Because Every Vote Counts - True Federalist April 2011

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Is our government even paying attention to the world?  If so they don't seem to be doing anything about it.  Not one word on the tragedy in Japan.  Not one word on the civil war in Libya.  Nor am I calling out just our executive branch, though I would hope that our Secretary of External Affairs would be doing something more than deciding on how to decorate his new office. There is not a peep to be heard from the Senate either, with not even a resolution expressing the sense of the Senate being put into the Senate hopper, let alone any proposals for more concrete action such as aiding the brave people of Libya in defending themselves against the genocidal tyrant who has ruled the place for the last four decades.

If the voters of Atlasia send me to the Senate next month, you can be assured that whether or not you agree with my views on what Atlasia should do in the world, at least I won't be ignoring it!

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Ernest, Libya was both a topic of Hash actions as SoEA, as well as Ben confirmation to that post.

You're unfair to the both.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Ernest, Libya was both a topic of Hash actions as SoEA, as well as Ben confirmation to that post.

You're unfair to the both.

Hashemite is not the current SoEA and the situation in Libya has changed considerably since his imposition of some sanctions on the 21st of last month.  It has even changed considerably since Ben's statement a week ago that he would push for a no-fly zone at his confirmation hearing.

Nor does any of that explain our government's seeming obliviousness to what has happened in Japan.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Ernest, Libya was both a topic of Hash actions as SoEA, as well as Ben confirmation to that post.

You're unfair to the both.

Hashemite is not the current SoEA and the situation in Libya has changed considerably since his imposition of some sanctions on the 21st of last month.  It has even changed considerably since Ben's statement a week ago that he would push for a no-fly zone at his confirmation hearing.

Nor does any of that explain our government's seeming obliviousness to what has happened in Japan.

Point of order: does we automatically assume RL events are game foreign events, or it's up for GM to determine?

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Point of order: does we automatically assume RL events are game foreign events, or it's up for GM to determine?

Did our GM decide one way or the other about what was happening in the Middle East before our DoEA started to react to it?

If we no longer do react to RL events, it is something Atlasia should return to.  The main reason to have a GM is to have someone to adjudicate the effect of what Atlasia does on the world, not to decide what would be happening in the world anyway.  Putting our ship of state in a bottle does not seem like a good idea to me.

[Hash]

1. I imposed full sanctions, which is more than can be said about real-life western governments.
2. What else was I supposed to do? Send bombers and invade? Make believe that Gadaffi had been killed?

And, Jesus Christ in a bag, for the gazillionth time: https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=127840.msg2743982#msg2743982

[Bacon King]

Yes, the SOEA has GM power over foreign policy.

Considering that Hashemite in his link above explicitly delineates what types of event happen and that has (to my knowledge) not been contradicted by either the GM or current SOEA, his post should be considered an entirely valid rule.

Therefore, in Atlasiaverse, the Japanese earthquakes happened exactly as in RL, and everything in the Middle East the same as well except for whatever effect Atlasian sanctions have on Libya.

There's no reason that the administration and (especially) the Senate should not be more active. I can understand complaints that sometimes it's hard to come up with ideas for bills or whatever, but these are topics directly given for them to consider, and there's no excuse that they haven't done anything.

Atlasian government people, if you're not willing or able to keep up a semblance of activity, step aside and resign so someone more active can take your place. It's what I did.

But yeah, Ernest, you definitely have my support. Good luck in April.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

As a random aside here, I just discovered that the Game Moderator is required by law to cover at least one foreign policy event every month. Huh.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

1. I imposed full sanctions, which is more than can be said about real-life western governments.
2. What else was I supposed to do? Send bombers and invade? Make believe that Gadaffi had been killed?

Since you are no longer the SoEA, my complaints about lack of action by the SoEA were not directed at you.  Given what had happened up to the time you left office, my only complaint with the decisions and actions you took with respect to Libya is that you did not ask the Senate to consider providing the brave Libyan patriots with the tools they would need to depose their dictator.  Of course, one would have thought at least one Senator would have proposed something like that on their own initiative.

And, Jesus Christ in a bag, for the gazillionth time: https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=127840.msg2743982#msg2743982

I freely admit to having poor knowledge of what happened during my absence from Atlasian politics.  In December 2010, I wasn't even on the voter list, and I had clicked the arrow beside the link to Atlas Fantasy Elections on the main page so that I didn't even see the links to the boards.  That post certainly accords with what I feel should be happening.  It also makes the continued silence of the government on what is going on in Japan all the more damning.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Sorry I have a life   The Japan response is up; if the Senate needs legislation to confirm what I've done, introduce it.

A Libya response is being drafted.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Our Senate must be asleep or on drugs as there is still not even the slightest hint of action from it on Libya.  As for what the Secretary of Forum Affairs is doing, as much as I agree with the actions he has undertaken, one of them is being done in a blatantly unconstitutional manner.  Under our Constitution, the Senate has sole Power to declare War.  There is no legal basis for his ordering Atlasian planes to attack the forces of the mad dictator Gaddafi.  If we are to avoid ourselves heading down the garden path of good intentions to the evil of an unaccountable dictatorship, the Senate must quickly reassert its authority by all means at its disposal, including impeaching the Secretary if he does not halt his unconstitutional activities.

[Hash]

On that much, I agree. The Senate has always been blatantly incompetent and useless when it comes to foreign affairs, and has made it clear a zillion times it doesn`t care about them.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

On that much, I agree. The Senate has always been blatantly incompetent and useless when it comes to foreign affairs, and has made it clear a zillion times it doesn`t care about them.

Luckily, you got a Senator which is interested in foreign affairs

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

The most we could do is hold and investigative hearing as currently all the slots are full. https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=132824.msg2838660#msg2838660


The problem is too many Senators are not committed to their jobs to the extent necessary to pass these bills in a reasonable time and get all problems with them, innefficiences or mistakes or whatever dealt with as well in a reasonable time.

If you want the Senate to be more active, the voters and the citizens in non election years MUST DEMAND IT. It is ridiculous to think that you can have an active Senate in an innactive Atlasia.

[The Dowager Mod]

Well apparently legislating how people treat thier cats is more important than a civil war in Libya.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Well apparently legislating how people treat thier cats is more important than a civil war in Libya.

snickers.


Bgwah is actually a very active Senator, probably one of the top three most active. The trouble is his focus is kind of "misplaced" on less consequential matters. Now in an active functioning body, many of this items are stuff that would get done in between larger items. But when it takes a month or more to debate a bill on cats, only to learn in the midst of an amendment vote that it is "most likely" unconstitutional.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Well apparently legislating how people treat thier cats is more important than a civil war in Libya.

It's not like bgwah's bill is the only thing Senate is working on.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

It seems to me that a potential solution here to the procedural problem would be to give the PPT the right to suspend debate on items on in the PPT slot if something he deems even more urgent comes up.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

It seems to me that a potential solution here to the procedural problem would be to give the PPT the right to suspend debate on items on in the PPT slot if something he deems even more urgent comes up.

Actually, it seems to be pretty good idea.

However, as for urgent reactions, SoEA, GM and, of course, President, can do things 1000 times quicker than the Senate.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Statement on Libya

Until the President orders it, the bombing of Gaddafi strongholds is called off.

I commend our SoEA for halting his unconstitutional attempt to usurp the war powers of the Senate, even as I must deplore his presumption that the President has war powers.  As much as I want to see us bomb the snot out of Gaddafi as soon as possible, it is up to the Senate to decide we will do that.  We have no mutual defense treaty with the National Transitional Council and no authorization from the GTO or the UN to engage in air support of the NTC or even establish a no-fly zone in Libya.  Absent any of those, attacking Gaddafi's thugs is definitely the sole prerogative of the Senate.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I wouldn't speak as if it's guarranteed that such a move to attack Libya would pass the Senate.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

For the record, I am in talks with the NTC to establish just such a mutual defense treaty.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

For the record, I am in talks with the NTC to establish just such a mutual defense treaty.

Such a treaty would also require Senate approval.  The sole advantage to the treaty at this point is that it should make Atlasia's actions more acceptable internationally.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I wouldn't speak as if it's guaranteed that such a move to attack Libya would pass the Senate.

I didn't.  While I hope the Senate would agree to defend Libya from Gaddafi's thugs, the choice is theirs to make, not the SoEA's nor the President's.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

For the record, I am in talks with the NTC to establish just such a mutual defense treaty.

Such a treaty would also require Senate approval.  The sole advantage to the treaty at this point is that it should make Atlasia's actions more acceptable internationally.

Don't worry, I'm aware of that.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I wouldn't speak as if it's guaranteed that such a move to attack Libya would pass the Senate.

I didn't.  While I hope the Senate would agree to defend Libya from Gaddafi's thugs, the choice is theirs to make, not the SoEA's nor the President's.

I know, but your statement left open alternative interpretations of what you meant, which could have included an unreasonable expectation which may or may not be met.