Obama government will stop defending the DOMA

[Skill and Chance]

Terrific news! Hopefully by the 2012 election, Obama will stop lying about his position on gay marriage as well.

It will be after the 2012 election. It's a position best taken by a president who is already term limited.

But wouldn't the Democrats lose in 2014 if he comes out as pro-gay marriiage?

I don't see why that would be the case. Obama can win in 2012 even if he publicly supports gay marriage. You'd be surprised, but people are as responsive to politicians as they are to us. And yeah, I see how that statement can be supportive of my argument and counter it at the same time.

I would think that gay marriage would have national majority support by late 2014, especially if the country re-elects Obama.  It's probably a non-issue.

[RIP Robert H Bork]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

[Capitan Zapp Brannigan]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

I do.

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol, he's as liberal as David Cameron on that front.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

[Skill and Chance]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

I mostly agree with this.  If Obama were a doctrinaire liberal, he would not be proposing spending cuts of any kind in this economy.

[cinyc]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

If National Journal's most liberal Senator in 2007 is not a liberal, then who is a liberal, exactly?

[Marokai Backbeat]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

If National Journal's most liberal Senator in 2007 is not a liberal, then who is a liberal, exactly?

Oh please, even you are smarter than that, Cinyc. Those ratings are silly.

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

If National Journal's most liberal Senator in 2007 is not a liberal, then who is a liberal, exactly?

Obviously using the GOP definition of the liberal, which is anything to left of them...

[cinyc]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

If National Journal's most liberal Senator in 2007 is not a liberal, then who is a liberal, exactly?

Obviously using the GOP definition of the liberal, which is anything to left of them...

Nice try.  National Journal is not a partisan publication.

[RIP Robert H Bork]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

[Ban my account ffs!]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

[RIP Robert H Bork]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I didn't know you approve of tyranny and intimidation.

Anyway, that's called Communism. That hardly makes Obama a "centrist".

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

No, US Conservatives have a strange definition of centreism. Largely because they've spent the last 30 years shifting the centre of American politics to the right, and insisting on the Democrats meeting them in the middle...

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

If National Journal's most liberal Senator in 2007 is not a liberal, then who is a liberal, exactly?

Obviously using the GOP definition of the liberal, which is anything to left of them...

Nice try.  National Journal is not a partisan publication.

There was no 'try', I wasn't responding to the specific article. Even though I think those ratings are incredibly subjective what is a liberal vote? who defines a liberal issue?


----

Also, consider this, Obama can be the most liberal president ever, and still be a centreist...

[tpfkaw]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I like it when "liberals" admit to being fascists, it makes things much easier.  Luckily, among your merry band of "liberals," only Castro, Chavez, and Chavez's Bolivian friend remain as of this week.  One presumably down, 3 to go.

[Sbane]

Some people on this forum have no idea what real leftists are like.

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I like it when "liberals" admit to being fascists, it makes things much easier.  Luckily, among your merry band of "liberals," only Castro, Chavez, and Chavez's Bolivian friend remain as of this week.  One presumably down, 3 to go.

I'm glad you used the " " since there is nothing genuinely liberal about any of those three people...

[RIP Robert H Bork]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

No, US Conservatives have a strange definition of centreism. Largely because they've spent the last 30 years shifting the centre of American politics to the right, and insisting on the Democrats meeting them in the middle...

Name one thing Obama has done that's anywhere near centrist. I certainly don't consider his position on the DOMA or gay marriage to be centrist. But I can understand why you consider even full-blown gay marriage to be "centrist"; after all, you're in Australia, which is probably much further left than the US.

[memphis]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

If National Journal's most liberal Senator in 2007 is not a liberal, then who is a liberal, exactly?

Obviously using the GOP definition of the liberal, which is anything to left of them...
running for office as a Democrat.

[tpfkaw]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I like it when "liberals" admit to being fascists, it makes things much easier.  Luckily, among your merry band of "liberals," only Castro, Chavez, and Chavez's Bolivian friend remain as of this week.  One presumably down, 3 to go.

I'm glad you used the " " since there is nothing genuinely liberal about any of those three people...

I'm the only "genuine liberal" on this page, but the scare quotes were because that appears to be Snowguy's definition of "liberal."

[Ban my account ffs!]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I didn't know you approve of tyranny and intimidation.

Anyway, that's called Communism. That hardly makes Obama a "centrist".

lol... you obviously have no idea what communism is.

Is it also tyranny and intimidation (which you seem to approve of) when Scott Walker threatens to use the National Guard to force people to work after he attempts to strip them of their collective bargaining rights and slash their pay?

I'd hope you are consistent!  

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

No, US Conservatives have a strange definition of centreism. Largely because they've spent the last 30 years shifting the centre of American politics to the right, and insisting on the Democrats meeting them in the middle...

Name one thing Obama has done that's anywhere near centrist. I certainly don't consider his position on the DOMA or gay marriage to be centrist. But I can understand why you consider even full-blown gay marriage to be "centrist"; after all, you're in Australia, which is probably much further left than the US.

Which illustrates my point.

The US definition of centreist is completely skewed away from the conventional wisdom of what the centre is.

Australia is hardly some leftist paradise... we're socially liberal in the fact that a minority are actively socially left of centre and another minority don't give a s**t... Gay marriage/civil unions have high support in Australia not because of it being a left-wing haven, but because a lot of people don't care enough to complain, and the Australian ideal of 'fairness' "well it doesn't seem fair that they don't have the same rights I do" kicks in.

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I like it when "liberals" admit to being fascists, it makes things much easier.  Luckily, among your merry band of "liberals," only Castro, Chavez, and Chavez's Bolivian friend remain as of this week.  One presumably down, 3 to go.

I'm glad you used the " " since there is nothing genuinely liberal about any of those three people...

I'm the only "genuine liberal" on this page, but the scare quotes were because that appears to be Snowguy's definition of "liberal."

Lol... you're the walking definition of the anarchist libertarian...

I believe in the ability of the state to be able to assist people who are suffering... but Snowguy's quote is on the outer limits for me.

[Ban my account ffs!]

I wonder if certain liberals here still think Obama is not liberal enough?

Lol. Obama is barely liberal. I don't understand how you could realistically define him as anything other than a charismatic centrist.

*FACEPALM*

You have a strange definition of centrism. Obama is perhaps the most liberal president we've ever had. I don't know how that could be considered centrist, not even from a far-leftist perspective.

lol.. I love it when the far right claims every centrist Democrat is "zomgz teh most liberalist ever in the whole wide world!@!"

The type of person I consider a liberal is former governor Floyd B. Olson (Farmer-Labor Party-MN)

Who said this, regarding the conservatives in the state legislature:

"I am making a last appeal to the Legislature. If the Senate does not make provision for the sufferers in the State and the Federal Government refuses to aid, I shall invoke the powers I hold and shall declare martial law. ... A lot of people who are now fighting [relief] measures because they happen to possess considerable wealth will be brought in by provost guard and be obliged to give up more than they would now. There is not going to be misery in this State if I can humanly prevent it. . . Unless the Federal and State governments act to insure against recurrence of the present situation, I hope the present system of government goes right down to hell."

I like it when "liberals" admit to being fascists, it makes things much easier.  Luckily, among your merry band of "liberals," only Castro, Chavez, and Chavez's Bolivian friend remain as of this week.  One presumably down, 3 to go.

I'm glad you used the " " since there is nothing genuinely liberal about any of those three people...

I'm the only "genuine liberal" on this page, but the scare quotes were because that appears to be Snowguy's definition of "liberal."

lol...

Please don't fancy yourself by pretending you're a "genuine liberal"... try "genuine bald faced liar" in that case.

You are an anarcho-capitalist... which has nothing to do with liberalism, either classically or in the modern American progressive sense.  Classical liberals still support a limited government that largely stays out of economic and social matters, but ensures the rights of the people and defends the nation should the need arise.  You're not that.

[cinyc]

lol... you obviously have no idea what communism is.

Is it also tyranny and intimidation (which you seem to approve of) when Scott Walker threatens to use the National Guard to force people to work after he attempts to strip them of their collective bargaining rights and slash their pay?

I'd hope you are consistent!  

For the umpteenth time, Scott Walker NEVER threatened to call out the National Guard if government workers protested his proposed changes to bargaining laws.  And he hasn't.