Kaiser Wilhelm I assassinated in 1878, Frederick III elevated to the throne?
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  Kaiser Wilhelm I assassinated in 1878, Frederick III elevated to the throne?
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Author Topic: Kaiser Wilhelm I assassinated in 1878, Frederick III elevated to the throne?  (Read 3945 times)
Psychic Octopus
Junior Chimp
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« on: December 30, 2010, 08:22:55 PM »

In 1878, Kaiser Wilhelm I was the victim of two assassination attempts, but survived both, coming off the second one wounded. Let's suppose that he is killed on one of the two occasions. The more liberal-minded Frederick III would be elevated to the throne in the midst of great tragedy. How does this impact Germany and the world?
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J. J.
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« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2010, 09:05:57 PM »

In 1878, Kaiser Wilhelm I was the victim of two assassination attempts, but survived both, coming off the second one wounded. Let's suppose that he is killed on one of the two occasions. The more liberal-minded Frederick III would be elevated to the throne in the midst of great tragedy. How does this impact Germany and the world?


From what I've read, Frederick would have ceded foreign affairs to Bismarck.  He also promised Bismarck not to interfere with the Chancellorship structure.

At best, Frederick might have supported stronger ties with Russia and that might have survived Wilhelm II.
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tnowacki
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« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2010, 06:45:14 AM »

Well, in that 10 years Friedrich III would have had, he would have strengthened ties with Russia and Austria. And Bismarck would have gained an position from which Wilhelm II were not able to remove him. Unfortunately. Tongue
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J. J.
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« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2010, 03:46:03 PM »

Well, in that 10 years Friedrich III would have had, he would have strengthened ties with Russia and Austria. And Bismarck would have gained an position from which Wilhelm II were not able to remove him. Unfortunately. Tongue

Bismarck, post 1872, wanted nothing but peace and was not interested in a colonial empire. 

Without some constitutional reform, Wilhelm II always had the power to remove Bismarck.  Neither Frederick nor Bismarck wanted that changed.

The great "what if" would have been if Frederick would have ruled for another 15-20 years and died in his mid 70's, maybe around 1905.
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Psychic Octopus
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2010, 07:27:12 PM »

What about Frederick's liberal beliefs? He was, if I recall correctly, not on good relations with Bismarck and had plans of weakening the position of the monarch.
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J. J.
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« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2010, 08:38:36 PM »

What about Frederick's liberal beliefs? He was, if I recall correctly, not on good relations with Bismarck and had plans of weakening the position of the monarch.

They had some sort of a secret rapprochement after the Franco-Prussian War.  Frederick wanted Bismarck as chancellor.  Bismarck agreed to stay under two conditions.

1.  No "English" influence in foreign policy (including his wife, of course).


2.  No increase in the power of the Reichstag. (Dreadnaught, Massie, p. 92).

You have to remember the esteem Bismarck had after unification, and that he did ally himself with some of the "leftist" parties.  You also have to remember that he, post 1871, had a peaceful foreign policy.  He did his best to defuse situations after that.

Bismarck actually complained in 1874 that he did all the great things already.

It was also Frederick, as Crown Prince, that supported (almost alone) Bismarck in ending the Seven Weeks War, against the opposition of both Wilhelm I and von Moltke the Elder.

The idea of Bismarck as "warlord in chief" or a more competent version of either Wilhelm II or Hitler needs to be reevaluated. 
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tnowacki
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« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2011, 01:45:04 PM »

Well, in that 10 years Friedrich III would have had, he would have strengthened ties with Russia and Austria. And Bismarck would have gained an position from which Wilhelm II were not able to remove him. Unfortunately. Tongue

Bismarck, post 1872, wanted nothing but peace and was not interested in a colonial empire. 

Without some constitutional reform, Wilhelm II always had the power to remove Bismarck.  Neither Frederick nor Bismarck wanted that changed.

The great "what if" would have been if Frederick would have ruled for another 15-20 years and died in his mid 70's, maybe around 1905.
And he wanted nothing more than removing or resettling the Socialists, Catholics and Poles.
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