True Justice: Gantt beats Helms in 1990!
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  True Justice: Gantt beats Helms in 1990!
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Question: How the hell should win the election?
#1
Mario Cuomo
 
#2
George HW Bush
 
#3
Ross H. Perot
 
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Total Voters: 25

Author Topic: True Justice: Gantt beats Helms in 1990!  (Read 36017 times)
Psychic Octopus
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« Reply #50 on: January 16, 2010, 01:17:30 AM »

Excellent, Cuomo/Gantt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Mechaman
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« Reply #51 on: January 16, 2010, 01:23:45 AM »

Yeah, I was either thinking Brown/Gantt or Cuomo/Gantt. I thought Brown/Gantt would be interesting because it would mean a shift in the Democratic Party and possibly a 1992 without Ross Perot, but after awhile I decided a 1992 without Perot is not a worthy 1992! Also, as shocking as a Brown victory would've been, I prefered to go with the "some gave all" approach if you will. I pretty much realized that this isn't just a normal election timeline, it is the timeline of HARVEY GANTT and therefore I should make him as impactful as possible, show how much of history changes with his victory over Jesse Helms in 1990.
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« Reply #52 on: January 16, 2010, 01:41:28 AM »

Yes, I preffered Brown too, but with Gantt on the ticket.

AWESOME!
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Mechaman
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« Reply #53 on: January 16, 2010, 05:09:19 AM »

The Candidacy of Ross Perot:



In the beginning of 1992 a phenomena by the name of Ross Perot had taken the political world by storm. On February 20th, 1992, the Texas billionaire declared his intention to run for president if his supporters could get him on all 50 US state ballots. He ran on a position that included such diverse political positions as: balancing the federal budget, firm pro-choice stance, expansion of the war on drugs, ending outsourcing of jobs, support for gun control, belief in protectionism on trade, support for the Environmental Protection Agency, and enacting electronic direct democracy via "electronic townhalls". At first not many people took the Texas billionaire seriously, especially with the insurgent campaigns of paleoconservative Pat Buchanan in the Republican primaries and that of libertarian Democrat Jerry Brown in the Democratic primaries that fostered populist resentment toward establishment politicians. However, his big break would come on March 18th, when he would announce his Vice Presidential pick:


California Governor Pete Wilson

The selection of Pete Wilson, the moderate Republican governor or California would shake up the political world. Many people expected Perot to pick someone not involved with politics, like Vice Admiral James Stockdale, but political pundits and experts called his pick of Governor Pete Wilson a "genius pick" and that "very rarely does the VP make the ticket, and you can take us to the bank when we say that the selection of California Governor Pete Wilson as a runningmate will make Ross Perot someone to take very seriously by whoever happens to win the Democratic and Republican nod."
This, along with the weakening of Buchanan's campaign and the infighting between the Democratic nominees helped Perot jump ahead in the polls to the point that by June Perot was actually in the lead beating Bush by two points on the week of June 21st-28th. It was then that Perot finally decided to make his run official, and up until the week of the Democratic National Convention, he was holding the lead over Bush and the Democrats. It seemed that thanks to the inner turmoil within the Democratic ranks as well as a souring economy being blamed on Bush, Ross Perot had the most to gain.
However, after Bush's attack on the division within the Democratic ranks the nation had started to pull back towards the Republicans and then not long after that the Democrats finally united under the ticket of Cuomo/Gantt. Perot suddenly found himself trailing the two tickets by two points, the race was almost a statisitcal deadheat between all three candidates. All three tickets would end up being in it for the long haul in perhaps the most intense electoral season since television was invented.
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Historico
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« Reply #54 on: January 16, 2010, 12:53:20 PM »

Awesome, Although I know Perot wanted to get a Moderate Democart to try to balance the ticket, I just think he needs someone with actual Government Expierence to sure up Traditional Voters. And Wilson is just that man, also I had a feeling the Cuomo/Gantt ticket would happen just waiting on you lol. Can't wait to see the debates between; Bush/Quayle vs. Cuomo/Gantt vs Perot/Wilson...Keep it comming.
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Mechaman
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« Reply #55 on: January 16, 2010, 01:33:41 PM »

Awesome, Although I know Perot wanted to get a Moderate Democart to try to balance the ticket, I just think he needs someone with actual Government Expierence to sure up Traditional Voters. And Wilson is just that man, also I had a feeling the Cuomo/Gantt ticket would happen just waiting on you lol. Can't wait to see the debates between; Bush/Quayle vs. Cuomo/Gantt vs Perot/Wilson...Keep it comming.

Well I had just read the wikipedia article on Pete Wilson and I noticed he seemed to be alot like Perot: Socially moderate to liberal and fiscally conservative. Not sure how he feels about protectionism, but I think I can tone down Perot's protectionism to fit in with Wilson's moderate Republicanism. I seriously just came up with this at the last minute, hell right now I'm not even sure who will win the election or if it will go to Congress.
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Barnes
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« Reply #56 on: January 25, 2010, 05:33:34 PM »

Bump! Smiley
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Mechaman
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« Reply #57 on: February 02, 2010, 02:09:16 AM »

General Election Season 1992:

The general election season of 1992 would end up being one of the most exciting and intense election seasons in history, with approval ratings stagnant amongst the three big tickets. However, just a few months before the election in late August 1992 at a place called Ruby Ridge in Idaho would change all of that.


The cabin at Ruby Ridge.

On August 22nd, after a standoff with the Randy Weaver, the patriarch of the Weaver Family, the FBI would assault the isolated cabin and in the confusion would end up killing Weaver, his friend Kevin Harris, his son Samuel, and his wife Vicki. Newscameras would catch a glimpse of 2 scared teenage girls, with smokey shirts and a baby girl, come off the property of Ruby Ridge with federal authorities, all three of them scarred for life. The event would end up terrifying millions of Americans who were becoming more and more ever skeptical of their government, and it was a horrible blow to the Bush/Quayle Administration, who saw their approval suffer a significant drop into the mid 20's. The biggest beneficiary of this event would end up being Ross Perot, who was running against "politics as usual", the American people began to see a man who was outside the confines of American government, a man with independent positions who wasn't bought off by special interests or locked away from the views of the people.


Independent Candidate Ross Perot would be the biggest beneficiary of the tragedy at Ruby Ridge, gaining a 43% lead over Cuomo's 32% and Bush's 25% the week following the Ruby Ridge incident.

Also in the midst of Perot criticizing the government's handling of Ruby Ridge, Civil Rights activist Dexter Scott King, the son of Martin Luther King Jr., would endorse Perot, claiming that the time had come "for Americans everywhere to finally realize that a man should not be judged by his political party, but by the content of his character, something Ross Perot has multitude of."


Dexter Scott King

 This endorement would be seen as a brutal setback to the Cuomo campaign, as King's voice was very powerful among the African American voting public, one of the Democratic Party's strongest voting base. This, coupled with Perot's runningmate Pete Wilson's popularity with hispanics and asians threatened to steal alot of the minority vote away from both the Democrats and the Republicans. Ross Perot was turning into the worst nightmare imaginable for the Democrats and Republicans, with many commentators proclaiming 1992: The Year of Perot.

However, these commentators could never anticipate such a personality as that of a Senator Harvey Gantt of North Carolina.
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Historico
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« Reply #58 on: February 04, 2010, 09:44:11 AM »

Hmm...The Bush/Quayle campaign does seem to be sinking pretty fast, while Perot with Wilson at his saide looks more and more formidble by the day. It seems like all the marbles are going to come down to the debates, like they did IOTL. Electoral Map wise thing's will get pretty interesting...I say that Bush holds most of the South, Perot takes votes in the Midwest and the Upper Northeast, While Cuomo nails the Rust belt, and maybe afew Southern States(Ie North Carolina) due to high black voter turnout...It will be a cool one to see...
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Mechaman
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« Reply #59 on: February 24, 2010, 11:01:03 PM »

Bump.

For teh newbies.
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Mechaman
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« Reply #60 on: March 22, 2010, 06:43:39 PM »
« Edited: March 22, 2010, 06:46:38 PM by Mechahole »

On Larry King Live Democratic Vice Presidential candidate Harvey Gantt holds his own in an interview with Larry King.  A few excerpts from the interview, which many would credit with helping turn the tide that was in favor of Ross Perot:

King: So Senator, what is your position on the North American Free Trade Agreement?
Gantt: King, I can't speak for my runningmate, but I am no fan of protectionism.  Guys like Perot have it all wrong on the trade issue, protectionism is like going to a boxing ring and fighting with one arm tied behind your back.  However, NAFTA as it is right now, needs a lot of rework so it can benefit all sides.
The Senator's position on trade made him come out as the logical pragmatist as opposed to Bush being pro-free trade and Perot being a raging protectionist.

King: Now you were one of the few Democrats to support the resolution to go to war with Iraq.  Please explain how you as a "liberal Democrat" decided to side with President Bush in this matter.
Gantt: Sadaam Hussein is guilty of crimes against humanity, he has a record of using chemical warfare against his own people, of torturing innocent civilians, a record of genocide against minorities within his borders, one of the most shameful records of human and civil rights in the world.  In my mind the shame is that we stopped at Kuwait, that we didn't take the fight to Baghdad.  Every day that Sadaam Hussein lives is another day of oppression of the Iraqi people.  Human rights should not be a thing only for the West, it should be something that beats in the heart of all peoples.  The Iraqi people deserve to have freedom, they deserve to walk the streets, the banks of the Tigris and the Euphrates with the ability to say "we are a free people."  They do not deserve to live day after day, month after month, year after year cowering in fear of their government.  The United States of America should know that the world is bigger than just us, that there are people suffering under tyranny as we speak.  I differ from my fellow party members in that I believe it is not enough that our own people to have civil liberties but that people everywhere should not sleep and wake up under the flag of tyrants.
King: So in this respect you are like Democrats like Henry "Scoop" Jackson, Lyndon Johnson, John Kennedy, Harry Truman, and others who took on the cause of interventionism to advance American visions of freedom and justice?
Gantt: Yes Larry.  That is exactly what I believe.  We should realize that the vision of American liberalism can only be achieved when the American government makes it a mission to secure freedom and justice for all peoples dwelling under tyrannical regimes.  As the Vice President of the United States I will make sure that all voices of the oppressed, not just American voices but all of God's children who walk this Earth, will be heard.
Gantt's strong support of interventionism, what the Cuomo campaign feared would damage the ticket with the liberal base, ended up winning alot more praise from hawkish moderates and even quite a few talkingheads on the right (with conservative icon William F. Buckley calling Gantt "what the Democratic Party needs most, too bad he's running for the Vice Presidency).

King: In the wake of the Ruby Ridge incident, what thoughts do you have on that?
Gantt: My thoughts are that it is a shame that such an event had to happen, that those two teenage girls had to lose their family like that.  It is a massive shame, something the government of this nation should avoid, the killing of American lives.
King: And you feel this way although the Weavers hated you?
Gantt: I know Randy Weaver's opinions of me, and it doesn't change the fact that what happened at Ruby Ridge to him, his wife, his friend, and his son shameful.
King: What of your opinion of the revelations of Weaver being tried for selling illegal weapons to an undercover FBI agent?
Gantt: Maybe I'm just too much of an individualist, but I believe it is wrong for the Federal Government to do that, to charge a man for the act of arming himself.
King: Are you saying that you oppose the gun control measures that were used to get Randy Weaver on trial?
Gantt: There is not much difference between a normal shotgun and a sawoff Larry, except that one of those in this country can cause a man to get arrested.  I care dearly about the safety of American citizens, I do support background checks and other safety measures making it harder for criminals to get guns, but I do not and will never support legislation that will turn American citizens intp criminals just because they happened to own a gun.  I will never support a ban on firearms as long as I am in political office.
Gantt's support for gun rights would be a very strong advantage to the Cuomo/Gantt ticket, making the Democratic ticket appear more gun friendly than the Perot/Wilson ticket but not as NRAish as the Republican ticket.  This would be a vital move that would help the ticket score many votes in the West and the South that they would've lost otherwise.

King: Senator, tonight we have heard quite a few of your views that many would consider "independent" and you have occasionally been called a "maverick", yet you proudly wear the label "liberal" in spite of some of your well known independent views.  Let me ask for the record, why do you consider yourself a liberal?
Gantt: King, I would like to take a moment to quote the late John F. Kennedy on this:
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Like JFK I also believe that one's liberalism is not determined by his platform, but by the intent of his heart.  As a bleedingheart liberal I seek to use the reason and judgement to increase for myself and my fellow Americans the amount of justice and freedom which all human life deserves.  That is why I consider myself a proudl liberal.
King: This has been a most interesting interview Senator, great to have you on here.
Gantt: Great to see you Larry.
The camera pans out to show Senator Gantt shaking Larry King's hand before going out to the audience and talking to some of the people there.

The Larry King segment, one of the most watched segments in the history of CNN, was watched by millions of people around the world.  His independent views would ring true with a large section of America, resulting in a great surge in approval for the Democratic ticket, putting the Cuomo/Gantt ticket neck in neck with the Perot/Wilson ticket while the Bush/Quayle ticket struggled to stay above 25%.

Polling week of September 28th, 1992:
Ross Perot (TX)/Pete Wilson (CA) (Independent)Sad 34%
Mario Cuomo (NY)/Harvey Gantt (NC) (Democratic)Sad 36%
George HW Bush (TX)/Dan Quayle (IN) (Republican)Sad 27%
Undecided: 3%
For the first time in the election, the Democratic ticket of Cuomo/Gantt had beat the Independent ticket of Perot/Wilson.  But could they hold that lead until election day?
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #61 on: March 22, 2010, 06:46:34 PM »

Great to see it back, dude, keep it coming, don't be like Lief Tongue
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Mechaman
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« Reply #62 on: March 22, 2010, 06:51:39 PM »

North Carolina poll on Democratic Senator Harvey Gantt:

Approve: 71%
Disapprove: 28%
Undecided: 1%

Among North Carolina Democrats:

Approve: 96%
Disapprove: 4%

Among North Carolina Republicans:

Approve: 60%
Disapprove: 38%
Undecided: 2%

The people North Carolina, the state that once sent Jesse Helms to the Senate, had a skyhigh approval of their liberal Democratic Senator now Democratic Vice President nominee Harvey Gantt.  Many feared that such approval for the Senator would translate into a win in North Carolina for the Democratic Party in an otherwise safe Republican state.
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hawkeye59
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« Reply #63 on: May 22, 2010, 05:13:50 PM »

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Mechaman
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« Reply #64 on: May 24, 2010, 09:36:18 AM »


Perfect time for a bump.  I plan (and I'm serious about this) to finally get the 1992 election done by the end of the week.
And rest assured.....you will not see it coming.
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Mechaman
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« Reply #65 on: May 24, 2010, 09:59:01 AM »
« Edited: May 24, 2010, 11:48:34 AM by David Lee Roth »

By the end of September many commentators had began offering comparisons between the way George Bush campaigned to that of William Taft in 1912: That of a doomed incumbent.  In fact, by late September and early October Bush spent more time campaigning for Republican House and Senate candidates with Vice President Danforth Quayle making the token effort to campaign for the president.  There was much speculation that in the days leading up to the GOP convention, when Bush's approval ratings were much higher, that Bush was considering dropping Quayle from the ticket and nominate a more moderate Republican like Colin Powell or William Cohen.
Then one of the biggest blows came in October when Maine Senator William Cohen, a moderate Republican, came out and endorsed the Perot/Wilson ticket, going as far to say:

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"Maine Republican Senator William Cohen, though an advocate of free trade agreements, would shock many in the political world when he came out in support of the Perot/Wilson ticket on the 7th"-LA Times October 9th, 1992

Although Perot originally began the campaign putting an emphasis on protectionism, on advice of his runningmate he toned down the protectionist tone and focused more on what he called "responsible trade politics" that included "making government-sponsored trade agreements more transparent so that we know what we are getting out of them.  What are the living conditions of the people who make the goods that come into this country?  Are they being given decent wages that let them have affordable shelter, food, and clothing?  Is the government that this agreement being proposed to one that respects human rights and civil liberties?"  Vice Presidential runningmate and California Governor Pete Wilson best summarized the Perot/Wilson's stance on trade: "Our view on trade is not one of selfishness, closedmindedness, or nativism as suggested by some of our opponents.  Rather, it is anything but selfish, anything but closedminded, and it encourages other governments to better the living conditions and rights of their populace.  We do not want to encourage trade, rather we want to humanize the conditions of trade, to make trade the channel through which we can spread the American values of freedom and liberty to our trade partners."


"If we care to advance human rights in developing countries it is only logical that the promise of future beneficial trade be used to encourage them to trade openly and freely with us."-Independent Vice Presidential Candidate and California Governor Pete Wilson

Despite being way behind in the polls, President Bush agrees to hold a series of debates with Perot and Cuomo and Quayle agrees to hold a Vice Presidential debate with Gantt and Wilson.  It seems that the Bush/Quayle ticket, with nothing to lose, will try to see if it has a hidden Ace to get them out of this hole......
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« Reply #66 on: May 24, 2010, 10:32:09 AM »

Glad to see it back.
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Mechaman
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« Reply #67 on: May 24, 2010, 04:21:32 PM »

The 1992 Presidential Debates:



Democratic Presidential Candidate Mario Cuomo and company greeting President George HW Bush before the 1st Presidential Debate-Life Magazine November issue.

It had come time for the Presidential debates between the three candidates for president.  This time, an unprecedented three debates would be held between Bush, Cuomo, and Perot.  Althroughout the three debates the differing styles of the three men would be brought to the forefront of the public view.  Even after hours of speech prep, it seemed as though the President would carry a dead tone, as if he had already embraced the death of his political career at the hands of these two men.  Whatever hope in hell Bush had of pulling an upset victory in the words of Larry King were "shot to hell" after Bush made a series of infamous gaffes, the most infamous of which was when he started criticizing Ross Perot's 10 cent a year Gasoline tax that Perot claimed would eliminate the deficit which he was sharply rebuked by the crafty New York Governor Mario Cuomo during the "townhall debate":


Ross Perot outlining his economic program with the use of a chart during the debate on fiscal policy.

Bush: Mr. Perot, I do not believe that forcing suffering on the American people in the middle of a recession is the right thing to do.
Cuomo: Mr. President, not to bring in sharp rhetoric in this debate but considering that this economic recession happened on YOUR WATCH, what plans do you have to fix the economy?
Bush: I don't believe I was addressing you on this matter Governor, I was specifically addressing Mr. Perot who has come forward with this plan to tax the American taxpayer on gas......
Perot: Mr. President, I am quite surprised to hear you reluctant to tax gasoline.....after all your first tax increase proposal, which by the way went against your promise not to raise taxes, called for an increase in fuel taxes.  Now I'm not a real bright man, I've only built a multi-billion dollar business empire that is prospering during a recession (crowd laughs), but I do watch television and I notice things that politicians promise but can't deliver, and frankly that is what me and everyone else here is noticing here tonight with your inability to advocate clear concise policy statements and objectives on what you are going to do save this nation from going deeper into the economic hell it finds itself in or how you plan to get rid of the deficit which threatens the fabric of this nation.
Cuomo: Mr. Perot, I think Mr. President is right when he says that this plan of yours will hurt those who are not well off, those who can't afford high gasoline taxes.  Fixing the deficit is important, but so is the general welfare of the people.
Perot: WHich brings me to Exhibit B.  Governor, you have a way with words.  You strike me as the kind of boy who when he was younger would look himself in the mirror and continually say "I feel oh so pretty!" and you words wooed the fellow classmates into making you class president and then you later used your amazing oratory skills to jettison you from Mr. President of the First Grade to Mr. Governor of New York!  The ability to use big words and sound good while using them is very impressive (crowd laughs), but it pales next to results.  And your results as Governor is that of one who raises taxes to fund massive social projects that have gone nowhere.  New York state has one of the highest tax burdens in this country today, mostly due to the dreams of this man and others before him to create a giant welfare state on the backs of working men and women.  The Governor will tell you that he only wants to increase income taxes on those who can afford those taxes, but his record tells a much different story.  This man will raise your taxes, no iffs and buts about it.

Cuomo wouldn't do that much better than Bush, as many people watching the debate would get the impression that Cuomo was campaigning "for those who make less than $80,000 a year" and for focusing too much on the poor.  Also, Perot's use of graphs, charts, and quotes from the other two men that he gathered for the debate gave the audience the impression that he was very well researched on the issues facing the nation and had a truly independent view on how to solve them.  It seemed the worst nightmare of the Two Party System was coming true in the visage of Ross Perot, who dominated his opponents in 2 of the debates (Cuomo won the first debate).

However, the Vice Presidential Debate would prove to be quite different......
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« Reply #68 on: May 24, 2010, 09:53:34 PM »

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« Reply #69 on: May 25, 2010, 11:08:59 PM »

The Vice Presidential Debate


"North Carolina Democratic Senator Harvey Gantt, Democratic Vice Presidential nominee, stole the show at the debate against the more experienced Wilson and Quayle."-New York Times

The biggest surprise of the night was Senator Harvey Gantt stealing the debate victory from under Pete Wilson's nose.  Many political pundits and commentators predicted that the Independent Vice Presidential candidate would dominate the debate much like his runningmate had especially with his years of experience, but it would be the oratary of the Democratic VIce President, coupled with his extensive knowledge of his opponents' record to use against them in the debate.  Rush Limbaugh, a conservative commentator, would even go as far to say "Harvey Gantt is the best presidential election debator since Ronald Reagan."  Republican Vice President Dan Quayle found himself unable to compete at all with the points raised by either of his opponents, with many a debate watcher making comments like "why didn't Quayle just go home and bake a pa-ta-toe?"
The insurgent performance of Harvey Gantt in the VP debate would give a much needed boost in the polls to the Democratic ticket, which had suffered lately due to the presidential debates  With a few more weeks to go before the general election it seems that it would now be a race similar to 1912: a doing nothing incumbent admitting defeat by inactivity before the election is even over coupled with a strong third party candidacy as well as a revamped Democratic Party.  It seemed as though the role of the Vice Presidential candidate had become more vital in this election than it ever had in recent memory.........

Poll numbers November 1st, 1992:

Bush/Quayle: 21%
Cuomo/Gantt: 38%
Perot/Wilson: 41%
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« Reply #70 on: May 25, 2010, 11:22:09 PM »

The Election Prospects:

With the election just a few days away it had seemed that things were becoming a deadheat between the Democratic ticket and the Independent ticket of Perot/Wilson.  For the Perot/Wilson ticket had seemed that the 41% approval rating, though higher than either major party, wasn't high enough to ease the stress faced by the possibility of not getting a majority of the electoral vote.  In the last few days the Perot ticket would have to hit the swing states hard to hope to capture a majority of electoral votes, because in the case of a mere plurality with no majority the odds favored the Democratic ticket, as the Democrats held majorities in both the House and Senate and with only the possibility of help from moderate Republicans and Democrats, a token few at that, it seemed unlikely the odds would favor the independent ticket in that situation.
Cuomo and Gantt, on the other had, couldn't be more optimistic at the increased poll showing.  With their party in control of Congress all they needed was to deny the Perot/Wilson ticket a majority of the electoral vote and hope that Democratic loyalists in the House and Senate fall into place when it comes down to the vote.  Even with the token conservative Democratic opposition it seemed that the ticket had enough votes in Congress to assure that Cuomo and Gantt, barring a major miracle for Perot or even Bush, end up being elected in the case of the decision going to the House.
It was just a few days before election, and no one, not even the people running for president, had a clue of how it would all end.

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« Reply #71 on: May 25, 2010, 11:58:22 PM »

November 3, 1992: Election Day:

Election day had finally come, the months of vigorous campaigning done by the tickets running for president was finally going to come to fruition.  Question was: Would someone gain an electoral majority to be declared President and Vice President.  As exit polls throughout the night suggested it would be a very hotly contested battle between the Democratic ticket and that of Perot/Wilson althroughout the night as they duked it out over swing states.  At 11:30PM President Bush offered his concession speech, claiming that "he sees victory nowhere in sight."  Perot/Wilson and Cuomo/Gantt however, would all stay awake until the noon hour the next day awaiting the results of the last crucial state in the electoral matchup, Washington.  At 12:45, the state of Washington was finally called and the fate of the election:



Ross Perot (Independent-Texas)/Pete Wilson (Independent-California) 261 Electoral Votes 38.2% PV
Mario Cuomo (Democratic-New York)/Harvey Gantt (Democratic-North Carolina) 214 Electoral Votes 37.9% PV
George HW Bush (Republican-Texas)/Danforth Quayle (Republican-Indiana) 63 Electoral Votes 23.8% PV
Other=.1% PV

It had seemed that after months of proving that the impossible was possible, that a third party ticket could unseat the duopoly that the chances of a Perot presidency were grealy diminished as the final results came in.  With the vote going to Congress the odds seemed to favor the Democratic ticket.  It seemed as if though Perot would have to bring out those tough negotiation skills that made him such a successful businessman with Republicans and moderate Democrats if he hoped to see the Oval Office.
Could he somehow, against all odds, manage to win the election he rightfully won in the popular vote, or would he be denied by the Democratic majority?
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« Reply #72 on: May 27, 2010, 10:09:18 AM »
« Edited: May 27, 2010, 10:25:44 AM by David Lee Roth »

For the first time since 1824 a US presidential election had gone to Congress.  And just like that election, the balance of power would play a vital role in shaping who would ultimately become president.....and vice president.  Congress would take a three week recess to allow each candidate to appeal to Congress

The House Election:

 

With a sizable majority in the House, the odds seemed to naturally favor Mario Cuomo for the nomination of president.  However, with the election being decided by how each state votes and not by a majority of members, it was possible that Cuomo could somehow lose if or even for Bush, the absolute loser in the election, to win.  All that was needed for the victory was 26 states, no popular majority of Congressional members required at all.  Which meant that if someone won besides the winner of the popular vote and the electoral vote, Ross Perot, it is likely that they would face a huge wave of resentment from the American public.  However, without registration in either of the two parties that controlled almost all of Congress, it seemed that Perot's odds of winning the presidency were suddenly enormous.  It would ultimately end up being a battle between his business wits and the party loyalties of the members of Congress.  He had the American public behind him, and he needed to use them to his full advantage if he had a hope in hell of getting into office.
After seeing the election go to the House, George HW Bush suddenly saw a chance, although dim, to be re-elected as president.  There would be no doubt in his mind that if he managed to get re-elected he might become perhaps the most hated president of modern times, but four more years to get his agenda done was an opportunity he couldn't pass up.  However, with the support moderate Republicans had given Perot he would have to go the extra mile to try to get party loyalty on his side for the House Election.
Ever since he was a boy Mario Cuomo had dreamed of uniting the "Two Cities" of America.  When he first became the Lieutenant Governor of New York never did he think he would find himself at this stage.  And then at the 1984 Democratic National Convention, in front of thousands of fellow Democrats as he made his "Two Cities" Speech and heard the thousands and thousands in the audience go into applause, he felt then that his time would come eventually.  He thought his time would come in 1988, but then he felt he had a devotion to the people of New York to give them just a few more years as their governor to make things truly great before he dipped his beak into the possibility of presidency.  It wasn't until he witnessed the birth of his granddaughter Amanda that he finally felt it was truly his time to prepare for the inevitable run for president.  When he announced his intent to run early in 1991, with George Bush's approval ratings in the 90's, he was met with widespread skepticism, many had openly wondered if perhaps his time had come too late that the Reagan Legacy had destroyed any chance he had of becoming president.  Well as Bush's approval ratings went down and Ross Perot's insurgent candidacy proved, anything was possible.  However, it was exactly because of Ross Perot that his fight for the presidency would turn out to be one of the most hard fought electoral battles in US History.  How could he face the America people in January, if elected, knowing that he had lost the electoral and popular vote to who many would consider "the better man"?  The odds in the House clearly favored Cuomo or Bush, who had institutional party support and Cuomo knew that if either of them won it would take months for the American people to warm up to them.
The people already were resenting the two-party system, to grant Cuomo or Bush a victory would make Democracy look like a sham.  To the victor would go the toils.

The Senate Election:


Also of great interest was the Senate election for Vice President.  With 58 (thanks to a special election in California that seated newly elected Senator Dianne Feinstein) seats the odds seemed to naturally favor the Democratic Vice President Harvey Gantt.  However, quite a few of those Democratic senators were conservative "Blue Dog" senators who could go Perot.  Even some of the more moderate Democrats were of concern, who knew how members like Alan J. Dixon of Illinois or Tim Wirth (Gary Hart's successor in Colorado) would vote.  After the past decade or so mainstream support for liberalism had decreased to the point that many of the Democratic candidates for presidency were advocating moderate "reform" platforms, or even going as far as Jerry Brown and advocating a definite libertarian platform.  This latter group worried the Democratic leadership, as Perot's populism might've struck a cord with quite a few of those members to influence a vote for Perot in the Senate that could possibly deny Gantt the majority needed to be seated as Vice President.
The election by Senate method had never been done before, as the last election where no Presidential candidate reached a majority in 1824 Vice Presidential candidate John C. Calhoun had managed to gain a majority of the electoral vote to be elected Vice President.  Since then such situations have been avoided due to the electoral college awarding votes equally to presidential and vice presidential candidates.  It would be this same dillema that would enable this situation to happen for the first time in 1992 to decide who would end up being sworn in as Vice President in 1992.  Under the Twelfth Amendment to the United States Constitution, only the two candidates with the highest numbers of electoral votes would be eligible for the Senate Election where a majority of votes would determine who would become Vice President.
As per the Twelfth, that means that the Senate election would be between Democratic Vice Presidential nominee Harvey Gantt and Independent Vice Presidential nominee Pete Wilson.  Although the Senate numbers favored the Democrat, with possible conservative and moderate Dem votes for Perot coupled with Republican votes, it was possible that Pete Wilson could become the first Independent to be elected Vice President.  Conventional wisdom at the time suggested that due to Pete Wilson's status as the Republican Governor of Calfornia that securing Republican votes in the absence of Dan Quayle would be easy against the more liberal Democrat Harvey Gantt.  However, despite the "liberal" label Gantt had a lot of cross party appeal to Republicans just like Wilson had with some Democrats.  With only 42 seats (with a few that could go for Gantt), the Republican advantage would not be enough for Wilson to win a majority.  Therefore, both men of moderate appeal would have a hell of a time getting votes.

Depending on how long it took for the matter to come to a vote, if the vote comes after the Inauguration of new Congressmen the GOP would gain an additional 9 House members that could change the composition of the vote.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
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« Reply #73 on: May 27, 2010, 10:24:25 AM »

Epic. It would be really hillarious to see humiliated loser Bush to win in House.
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Vazdul (Formerly Chairman of the Communist Party of Ontario)
Vazdul
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« Reply #74 on: May 27, 2010, 12:37:11 PM »

Why did I think that if the election went to the house that the candidate in last place in a three way race was dropped from consideration?

An excerpt from the 12th Amendment:

The person having the greatest Number of votes for President, shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed; and if no person have such majority, then from the persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President. But in choosing the President, the votes shall be taken by states, the representation from each state having one vote; a quorum for this purpose shall consist of a member or members from two-thirds of the states, and a majority of all the states shall be necessary to a choice. And if the House of Representatives shall not choose a President whenever the right of choice shall devolve upon them, before the fourth day of March next following, then the Vice-President shall act as President, as in the case of the death or other constitutional disability of the President.

I think Bush and Gantt should win. That would make for some very interesting developments later on.
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