Pawlenty/Pence vs. Obama/Biden

[NHI]

Discuss the possible matchup with maps, if you so feel inclined.

[tmthforu94]

Is this assuming Pence lost the Republican primary for Governor or that he didn't run at all? Or is he running for Governor and VP simultaneously?

[NHI]

Assuming he does not run.

[MAINEiac4434]

Obama still wins. Especially with an extremist like Pence as T-Paw's running mate.

Democrats: Barack Obama (IL)/Joe Biden (DE) - 346
Republicans: Tim Pawlenty (MN)/Mike Pence (IN) - 192

Without a favorite son on the ballot, Arizona swings to Obama. North Carolina goes back to the GOP. Obama holds Florida very narrowly. Minnesota goes against it's former governor (after he left MN with a MASSIVE deficit), WI and MI remember their own run-ins with tea party-ness with Snyder and Walker, and go heavily for Obama. Montana narrowly swings Obama's way. NE-02 goes back to the GOP. Missouri stays in the GOP's column, narrowly.

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

[Niemeyerite]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

Oh there's more. All those CFR members on his staff. His not sending aid regarding the Texas wildfires while helping the victims of the recent tornados.

[Niemeyerite]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

Oh there's more. All those CFR members on his staff. His not sending aid regarding the Texas wildfires while helping the victims of the recent tornados.

That's bullsh**t.
You don't know what a liberal is. you don't know what's socialism or communism. Have you ever heard of socialdemocracy? Obama isn't even a socialdemocrat. He may be a centrist extremist

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

Oh there's more. All those CFR members on his staff. His not sending aid regarding the Texas wildfires while helping the victims of the recent tornados.

That's bullsh**t.
You don't know what a liberal is. you don't know what's socialism or communism. Have you ever heard of socialdemocracy? Obama isn't even a socialdemocrat. He may be a centrist extremist

I know what a liberal is. Do you know what a classical liberal is? I'm quite aware of the ideologies of socialism and communism. By my understanding of political viewpoints,  Obama is by far a socialist (he supports redistribution of wealth) Social democracy is a largely European ideology that paints itself as Europe's center-left. They've nearly traded one form of leftism (fascism) for another (socialism lite). If the US had more than two major parties in government Obama would be in the one that closely believes in socialism. Huckabee would be the lead of a Christian Democrat party, Romney would be a Progressive in the Bush/Rockefeller  mold, DeMint and Dr. Ron Paul would lead a Liberal Republican/Federalist Conservative party which would hold high the legacies of Reagan, JFK, Coolidge, Cleveland, Jefferson, and the Tafts. Sanders and Nader would lead a Green Progressive party.

[JewCon]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

Oh there's more. All those CFR members on his staff. His not sending aid regarding the Texas wildfires while helping the victims of the recent tornados.

That's bullsh**t.
You don't know what a liberal is. you don't know what's socialism or communism. Have you ever heard of socialdemocracy? Obama isn't even a socialdemocrat. He may be a centrist extremist

In reality, in non-fringe left world, he is considered a liberal. The Far-left, and Far-right are the most obnoxious people on the damn planet. "he's not a socialist, You dont know SOCIALISM!" or "He's not a conservative, he's really a moderate hippiee!!!1111"

People like that need to grow up. American Politics does not equal Any other country's politics.

Same goes for anyother comparison

[Niemeyerite]

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

Oh there's more. All those CFR members on his staff. His not sending aid regarding the Texas wildfires while helping the victims of the recent tornados.

That's bullsh**t.
You don't know what a liberal is. you don't know what's socialism or communism. Have you ever heard of socialdemocracy? Obama isn't even a socialdemocrat. He may be a centrist extremist

In reality, in non-fringe left world, he is considered a liberal. The Far-left, and Far-right are the most obnoxious people on the damn planet. "he's not a socialist, You dont know SOCIALISM!" or "He's not a conservative, he's really a moderate hippiee!!!1111"

People like that need to grow up. American Politics does not equal Any other country's politics.

Same goes for anyother comparison

Obama is the extremist not Pence. Prove Pence is an extremist then I will give my evidence for Obama's extremism.

You don't have any evidence of that

Besides his ties with Bill Ayers? "Spreading the Wealth around", and lets not forget old Jerry Wight?

Oh there's more. All those CFR members on his staff. His not sending aid regarding the Texas wildfires while helping the victims of the recent tornados.

That's bullsh**t.
You don't know what a liberal is. you don't know what's socialism or communism. Have you ever heard of socialdemocracy? Obama isn't even a socialdemocrat. He may be a centrist extremist

I know what a liberal is. Do you know what a classical liberal is? I'm quite aware of the ideologies of socialism and communism. By my understanding of political viewpoints,  Obama is by far a socialist (he supports redistribution of wealth) Social democracy is a largely European ideology that paints itself as Europe's center-left. They've nearly traded one form of leftism (fascism) for another (socialism lite). If the US had more than two major parties in government Obama would be in the one that closely believes in socialism. Huckabee would be the lead of a Christian Democrat party, Romney would be a Progressive in the Bush/Rockefeller  mold, DeMint and Dr. Ron Paul would lead a Liberal Republican/Federalist Conservative party which would hold high the legacies of Reagan, JFK, Coolidge, Cleveland, Jefferson, and the Tafts. Sanders and Nader would lead a Green Progressive party.

OK, but even by USA standards, Obama is not extremist. He's a moderate politician. And I don't know why are you saying he's a socialist. He's a capitalist without any doubts. If (even) Hugo Chavez isn't a socialist, how can Obama be a socialist? Maybe Sanders or Nader are extremists for you, but if you say Obama is, can your opinions be taken seriously? Open your eyes, and try to be more objective

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

You might have a point. But he is no friend of the free market.

[mondale84]

You might have a point. But he is no friend of the free market.

Ok...define friend of the free market...

[Penelope]

You might have a point. But he is no friend of the free market.

How so? He has lowered taxes for every wealth column. Isn't that what your brand of conservative is all about?

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

Quoting Murray Rothbard

The Free market is a summary term for an array of exchanges that take place in society. Each exchange is undertaken as a voluntary agreement between two people or between groups of people represented by agents. These two individuals (or agents) exchange two economic goods, either tangible commodities or nontangible services. Thus, when I buy a newspaper from a news dealer for fifty cents, the news dealer and I exchange two commodities: I give up fifty cents, and the news dealer gives up the newspaper. Or if I work for a corporation, I exchange my labor services, in a mutually agreed way, for a monetary salary; here the corporation is represented by a manager (an agent) with the authority to hire.

The governments role is to stay out of the way except in roles Of collecting taxation and enforcement of private ownership and contracts.

Obama has increased taxes not lowered them. Why do you call obamacare? It's a tax increase.

[Penelope]

Obama has increased taxes not lowered them. Why do you call obamacare? It's a tax increase.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/19/us/politics/19taxes.html
http://www.npr.org/2010/12/07/131879993/obama-s-tax-cut-deal-so-much-for-deficit-reduction
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama_tax_cuts

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

Obama has increased taxes not lowered them. Why do you call obamacare? It's a tax increase.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/19/us/politics/19taxes.html
http://www.npr.org/2010/12/07/131879993/obama-s-tax-cut-deal-so-much-for-deficit-reduction
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama_tax_cuts

http://www.atr.org/comprehensive-list-tax-hikes-obamacare-a5758
http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2011/05/obamacare-tax-subsidies-bigger-deficit-fewer-taxpayers-damaged-economy

[MAINEiac4434]

http://www.atr.org/comprehensive-list-tax-hikes-obamacare-a5758
http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2011/05/obamacare-tax-subsidies-bigger-deficit-fewer-taxpayers-damaged-economy

Wow, you've convinced me to move away from my democratic socialist ways by posting such well-respected, moderate, centrist, bipartisan, independent organizations like the Heritage Foundation and Americans for Tax Reform! I certainly hope you put other moderate, bipartisan, independent sources, like glennbeck.com, conservapedia.com and teapartyexpress.org to further promote your views. Which are moderate!

[/sarcasm]

To be honest, I laughed out loud when I saw heritage.org and atr.org in your post. Are you just asserting your conservatism, or are you actually trying to convince members of the Democratic party to switch their views with information from the freaking Heritage Foundation? It's like me asking you to completely abandoning your views by giving you facts from moveon.org and dailykos.com.

[MyRescueKittehRocks]

I've looked at some of the articles on huffington post, another progressive online media outlet.

[Niemeyerite]

I've looked at some of the articles on huffington post, another progressive online media outlet.

I've read in serious newspapers and political websites that it's not true you pay more taxes than ever. It's the opposite.