First "real" Republican/Democrat presidents

[A18]

What were the first presidents from each party to reflect what the party is like today?

[J. J.]

Reagan for the Republicans.

FDR for the Democrats.

The conservative wing of the GOP didn't assend until 1980.

[Cashcow]

FDR? Are you kidding?

To be honest, I'd say Truman.

[A18]

Why not FDR?

[Ben.]

FDR? Are you kidding?

To be honest, I'd say Truman.

Truman was too Hawkish, Carter, But the Party seems to be likely to drift back in the Truman direction with the changing times... just as it drifted in the Carter direction in the late 1960's all party's drift to the left and then the right again.

[A18]

I'm seriously very interested in hearing your thoughts on why FDR doesn't reflect the modern Democratic party.

[Gustaf]

For Republicans I guess Reagan, possibly Nixon. For Democrats I'd say FDR, maybe even Wilson but that'd be a stretch. I would say that the modern parties were decided when the Republican convention of 1912 chose Taft over Roosvelt, thus eventually wiping out the Progressive brand of Republicans. With FDR and his reforms the Democrats as the left and Republicans as the right, on economy, had been established. The next change comes with the realignment of the South. The rest is more extrapolating than anything else.

[Gustaf]

On these maps, all states have been shifted to correspond to a national PV-tie. So blue states were more Republican than the national average and vice versa. I count the Southern 3rd parties as Republican, as they were gonna become that eventually. For 1968 I gave almost all of Wallace's votes to Nixon but let the states were Humphrey was close to 50% remain in his column.

1960



1964




1968

[12th Doctor]

FDR? Are you kidding?

To be honest, I'd say Truman.

Are you kidding?

The modern Democratic Party is pratically the antithisis of everything Truman stood for.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Truman was practically economically socialist by today's standards, and he won the 1948 election by playing up class warfare, accusing Dewey of being the candidate of the wealthy and elite (which is actually not true, Dewey was a liberal Republican, but it's still how he campaigned). He was far more populist than today's Dem party.

[12th Doctor]

Truman was practically economically socialist by today's standards, and he won the 1948 election by playing up class warfare, accusing Dewey of being the candidate of the wealthy and elite (which is actually not true, Dewey was a liberal Republican, but it's still how he campaigned). He was far more populist than today's Dem party.

When Truman said it, it was still true.

Although, all thgis became irrelevant by the 60's.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I have no clue what that means.

Regardless, that is far from the antithesis of today's Democratic party, unless you mean it has moved too far to the right economically, which I agree with.

[A18]

I also think the Democratic party has moved too far to the right economically. They should campaign on a socialist platform every election, complete with a massive tax increase and new government department.

[12th Doctor]

I have no clue what that means.

Regardless, that is far from the antithesis of today's Democratic party, unless you mean it has moved too far to the right economically, which I agree with.

What I meant is that there was still some undue exploitation of the working class by the wealthy.  Though, by the 60's, that belief became outdated.

Anyway, the Democratic party no longer cares about the working class.  They have become the party of the perpetually unemployed and the wealthy elite.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

how was he the antithesis then?

That means he'd be the equivalent of Jesse Helms today. Yeah right!

[12th Doctor]

how was he the antithesis then?

That means he'd be the equivalent of Jesse Helms today. Yeah right!

Did you even read my post?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

yes, and it's wrong. The wealth gap is greater today than in the 60s.

Aside from that, you said he was the antithesis. That would make him exactly like Jesse Helms. That's a very tough claim to prove.

Also using this logic you could argue Eugene Debs would be a right winger today.

[12th Doctor]

yes, and it's wrong. The wealth gap is greater today than in the 60s.

Aside from that, you said he was the antithesis. That would make him exactly like Jesse Helms. That's a very tough claim to prove.

Also using this logic you could argue Eugene Debs would be a right winger today.

Regardless of what class you are in, the standard of living has greatly increased since the turn of the 20th century.  Throughout the 50's, 60's and 70's, the Unions enjoyed more political power than, well, pretty much any other organization in the world and their corruption was totally unchallenged.

Did I ever say that Truman was a "right-winger"?  I don't recall saying that.  I just said that in acctuallity, the Democrats represent an outfit that Truman would fail to recongnize as his party today.

And acctually, Jesse Helms probably does more nearly represent Truman than Kerry.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

ha ha that's funny. Especially since Dewey was closer to Kerry than Jesse Helms, proving the shift has been to right, not left.

Well you're basically saying Truman was unhappy with the conditions of the working class at his time, but you're sure he would be today, so he'd hate the Democrats. Then I could say Eugene Debs was unhappy about it but only because of his time, he'd be satisfied today. That's a big leap of assumption.

[12th Doctor]

ha ha that's funny. Especially since Dewey was closer to Kerry than Jesse Helms, proving the shift has been to right, not left.

Well you're basically saying Truman was unhappy with the conditions of the working class at his time, but you're sure he would be today, so he'd hate the Democrats. Then I could say Eugene Debs was unhappy about it but only because of his time, he'd be satisfied today. That's a big leap of assumption.

No, that is not what I am saying at all.  I'm saying the the modern Democrats don't care about the issues Truman cared about.

[A18]

I'm still left wondering what Cashcow meant.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I'm saying the the modern Democrats don't care about the issues Truman cared about.

I would argue that most Democrats do but that a vocal and somewhat mindless minority of idiots who really belong in another party don't.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I'll agree that FDR is a better example than Truman.

For Republicans, I'd say McKinley, although his VP definately wouldn't be a Republican today.

[12th Doctor]

I'll agree that FDR is a better example than Truman.

For Republicans, I'd say McKinley, although his VP definately wouldn't be a Republican today.

I know you didn't mean it as a compliment, but McKinley was a good man, so I will take it as one.

[A18]

What does McKinley have in common with the modern Republicans?

Roosevelt doesn't strike me as a peacenik anti-gun nut.