Is Obama the first President to be supported by the counter-culture?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Pretty much, yeah.

I wonder if John Kerry would've achieved the same status or if he would've simply been abandoned as nothing more than a means to remove Bush.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

Obama is not supported by any real counter-culture. He is only supported by the corporate-contrived fake "counter-culture".

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Obama is not supported by any real counter-culture. He is only supported by the corporate-contrived fake "counter-culture".

Uh, go to any punk/hardcore/indie/emo show with bands not on corporate labels and Obama's approval rating will be far higher than it is nationwide. Dudefest is hardly corporate-controlled and that was undoubtedly true there.

[Joe Republic]

What's left of the original counter-culture either abandoned the Democratic Party long ago, or considers Obama a failure already.  The newer generation's counter-culture isn't all that political, and any professed support for Obama likely stems from the fact that he's meant to be an improvement on Bush; the only other president they really know.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

The newer generation's counter-culture isn't all that political

If that's true why were we all big on voter drives and all that for Obama in 2008? And for Democrats in 2010 too actually. One of the DFL field directors I worked with this election season I have frequently seen at shows at the biggest scene venue in Minneapolis.

[Joe Republic]

My answer to that question is contained in the latter part of the sentence that you omitted.  It may be cool to support Obama, in much the same way it's cool to wear Che Guevara t-shirts (or at least it used to be).  But ask any average drunk kid at one of your ridiculous shows what they actually stand/stood for, and they won't have a clue.  "Um... end the war!... uh... right-wingers suck!... uhhh......"

[dead0man]

This may have been true before he got elected.

[memphis]

Depends how you define counter-culture. FDR, JFK, and Clinton probably each had a good following among some modernist/hipster types.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

What was called 'Counter-Culture' is the norm today. The new emerging 'Counter-Culture' today, in West as a whole I'd say, in the same way the former 'Counter-Culture concerned West as a whole, would be the kind that fears to be trodden on.

For a long time I see it like 'Obama is the last blow of the 90s' the last 'happy and peaceful eruption' after the hostile 2000s and before the 2010s which could be like the 2000s in worse (yay! optimism!). Seeing the 90s as the finality of the former Counter-Culture, in that sense, I don't know if it's the 1st, but yeah he comes from there.

[LBJ Revivalist]

What was called 'Counter-Culture' is the norm today. The new emerging 'Counter-Culture' today, in West as a whole I'd say, in the same way the former 'Counter-Culture concerned West as a whole, would be the kind that fears to be trodden on.

For a long time I see it like 'Obama is the last blow of the 90s' the last 'happy and peaceful eruption' after the hostile 2000s and before the 2010s which could be like the 2000s in worse (yay! optimism!). Seeing the 90s as the finality of the former Counter-Culture, in that sense, I don't know if it's the 1st, but yeah he comes from there.

Why do you think Obama is the 'last blow of the '90s'?

And wasn't Clinton loved by the counter-culture? Or was he just loved by his fellow Baby Boomers? Clinton, both now and then, seems to be part celebrity, part President. I mean he cameoed in a Disney movie while he was President in '96; He commented on the death of Jerry Garcia; He seems to have been involved in someway with the counterculture.

I don't think the 1990s is the finality of the former Counter Culture; The '90s was the beginning of our culture now--A mixture of excess, rap, rock, sexuality, etc. The era where the Counter Culture became normalized. The 80s IMO were the decade where the Counter Cultural spirit was repressed, dressed in a suit and replaced by plastic rebellion (think Hair Metal and the like and the Hippies turned Yuppies).

The 90's, in a sense, were a 'Re-Birth' of a real Counter-Culture, but that culture became a norm rather than something controversial as it was in the 50s, 60s and 70s.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

And wasn't Clinton loved by the counter-culture? Or was he just loved by his fellow Baby Boomers? Clinton, both now and then, seems to be part celebrity, part President. I mean he cameoed in a Disney movie while he was President in '96; He commented on the death of Jerry Garcia; He seems to have been involved in someway with the counterculture.

About Clinton, yes, you might be right, but as I said I don't really care whether Obama is the 1st or not personally, was making a comment beyond that.

I don't think the 1990s is the finality of the former Counter Culture; The '90s was the beginning of our culture now--A mixture of excess, rap, rock, sexuality, etc. The era where the Counter Culture became normalized. The 80s IMO were the decade where the Counter Cultural spirit was repressed, dressed in a suit and replaced by plastic rebellion (think Hair Metal and the like and the Hippies turned Yuppies).

The 90's, in a sense, were a 'Re-Birth' of a real Counter-Culture, but that culture became a norm rather than something controversial as it was in the 50s, 60s and 70s.

The bolded part is what I meant by finality, it is the most that the former Counter-Culture could have given, it is when it fully became the norm (and yeah, Clinton would kinda embody that). What you call plastic rebellion for me is just the continuation of the former rebellion and the expansion and popularization of it to the mainstream, to the point that in the 90s the spirit of it (that is multi-culturalism, altruism, feminism, pacifism) became the popular intellectual norm.

That became the norm and the model, the only things being that it resulted in some growth of individualism, but individualism was one of the bases of the spirit of the former Counter-Culture, since it was a big call for more personal freedom. And then this individualism was a perfect, and logical, way for a market economy to develop itself since it's based on personal property and on personal consumption of goods and services, then here the will of freedom found a concrete and efficient way to develop itself. Way to sum it.

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I disagree, as I said, I think it was the top of the former counter-culture, when its spirit became the institution and the mainstream. 90s weren't about excesses, 90s were about 'being kind and consensual, loving everybody around the world', and rock was rather cute then (U2), except in grunge, which can be seen as a 'fin de règne' of the spirit of rock and maybe of the spirit of rock and punk together. And rap was then the way for a part of cultures of Western societies to claim for existence. And sexuality wasn't all over, for the mainstream it remained something rather liberal but it still kept a good tie with romantic love.

What you describe, excesses, is the 2000s. 90s finished with that consensual World Party that was the Millennium Fest, a nice consensual Global Firework. 2000s began with an other Global Fire, the biggest and most spectacular terror attack never seen which was live on Global TV. Beginning of hostility, followed by 2 wars from the US which passed from a more or less consensual status of fancy country for the mainstream, to an over aggressive and excessive power. And, in the same time officialized hostility between big cultural streams of the world (religious tensions). Still in term of excesses and hostility, about music, 2000s are when, in term of rock, more radical stuffs such as neo-punk-rock and all sorts of metal became more and more mainstream too, while before punk had never been mainstream. Rap listened by the mainstream passed more and more from something that wanted to embody a new alternative culture in the 80s-90s to something more and more filled with aggressiveness and more and more gangsta oriented in 2000s. And, in 2000s, sexuality became more and more something tied to performance, something more and more blatantly, openly, and provocatively present in the public area (marketing/media), and far less tied to romantic love, or to spiritual feeling, or to personal development, oppositely to precedent decades. Also you can speak of humor, humor about humiliation of other people as grown in the last decade, violent games as well, those things became psychologically trendy then more and more mainstream, nothing to do anymore with the cute consensual spirit of the 90s.

And then, from all these excesses which would be the mark of the decline and end of the former Counter-Culture, the new Counter-Culture arrives to 'tidy the mess', blames the former C-C for all of it, and then takes a new turn in consequences, and here we are with a retractation concerning multi-culturalism, a growth of mistrust, a back to conservative values, a bigger importance of authority and toughness as opposed to a neat personal development by a lot of personal freedom, force over intellectualism, stuffs like that. That's the new C-C we would just be beginning to experiment...

90s would have been the top of the former C-C. 2000s its decline, and the beginning of an opposed one. 2010s would be the confirmation of this last trend.

Though, I would think and hope that besides that new tough and shut C-C, and after it eventually takes over, something would balance it again, this shut episode wouldn't be so long, but could possibly become the foreground during a few decades. Anyhow, I would think and hope something, which would in part be from the heritage of the former C-C, would develop itself, but here with a perspective of common construction, while the former C-C mainly had a perspective of destruction of what the common society was, and mainly focused on personal construction. A destruction which was necessary to build something else, but in between, when all is seen as destruct without a new perspective of common construction, people feel panicked, then go conservative, something rather logical.

Well, here is at least for my personal point of view on those things.

And, anyways, yeah, in that sense Obama, full of altruism, multiculturalism and pacifism, embodies a 'last blow from the 90s'.

[tpfkaw]

You could call it the "9/11 effect" - today's youth were traumatized into mindlessly supporting authority figures (even if they don't realize it).  Something very similar happened with the "greatest generation" and Pearl Harbor.

[angus]

No.

Millard Fillmore probably holds that title.  And if you don't like him, there would be several others ranging from Franklin Pierce ("doughfaces" would have been the counterculture of his time) through Clinton (intellectual hillbillies were almost certainly the counterculture of his time), and there were many in between them.  Obama is not the first counterculture-supported President by any stretch.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

This may have been true before he got elected.

It's still true today. As stated before, at a punk show Obama would have higher approvals than nationwide. Most people in the scene, even if not entirely happy with him still generally support him, supported the Democrats in 2010 and are strongly against the Tea Party.

You could call it the "9/11 effect" - today's youth were traumatized into mindlessly supporting authority figures (even if they don't realize it).  Something very similar happened with the "greatest generation" and Pearl Harbor.

Oh yes, because most counter-culture people loved Bush so much.

[RIP Robert H Bork]

No, Bill Clinton.

[tpfkaw]

Young people hate Bush because people on television told them that they were supposed to, not because they came up with that brilliant idea on their own.  (Hence why Bush-clone Obama continues to receive such high approval among Gen Y).  Indeed, most are incredibly facile in their political knowledge.  Today I was talking to someone, who is not a stupid person (in fact, he's a very intelligent and knowledgeable computer science major), and for whatever reason the discussion turned to farm subsidies.  My partner in conversation accused me of wanting farms to fail due to my opposition.  I merely pointed out that the proliferation of high-fructose corn syrup in foods is largely due to subsidies (and was backed up by another friend, who agreed with me), which was on it's own enough to persuade him to my position.  He hadn't actually studied this issue or very many others before - merely being outnumbered by his peers on the issue could cause him to change his mind.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Undoubtedly, yes. His approvals might not be so high among them now but I'd bet that they support his presidency by much higher margins than Clinton, Carter or LBJ. Go to any place with a lower income, artsy populace and they will remain enthusiastic about Obama compared to any president in modern times.

Clinton was disliked by the counter-culture. Remember that Nader did well as a spoiler candidate in many of the places known for the "counter-culture". 

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Carter is actually pretty popular with that crowd now, though he probably wasn't so much while he was in office.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Carter is actually pretty popular with that crowd now, though he probably wasn't so much while he was in office.

Being way ahead of his time on energy policy and consumerism helps. Did you see his interview with Jon Stewart?

[Dgov]

Depends how you define counter-culture. FDR, JFK, and Clinton probably each had a good following among some modernist/hipster types.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

Counter-Culture should be capitalized here, since what you refer to as "counter-culture" is not actually counter-culture in the literal sense anymore.

Anyone who supports Obama is not truly counter-culture.

[Joe Republic]

Anyone who supports Obama is not truly counter-culture.

The same is true of any president.  The idea of supporting the head of state/government/Establishment/The Man is pretty much diametrically opposed to the whole concept of 'counter-culture'.

[k-onmmunist]

Dudefest isn't the entire American counterculture you know.

[Boris]

I don't get why someone in the "counter-culture" would give two sh**ts about someone like Barack Obama....He's a total nonfactor in everything

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Anyone who supports Obama is not truly counter-culture.

The same is true of any president.  The idea of supporting the head of state/government/Establishment/The Man is pretty much diametrically opposed to the whole concept of 'counter-culture'.

Not if that president supported their goals in running counter towards the popular political culture of the time, shared their values and believed in some of their ideas. Obama has done none of these things but they could support him because they feel he wants to accomplish their goals and is better than the opposition.

The counter-culture of the 60s would have supported a President McCarthy or President McGovern. Why would they cease to be a counter-culture because of this?