Opinion of Brigham Young

[So the Heroes Fall]

I honestly think this guy was an even worse HP than Joseph Smith and that's saying a lot.

[Free Palestine]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

[Bo]

HP for polygamy.

[JSojourner]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

[Scam of God]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

[Torie]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

[BushKenya]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

BTW, I root against his university's sports team every chance I get.

[useful idiot]

Lean FF, for leading his people from persecution to their own homeland and creating a society out of the desert. There's no evidence that he ordered or showed any support for the Mountain Meadows Massacre, none at all. In fact the only evidence we have shows otherwise. Yes he was a theocrat, but a generally benevolent and tolerant one. As for polygamy, I won't judge his actions, he wasn't the one that instituted the practice and a large number of his wives were merely widows he took care of. That said, unlike Smith, he was a racist. Plus without him the Niners wouldn't have gotten Steve Young...

[Alexander Hamilton]

HP

[Senator Libertas]

HP

[Vasall des Midas]

Lean FF, for leading his people from persecution to their own homeland and creating a society out of the desert.

This. Gotta admire his sheer gall. Without being able to sign onto the remainder at all.

There's no evidence that he ordered or showed any support for the Mountain Meadows Massacre, none at all. In fact the only evidence we have shows otherwise.

Cannot say, do not care.

Yes he was a theocrat, but a generally benevolent and tolerant one.

Benevolent? They all are. That's part of the problem. Tolerant? What?

As for polygamy, I won't judge his actions, he wasn't the one that instituted the practice and a large number of his wives were merely widows he took care of. That said, unlike Smith, he was a racist.

True.

Plus without him the Niners wouldn't have gotten Steve Young...

What?

[useful idiot]

Lean FF, for leading his people from persecution to their own homeland and creating a society out of the desert.

This. Gotta admire his sheer gall. Without being able to sign onto the remainder at all.

There's no evidence that he ordered or showed any support for the Mountain Meadows Massacre, none at all. In fact the only evidence we have shows otherwise.

Cannot say, do not care.

Yes he was a theocrat, but a generally benevolent and tolerant one.

Benevolent? They all are. That's part of the problem. Tolerant? What?

As for polygamy, I won't judge his actions, he wasn't the one that instituted the practice and a large number of his wives were merely widows he took care of. That said, unlike Smith, he was a racist.

True.

Plus without him the Niners wouldn't have gotten Steve Young...

What?

Steve Young is a descendant of Brigham Young(his great great grandson). He was a quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers in the 90's. Led them to a Super Bowl victory and many playoff victories(a few NFC championship losses to the Cowboys). In fact if the Cowboys hadn't been so good at the same period I have no doubt he'd have gotten a couple more rings.

As for his tolerance, Utah under his leadership and in the aftermath of his leadership (when his shadow still loomed large) was not the Taliban-style theocracy most would have you believe. The FLDS is far more conservative and extreme than the early LDS polygamists were. Chinese immigrants and Native Americans were treated in an exemplary fashion compared to their treatment by other Western settlers, Utah had a decent Jewish population(I believe it had the first Jewish governor in the U.S.), and it was one of the first states to grant suffrage to women. The early LDS leadership was also pretty tolerant of behavior most other religious groups in the United States at the time frowned on (dancing for instance, and sexuality in many respects).

Like I said, however, he was unfortunately a racist who disliked blacks, but if we're judging him based on the times in which he lived then he was fairly mild.

[Torie]

Lean FF, for leading his people from persecution to their own homeland and creating a society out of the desert. There's no evidence that he ordered or showed any support for the Mountain Meadows Massacre, none at all. In fact the only evidence we have shows otherwise. Yes he was a theocrat, but a generally benevolent and tolerant one. As for polygamy, I won't judge his actions, he wasn't the one that instituted the practice and a large number of his wives were merely widows he took care of. That said, unlike Smith, he was a racist. Plus without him the Niners wouldn't have gotten Steve Young...

Well, we do know that he ordered destroyed the cairn the US army built at the site of the massacre but one year later, and we do know he participated in the cover up of the crime, and we do know he used phrases vis a vis the Francher party such as "use them up," and we do know he authorized the purloining of their property, and we do know at the time he was prepared and planning to go to war with the US. But then he changed his mind about going to war, when he realized he would lose, and he may have tried to send a message down to Southern Utah to leave the Francher party alone after he changed his mind perhaps. I suspect he did order the massacre (nothing happened in Utah without his OK, and in fact all property was owed by the LDS church; he did not allow followers to own any property, the better to control them).

There is no way to put lipstick on this pig, and make Young look pretty over any of this. He was a capable leader, but quite authoritarian and paranoid, and well - sociopathic in some ways.

[Vasall des Midas]

Steve Young is a descendant of Brigham Young(his great great grandson). He was a quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers in the 90's. Led them to a Super Bowl victory and many playoff victories(a few NFC championship losses to the Cowboys). In fact if the Cowboys hadn't been so good at the same period I have no doubt he'd have gotten a couple more rings.

This is the only Steve Young I was aware of.

}As for his tolerance, Utah under his leadership and in the aftermath of his leadership (when his shadow still loomed large) was not the Taliban-style theocracy most would have you believe. The FLDS is far more conservative and extreme than the early LDS polygamists were. Chinese immigrants and Native Americans were treated in an exemplary fashion compared to their treatment by other Western settlers, Utah had a decent Jewish population(I believe it had the first Jewish governor in the U.S.), and it was one of the first states to grant suffrage to women.

Apart from the Chinese and Jewish stuff (source?), I know all that.

[Proud Lieberal from Northeast]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

BTW, I root against his university's sports team every chance I get.

[dialectical fetishist]

HP, for his connections to that massacre of settlers, and for his general theocraticness.

BTW, I root against his university's sports team every chance I get.

[Χahar]

Plus without him the Niners wouldn't have gotten Steve Young...

I suppose he's an FF for that.