Lloyd Bensten vs. Bush Sr. 1988, with a twist

[Bo]

Reagan invades Libya in 1986 after their govt. refuses to stop sponsoring terrorism against American citizens. After the Libyan govt. is toppled, an insurgency takes place. The insurgents hope to kcik the U.S. out of Libya, and the U.S. army and govt. isn't very successful at fighting him and thus suffers thousands of casualties. The war in Libya is still occuring in 1988. The Democrats nomiante Lloyd Bensten in 1988, who promises to end the war in Libya. The GOp still nomiantes Bush Sr. as in RL. The economy is about the same as in RL, but the U.S.'s inernatioanl reputation is badly damaged by the war in Libya. Who would win? You pick the VPs. Discuss, with maps.

[Derek]

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That's a very sad and unfortunate situation. With Reagan in office we would've been respected highly throughout the world. Notice how he stopped things from happening without going to war as was the case with the Berlin Wall. Reagan and Bush Sr. may have very well had the best foreign policies of all time. Each administration has gotten worse since.

[WillK]

With Reagan in office we would've been respected highly throughout the world.

Not necessarily. 

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What the heck are you talking about?

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Hard to get much worse than Reagan's bumbling in Lebanon.  Also, unlike you, I don't think selling weapons to Iran in an effort to cut a deal with terrorists was the best foreign policy of all time. 

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

[Bo]

EV, please?

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

EV, please?

319-219

Since I know you'll ask

53%-46%

[Derek]

With Reagan in office we would've been respected highly throughout the world.

Not necessarily. 

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What the heck are you talking about?

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Hard to get much worse than Reagan's bumbling in Lebanon.  Also, unlike you, I don't think selling weapons to Iran in an effort to cut a deal with terrorists was the best foreign policy of all time. 

That deal with Iran was the best decision he could've made. It allowed us to track where the weapons went and Iran wasn't our enemy yet. That's like saying "ooh they're going to use the weapons that we sold them." Right it's our fault for everything. Same as taking the side of Afghanistan over Russia in that war. Do you honestly think he was stupid enough to just sell weapons to an enemy or threat? Come on. What am I talking about? Ronald Reagan was well respected around the world and it would've been seen as a man meaning what he said and saying what he means. He came off as much more competent and in control than Bush did. And we were respected more around the world and by saying not necessarily you're simply just trying to carry on an argument for the sake of arguing. Nice try though.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Even without Libya, Bentsen would have won easily. Libya gives him a landslide.

Bentsen : 55%, 401 EVs
Bush : 44%, 137 EVs

[Mechaman]

Even without Libya, Bentsen would have won easily. Libya gives him a landslide.

Bentsen : 55%, 401 EVs
Bush : 44%, 137 EVs

I actually think this is fairly accurate.
People often times forget that in summer 1988 Micheal Dukakis had a double digit lead over Bush which he eventually blew into a landslide loss.  I doubt Lloyd Bentsen would've made the same mistakes that Dukakis made (like claiming he was a proud card carrying ACLU member, which in 1988 would be pretty f***ing stupid).  With Reagan's reputation a bit damaged I see any effects of Reagan campaigning (which might be likely) as more of a burden than a plus in this scenario.  So yes, I agree here, Bentsen wins in a landslide.

[WillK]

That deal with Iran was the best decision he could've made.

Are you kidding me???  As Barry Goldwater said, it was "the god-damned stupidest foreign policy blunder this country's ever made."

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Oh yes it was.  Ever heard of the hostage crisis?

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Yes I do, because that is exactly what he did.

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Not really.  He was respected in some places by some people (Thatcher for example); but in other parts he was not well respected -- western europeans thought he was either crazy or senile or both. 

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I remember it being the other way around. 

[Derek]

That deal with Iran was the best decision he could've made.

Are you kidding me???  As Barry Goldwater said, it was "the god-damned stupidest foreign policy blunder this country's ever made."

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Oh yes it was.  Ever heard of the hostage crisis?

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Yes I do, because that is exactly what he did.

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Not really.  He was respected in some places by some people (Thatcher for example); but in other parts he was not well respected -- western europeans thought he was either crazy or senile or both. 

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I remember it being the other way around. 

Of course they thought he was crazy in Europe because they're socialists. I was referring to Bush Jr. not Bush Sr. The hostage crisis was over.

[Derek]

I am convinced I'm the only person on this thread who isn't a recording of the democrat playbook. Bensten would've done better than Dukakis obviously but the GOP coattails from Reagan were too strong.

[President Mitt]

I am convinced I'm the only person on this thread who isn't a recording of the democrat playbook.

Not true. The only Democrat supporters I could see in this thread are you and Dallasfan. Rochambeau, Willk, and Antonio would probably be in the PTP, and Mechaman...

...

...

probably a very reluctant member of the SAP.

[Derek]

I am convinced I'm the only person on this thread who isn't a recording of the democrat playbook.

Not true. The only Democrat supporters I could see in this thread are you and Dallasfan. Rochambeau, Willk, and Antonio would probably be in the PTP, and Mechaman...

...

...

probably a very reluctant member of the SAP.

What?

[Bo]

I am convinced I'm the only person on this thread who isn't a recording of the democrat playbook.

Not true. The only Democrat supporters I could see in this thread are you and Dallasfan. Rochambeau, Willk, and Antonio would probably be in the PTP, and Mechaman...

...

...

probably a very reluctant member of the SAP.

What?

He was proving you wrong.

[Derek]

I am convinced I'm the only person on this thread who isn't a recording of the democrat playbook.

Not true. The only Democrat supporters I could see in this thread are you and Dallasfan. Rochambeau, Willk, and Antonio would probably be in the PTP, and Mechaman...

...

...

probably a very reluctant member of the SAP.

What?

He was proving you wrong.

What do all those stand for?

[President Mitt]

Well you wrongly inferred that everbody in this thread was a recording of the Thailand Centre-Right Democrat Party.

[Ameriplan]

Well you wrongly inferred that everbody in this thread was a recording of the Thailand Centre-Right Democrat Party.

I don't think Abdullah Bin Abdulaziz Bin Abdulrahman Bin Faisal Bin Turki Bin Abdullah Bin Muhammad Bin Saud would appreciate that.