

Who expressed himself more clearly is naturally going to be the one you say won the debate

Kerry won on all questions, except for two of them: Bush was percieved as more likable by a tiny 5% margin and people trust him more on taxes, by an even smaller margin of 3%, which is very bad, I would guess, for a republican candidate.

On all other ten or so questions Kerry won.

Even a very partisan guy like yourself can't credibly spin these numbers.
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A18
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« Reply #43 on: October 14, 2004, 07:11:19 PM »

There were only four issues
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lidaker
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« Reply #44 on: October 14, 2004, 08:11:07 PM »

Four issues, Kerry won three, nine questions about the debate, Kerry won eight
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??????????
StatesRights
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« Reply #45 on: October 15, 2004, 12:16:51 AM »

Kerry is Mr Perfect in your world.
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lidaker
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« Reply #46 on: October 16, 2004, 06:52:28 AM »


I didn't do the Gallup poll, you know
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Zot
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« Reply #47 on: October 16, 2004, 10:59:51 AM »

I didn't watch the debate, but all I hear about is Kerry's lesbian remark and how negatively it bothered people. 

It seems to me since the object is to win the election and that the debate is moving voters to Bush's direction, then Bush won.
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