Libya: Benghazi unrest, to Civil War, to a new government and Gaddafi's death.

[Insula Dei]

Still, the situation was less accute, wouldn't you agree?

[Mr. Morden]

Still, the situation was less accute, wouldn't you agree?

Well, I would say yes, of course.  Not necessarily in terms of the actual death count, but in terms of the livelihood of the 2 million people in eastern Libya who had broken free of Gaddafi's rule and were being threatened by him again.  The comparable situation in Iraq would of course be the Kurdish north, were US and UK (and initially, France) had set up a no-fly zone in 1991.

[King]

Tim Hetherington, a documentary filmmaker and director of the AA-nominated Restrepo, was killed by mortar fire in Misrata today along with Getty Images photographer Chris Hondros.

[Cincinnatus]

"Obama has OK'd use of drones in Libya, Gates says"


I must admit, I appreciate the fact that the administration has so enthusiastically employed drones.  Personally, I'm very interested in aviation and find unmanned aircraft's to be a significant step forward at about 1/6 of the estimated cost of an F-15 (& about 1/4 of the F-16, which was deployed for the no-fly zone).   Hopefully, they can be shown to sustain military and economic viability.  If it keeps military personnel off the battlefield it's clearly a technological avenue to travel.


http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/21/obama-has-okd-use-of-drones-in-libya-gates-says/?hpt=T2

[J. J.]

"Obama has OK'd use of drones in Libya, Gates says"


I must admit, I appreciate the fact that the administration has so enthusiastically employed drones.  Personally, I'm very interested in aviation and find unmanned aircraft's to be a significant step forward at about 1/6 of the estimated cost of an F-15 (& about 1/4 of the F-16, which was deployed for the no-fly zone).   Hopefully, they can be shown to sustain military and economic viability.  If it keeps military personnel off the battlefield it's clearly a technological avenue to travel.


http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/21/obama-has-okd-use-of-drones-in-libya-gates-says/?hpt=T2

They, like air power in general, have their uses.  Like air power, they are not a substitute for boots on the ground.

[Cincinnatus]

"Obama has OK'd use of drones in Libya, Gates says"


I must admit, I appreciate the fact that the administration has so enthusiastically employed drones.  Personally, I'm very interested in aviation and find unmanned aircraft's to be a significant step forward at about 1/6 of the estimated cost of an F-15 (& about 1/4 of the F-16, which was deployed for the no-fly zone).   Hopefully, they can be shown to sustain military and economic viability.  If it keeps military personnel off the battlefield it's clearly a technological avenue to travel.


http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/21/obama-has-okd-use-of-drones-in-libya-gates-says/?hpt=T2

They, like air power in general, have their uses.  Like air power, they are not a substitute for boots on the ground.

It can be argued however, that the general idea can be a substitute for manned aircraft.

[J. J.]

"Obama has OK'd use of drones in Libya, Gates says"


I must admit, I appreciate the fact that the administration has so enthusiastically employed drones.  Personally, I'm very interested in aviation and find unmanned aircraft's to be a significant step forward at about 1/6 of the estimated cost of an F-15 (& about 1/4 of the F-16, which was deployed for the no-fly zone).   Hopefully, they can be shown to sustain military and economic viability.  If it keeps military personnel off the battlefield it's clearly a technological avenue to travel.


http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/21/obama-has-okd-use-of-drones-in-libya-gates-says/?hpt=T2

They, like air power in general, have their uses.  Like air power, they are not a substitute for boots on the ground.

It can be argued however, that the general idea can be a substitute for manned aircraft.

To an extent, yes.  It you are planning combat actions, they are a good choice.

[J. J.]

NATO hit Qaddafi's compound, and missed him.

[CARLHAYDEN]

CBS News/New York Times Poll. April 15-20, 2011. N=1,224 adults nationwide. Margin of error ± 3.
                
"Do you approve or disapprove of the way Barack Obama is handling the situation in Libya?"
 
                  Approve   Disapprove   Unsure
                       %        %              %
4/15-20/11         39       45             16
            


ABC News/Washington Post Poll. April 14-17, 2011. N=1,001 adults nationwide. Margin of error ± 3.5.
                
"Do you approve or disapprove of the way Obama is handling the situation in Libya?"
 
             Approve   Disapprove   Unsure
                  %                  %              %
4/14-17/11    42                 49              9

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

NATO hit Qaddafi's compound, and missed him.

Did they really think he'll be here?

[J. J.]

NATO hit Qaddafi's compound, and missed him.

Did they really think he'll be here?

I think he was, or nearby.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Some British commander said that if Gaddafi or his sons are in any compound being hit, they'll be considered legitimate targets.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Some British commander said that if Gaddafi or his sons are in any compound being hit, they'll be considered legitimate targets.

So, what targets are "ilegitimate"?

[Silent Hunter]

Some British commander said that if Gaddafi or his sons are in any compound being hit, they'll be considered legitimate targets.

So, what targets are "ilegitimate"?

The precise list is in all likelihood classified, but hospitals would certainly be on the "illegitimate" list somewhere.

[Cincinnatus]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42824884/ns/world_news-mideastn_africa/

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I really wish people would give evidence when they make statements like this.

[opebo]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I really wish people would give evidence when they make statements like this.

Propaganda works better without this 'evidence' impediment.

[Mr. Morden]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42824884/ns/world_news-mideastn_africa/

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I really wish people would give evidence when they make statements like this.

Stuff like that has been reported on Al Jazeera for over a month:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISLz8Fv0eik

I mean, there's the testimony of the people involved, which has been on TV for weeks.  I assume that's what Rice is talking about, and I don't see how the US would have any other particular corroborating evidence.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

http://www.businessinsider.com/saif-qaddafi-killed-in-airstrike-2011-4

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[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Splendid, we have three dead kids, it seems.

Very bad PR.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I'll take anything said about Saif Al-Arab by the Gaddafi regime with a large side order of salt until they show the bodies.  I don't think he has been seen in weeks, and there were unconfirmed reports two months ago that he had joined the rebels of all things.  While I don't think he has joined the rebels, it is not at all implausible that he left Libya sometime ago with whatever portable wealth he could lay his hands on.

[Insula Dei]

I'll take anything said about Saif Al-Arab by the Gaddafi regime with a large side order of salt until they show the bodies.  I don't think he has been seen in weeks, and there were unconfirmed reports two months ago that he had joined the rebels of all things.  While I don't think he has joined the rebels, it is not at all implausible that he left Libya sometime ago with whatever portable wealth he could lay his hands on.

Very interesting note you're making there.

[opebo]

Splendid, we have three dead kids, it seems.

Very bad PR.

No, no, they were evil Gaddafis, right?  They were 'killing civilians', right?

This intervention is another in a long list of travesties on the part of the imperialists.  I'm sure the Libyans well understand the sacrifice the Gadaffi family is making for their freedom.  Even if the effort is quixotic, it is a fight for freedom.

[Insula Dei]

Splendid, we have three dead kids, it seems.

Very bad PR.

No, no, they were evil Gaddafis, right?  They were 'killing civilians', right?

This intervention is another in a long list of travesties on the part of the imperialists.  I'm sure the Libyans well understand the sacrifice the Gadaffi family is making for their freedom.  Even if the effort is quixotic, it is a fight for freedom.

...

[opebo]

Splendid, we have three dead kids, it seems.

Very bad PR.

No, no, they were evil Gaddafis, right?  They were 'killing civilians', right?

This intervention is another in a long list of travesties on the part of the imperialists.  I'm sure the Libyans well understand the sacrifice the Gadaffi family is making for their freedom.  Even if the effort is quixotic, it is a fight for freedom.

...

Obviously I didn't mean the Al-Quada/Western clients in the East, but the loyalists in the western part of the country.

[Insula Dei]

Splendid, we have three dead kids, it seems.

Very bad PR.

No, no, they were evil Gaddafis, right?  They were 'killing civilians', right?

This intervention is another in a long list of travesties on the part of the imperialists.  I'm sure the Libyans well understand the sacrifice the Gadaffi family is making for their freedom.  Even if the effort is quixotic, it is a fight for freedom.

...

Obviously I didn't mean the Al-Quada/Western clients in the East, but the loyalists in the western part of the country.

Actually, I never got why you don't sympathize with Al-Qaeda's struggle against imperialism.