Heath Shuler (D-NC) to challenge Nancy Pelosi

[Landslide Lyndon]

Best wishes to Pelosi. She has a proven record of creating jobs for Republican lawmakers, and deserves to stay on as the Democratic leader in the House.

You mean like the jobs she created in 2006 and 2008?

Could Shuler bolt parties if (when) Pelosi wins?  Could he win re-election as a Republican in that district?

I think (1)  he might and (2) he could.

He is so dumb, he might try it. Parker Griffith will need some company after all.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Best wishes to Pelosi. She has a proven record of creating jobs for Republican lawmakers, and deserves to stay on as the Democratic leader in the House.

You mean like the jobs she created in 2006 and 2008?

Very few people knew or cared about her then. Bush created those jobs for the Dems. After four years of her in control, we've more than made up for those losses. 

Very few people know or care about her now.

That.
Like Bush these years, Obama was the main factor for the Republican landslide.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Best wishes to Pelosi. She has a proven record of creating jobs for Republican lawmakers, and deserves to stay on as the Democratic leader in the House.

You mean like the jobs she created in 2006 and 2008?

Very few people knew or cared about her then. Bush created those jobs for the Dems. After four years of her in control, we've more than made up for those losses. 

Very few people know or care about her now.

But her actions as Speaker helped the GOP.

If by that you mean that she successfully passed a big part of the Democrat's agenda on which they campaigned in 2008, then she is guilty as charged.

[Landslide Lyndon]

If by that you mean that she successfully passed a big part of the Democrat's agenda on which they campaigned in 2008, then she is guilty as charged.

That was unpopular with the public and helped lead to massive Republican gains, yes.

Please, let's spare each other of the talking points. The topic is Pelosi as an electoral liability.

The agenda wasn't unpopular per se. It just became a proxy for voters to express their frustrations about the economy. How can the same agenda be popular two years ago and now it's not?

And I dispute the fact that Pelosi is a liability. We heard the same drivel in '06 and '08.
She, like all Democrats, are unpopular because of the economy, not because she is a "San Francisco Librul!".

[Landslide Lyndon]

If Phil's referring to health care reform, it's not exactly unpopular. It's at about 50/50 in the polls now.

50/50? I doubt that.

The CNN poll showed 47/48 split between the "retain and expand" and "repeal" options.

[Landslide Lyndon]

If Phil's referring to health care reform, it's not exactly unpopular. It's at about 50/50 in the polls now.

50/50? I doubt that.

The CNN poll showed 47/48 split between the "retain and expand" and "repeal" options.

That's not necessarily opposing it though. Those favoring a total repeal have always been fewer in numbers than those opposing it.

Whatever the case, I don't think you can honestly tell me that passing that legislation helped Pelosi and the Dems from an electoral standpoint this year.

Medicare and Medicaid were also unpopular when passed.
Pelosi and the Democrats did what they thought was right, not electorally advantageous.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Medicare and Medicaid were also unpopular when passed.
Pelosi and the Democrats did what they thought was right, not electorally advantageous.

I know you don't want to concede a single point to me but, again, this isn't time for party talking points. We're discussing Pelosi and the agenda as an electoral liability. The "what is right" debate is for another time and place and you know it.

What I said isn't a talking point, it's the historical reality. Look up what happened at the 1966 midterms.

And I forgot to tell you before that your comparison of HCR with the Iraq War is ridiculous.
Bush didn't campaign on waging war with Iraq .
And HCR hasn't been enacted yet, so it's impossible to know if the voters don't like it. They don't like what they hear (Socialized Medicine!, Death Panels!) but most of them don't have a clue about the actual provisions of the bill.

[Landslide Lyndon]

What I said isn't a talking point, it's the historical reality. Look up what happened at the 1966 midterms.

It's a talking point because we're discussing its electoral impact and you're refusing to admit that it's unpopular.

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You told me it can't be unpopular because it was a popular proposal two years ago. I'm saying that people sometimes change their minds when they find out more about an issue. It doesn't matter if Bush didn't campaign on waging a war with Iraq (which he actually did in 2002 and it's hilarious that you aren't familiar with that or maybe just conveniently forgot). That has nothing to do with my point. The point remains that a policy can be popular at one point and unpopular as debate continues and circumstances change.

1)We presented you with a poll that shows the electorate being split on HCR. It's neither popular or unpopular. Most people admit that they don't really know what's in the bill.
 
2)Bush didn't campaign on war, he was saying to the last minute that it was a last resort (of course we now know he was lying).
The policy wasn't unpopular. What changed from 2008 is that Democrats were in power and blamed for the economy, the sausage making of the bill was very public and dragged on forever, and that millions of dollars were poured by the insurance companies to defeat the bill.

[Landslide Lyndon]

The GOP really should more concerned with their own leadership in the House, which doesn't seem all that great.

Yet that apparently doesn't matter...

It will matter when they launch the "hundreds of investigations" that people like Issa threaten to do, instead of working to improve the economy.

[Landslide Lyndon]

The GOP really should more concerned with their own leadership in the House, which doesn't seem all that great.

Yet that apparently doesn't matter...

It will matter when they launch the "hundreds of investigations" that people like Issa threaten to do, instead of working to improve the economy.

Too bad you're in Greece. Otherwise, I'd seriously suggest a job in the DNC communications office. 

You don't have to be communications expert to simply recite the news.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/atlantic/20101109/cm_atlantic/hundredsofinvestigationsofobamaadministrationonthehorizon5710

Rep. Darrell Issa can barely conceal his excitement at the thought of the hundreds of investigations into the Obama administration he'll oversee as the new chair of the House oversight committee. Issa wants his seven subcommittees to work at a pace of one or two hearings a week--meaning "seven hearings a week, times 40 weeks," the congressman told Politico's Jake Sherman and Richard E. Cohen.

It's a rate almost triple that of Rep. Henry Waxman when the Democrat was digging into the Bush administration. (Waxman held 203 hearings over two years, Issa is gunning for 280 in the next year.) "As Clint Eastwood says, a man needs to know his limitations," Issa said. The California Republican says his committee's job is to "measure failures," though "oversight should be done with a balance for the American people and not as a gotcha." Issa's already called Vice President Joe Biden about oversight of the stimulus. (Whether any of these potential mini-scandals will become fodder for impeachment of the president remains hotly debated.)

[Landslide Lyndon]

Nancy Pelosi's decision as Speaker played no role in the Dems' loss but Darrell Issa's threats of investigation, which likely won't go anywhere, will make the GOP leadership very well known and hated. Give me a break, dude.

1)How are you so sure they won't go anywhere?

2)Tell that to Speaker Gingrich. We know after all how much the Clinton impeachment helped him during the 1998 midterms.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Nancy Pelosi's decision as Speaker played no role in the Dems' loss but Darrell Issa's threats of investigation, which likely won't go anywhere, will make the GOP leadership very well known and hated. Give me a break, dude.

1)How are you so sure they won't go anywhere?

I said they likely won't go anywhere. I said that because the leadership seems pretty focused on certain issues. There's a reason why Issa is basically the only high ranking official talking about this.

Well, from what I read Boehner has no intention to stop Issa.
And remember that a LOT of the newly elected members are crazies who think that Obama is an illegitimate Manchurian candidate. Do you think they will suddenly behave because the "establishment" tells them so?

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And assuming Issa gets his way, how can you say for sure that it will end up the same way? Two can play at your silly game, px.

Uhhh... Because all those "scandals" he wants to investigate are nonexistent (or frivolous at best)?

[Landslide Lyndon]

Their main objective is to make Obama a one-term President.

Not exactly an unpopular idea with the American electorate right now.

The investigation threats are overblown.

Yeah, 45% approval rating in the midst of the worst financial crisis since the 30's is obviously awful. Maybe the guy should ask W. to give him lessons how to become popular.

BTW, ain't it funny that Republicans suddenly rediscovered how important is congressional oversight? It seems that the amnesia from which they suffered during the Bush years is finally cured.
It reminds me of how they also suddenly rediscovered fiscal conservatism after Obama was elected. 

I would rather have an investigative committee waisting money and doing its job, then doing nothing except being a fixture while a bunch of cowboys in the executive branch rob us blind. Its really a question of priorities.

Of course. Obama's birth certificate and the "Global Warming Hoax" are more important than anything else.

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Not necessarily. The Clintons where exonerated for Whitewater and Foster's death, yet the Republicans just wouldn't let the matter go.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Yeah, 45% approval rating in the midst of the worst financial crisis since the 30's is obviously awful. Maybe the guy should ask W. to give him lessons how to become popular.

Loving that spin.

Yeah, it comes straight from the mouth of notorious Democratic spinmeister David Frum.
You know, the one that penned that notorious Dem slogan about the "Axis of Evil".