Libya: Benghazi unrest, to Civil War, to a new government and Gaddafi's death.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

For The Scum, everything is about us.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Let's talk about class...

When FDR died, Japanese Government, although the two sides waged a total war against each other, actually did offer condolences to the American people, following death of "the great man".

Now, compare it to some Western leaders reactions (especially laughing Hillary) on Gaddafi death, even if they were almost bowing to him before revolution started.

So, regardless of our opinions of Gaddafi himself, let's compare behavior of those "savage Japs" with current Western, civilized leaders.

Well, Japan and America were at war. Declared war. So there were "rules". The US sent condolences to North Vietnam after Ho Chi Minh died, if I am not mistaken (though Vietnam was not a declared conflict), and the US frequently sent our condolences to the USSR in the 1980's, when the 3 leaders in a row died.

Again... I don't recall Richard Nixon laughing publicly at Ho Chi Minh death.

But Ho Chi Minh really was not that bad of a dictator compared to his Chinese, and North Korean counterparts. I regard Ho Chi Minh like I do Chavez-a mild autocrat. Qadafi, on the other hand, was a brutal dictator, and while I oppose all American intervention in Libya, I still believe Qadaffi was a terrorist. He's been on the lamb for a month now, and was trying to organize an insurgency. Qadaffi's death is pretty much the same as Bin Ladens to me.

[Хahar 🤔]

Let's talk about class...

When FDR died, Japanese Government, although the two sides waged a total war against each other, actually did offer condolences to the American people, following death of "the great man".

Now, compare it to some Western leaders reactions (especially laughing Hillary) on Gaddafi death, even if they were almost bowing to him before revolution started.

So, regardless of our opinions of Gaddafi himself, let's compare behavior of those "savage Japs" with current Western, civilized leaders.

Clearly we ought to offer condolences to the Libyan people on the occasion of the untimely death of their great leader. They would certainly appreciate that.

[Lief 🗽]

Gaddafi wasn't even the leader of Libya anymore at the time of his death. If a member of the NTC were to die, then it would be appropriate to offer condolences.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

To play a devil's advocate, what if Adolf Hitler fled Berlin and was found hiding in a pipe under a highway just outside Tel Aviv in 1950? Would he be treated any more humanely than Gaddafi?

I can't see Hitler in Tel Aviv, Kaliningrad perhaps, but not Tel Aviv.  Not that he'd be treated kindly there either.

[lowtech redneck]

FDR committed crimes against humanity against his own people?

um, well, now that you mention it...*

*The internment of Japanese-Americans pales in comparison, but I couldn't resist.

[The Mikado]

If the leader of the Libyan government had died, I'm sure the US would've sent condolences.  However, the leader of the Libyan government, Mahmoud Jibril, is very much alive.  A rebel insurgent leading an armed insurrection against the legitimate and recognized Libyan Government died.  Sending a message of condolences to Libya would be like sending a message of condolence to Cambodia in the late 1990s when Pol Pot kicked the bucket.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

If the leader of the Libyan government had died, I'm sure the US would've sent condolences.  However, the leader of the Libyan government, Mahmoud Jibril, is very much alive.  A rebel insurgent leading an armed insurrection against the legitimate and recognized Libyan Government died.  Sending a message of condolences to Libya would be like sending a message of condolence to Cambodia in the late 1990s when Pol Pot kicked the bucket.

This.

[Хahar 🤔]

If the leader of the Libyan government had died, I'm sure the US would've sent condolences.  However, the leader of the Libyan government, Mahmoud Jibril, is very much alive.  A rebel insurgent leading an armed insurrection against the legitimate and recognized Libyan Government died.  Sending a message of condolences to Libya would be like sending a message of condolence to Cambodia in the late 1990s when Pol Pot kicked the bucket.

Since you used that analogy, I wonder what the US would have done if Pol Pot had died in the 1980s.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

So FDR and Gaddafi are equally worthy of mourning?

[Antonio the Sixth]

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

This is utterly disgusting.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

This is utterly disgusting.

Howso? I don't see anything wrong with that way of thinking. Brits certainly have good reasons to be happy about Gaddafi being gone.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

This is utterly disgusting.

Howso? I don't see anything wrong with that way of thinking. Brits certainly have good reasons to be happy about Gaddafi being gone.

You too think it's all right to lynch bad people and then proudly show their mutilated corpse ? I thought you were a "christian", BRTD.

[Хahar 🤔]

Forgive me for not caring that he didn't get a trial.

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

This is utterly disgusting.

Howso? I don't see anything wrong with that way of thinking. Brits certainly have good reasons to be happy about Gaddafi being gone.

It's kind of silly to say something like that given that whoever killed him was certainly not thinking of Lockerbie.

[Middle-aged Europe]

Forgive me for not caring that he didn't get a trial.

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

This is utterly disgusting.

Howso? I don't see anything wrong with that way of thinking. Brits certainly have good reasons to be happy about Gaddafi being gone.

It's kind of silly to say something like that given that whoever killed him was certainly not thinking of Lockerbie.

True, Gadaffi probably did much worse things than Lockerbie.

[ingemann]

I have absolutely no problem with Gaddafi being murdered by a mob of angry rebels. If anything there's something cosmically pleasing about it, much like when Ceausescu was executed, as Al brings up. Brutal, lawless dictators should die brutally and lawlessly at the hands of their own people.

I disagree, not that Daffy and Ceausescu didn't deserve their destiny, but in Ceausescu case he was fundamental just a figurhead, who were excuted by the rest of the old establishment, which used it to deflect the blame solely onto Ceausescu and letting them stay in power.
In Daffy's case it's a little different, he were captured by grunts rather than just being used as a scapegoat by his old allies.

[GMantis]

I disagree, not that Daffy and Ceausescu didn't deserve their destiny, but in Ceausescu case he was fundamental just a figurhead, who were excuted by the rest of the old establishment, which used it to deflect the blame solely onto Ceausescu and letting them stay in power.

That's very strange analysis and it's incorrect. More exactly, the revolution was used by other figures in the communist party who were sidelined by Ceausescu to have him removed and take his place.
By the way, there are a lot of former Gaddafi associates among the NTC, so there are definitely similarities...

[Landslide Lyndon]

I, naturally, am happy to see another tyrant fall. I regret that it was so bloody, but with Gaddafi's regime being what it was there was never any chance of it being otherwise...

I'm also filled with a warm gleeful feeling thinking of how upset Gaddafi's international buddies are - the thought of Fidel Castro, Hugo Chavez, Daniel Ortega, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, and Robert Mugabe screaming over this makes me smile.

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

Ortega, Morales and Correa were elected democratically, so your attempt to tie them with Gaddhafi and Mugabe is a fail of epic proportions.

Are you really this goddamned stupid? I was referring to all those leaders who backed Gaddafi during the Libyan Civil War, you f***tard! Have you paid no attention to the international aspect of this? Do some basic research, boy, before you accuse me of an epic fail.

http://www.centerforangermanagement.com/

[opebo]

Gaddafi was never taken particularly seriously. When Western governments started talking to him again (something that was, of course, essentially a consensus position at the time) it wasn't because they suddenly respected him; it was because of the money. Because that's the way these things work.

Oh come on, no one is 'respected' for any other reason than power.  It happens Libya has never been a very powerful nation, and thus Gaddafi was a minor world figure.

However it is worth noting that the Imperialists did bother to attack him and have him murdered, so he must have been somewhat worth 'taking seriously'.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Gaddafi was never taken particularly seriously. When Western governments started talking to him again (something that was, of course, essentially a consensus position at the time) it wasn't because they suddenly respected him; it was because of the money. Because that's the way these things work.

Oh come on, no one is 'respected' for any other reason than power.  It happens Libya has never been a very powerful nation, and thus Gaddafi was a minor world figure.

Gaddafi had a giant ambitions, far exceeding Libyan potential. His attempts to succeed Nasser as leading Arab leader failed miserably and he had very poor relations with fellow Arab rulers (particularly Saudis, Sadat and Nimeiry). He even waged a brief war against Egypt (got his ass kicked and only international concerns prevented Sadat from going all the way to Tripoli) and longer one against Sudan.

Later, Gaddafi tried to win a position of leading African leader, which more success, buying influence in Dark Africa countries.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

So FDR and Gaddafi are equally worthy of mourning?

Of course not and that's not a point. I just find behavior of some Western figures disgusting and tasteless. Particularly those, who just few months ago were literally kissing Gaddafi's ass.

No one would, of course, expect U.S. government to express any sorrow or condolences over Gaddafi's death. I merely cited totally opposite situation (and, certainly, no one was more hated by Japanese in the 1940s than FDR).

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Anyway, I heard somewhere that new Libyan Prime Minister announced his intentions to step down already. Can someone confirm?

[Insula Dei]

I'm npwhere near hypocritical enough to pretend this outcome wasn't the best one possible as far as I'm concerned. What would have been the use of a trial for crimes against humanity? Those things are at best just edified lynching parties, at worst they mean the war criminal gets to die an easy death in a The Hague mini-appartment . Also, when a dictator of multiple decades falls, exterminating all possibility of a restoration is the way to go.

[Franzl]

I'm npwhere near hypocritical enough to pretend this outcome wasn't the best one possible as far as I'm concerned. What would have been the use of a trial for crimes against humanity? Those things are at best just edified lynching parties, at worst they mean the war criminal gets to die an easy death in a The Hague mini-appartment . Also, when a dictator of multiple decades falls, exterminating all possibility of a restoration is the way to go.

Thank you You speak the truth.

Unfortunately, a lot of German media I've seen is doing the usual show. Not quite as bad as with Bin Laden, of course (but then I guess it's not as bad if America doesn't do it).

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

I have absolutely no problem with Gaddafi being murdered by a mob of angry rebels. If anything there's something cosmically pleasing about it, much like when Ceausescu was executed, as Al brings up. Brutal, lawless dictators should die brutally and lawlessly at the hands of their own people.

I disagree, not that Daffy and Ceausescu didn't deserve their destiny, but in Ceausescu case he was fundamental just a figurhead, who were excuted by the rest of the old establishment, which used it to deflect the blame solely onto Ceausescu and letting them stay in power.
In Daffy's case it's a little different, he were captured by grunts rather than just being used as a scapegoat by his old allies.

Very true.

While I certainly can understand Libyan rebels that killed him, it's hypocrisy of old allies that disgust me.