NY-09, Special Election Thread

[NY Jew]

Turner will win this race because of Weprin's same gender "marriage" vote/speech

[NY Jew]

I actually think Turner might this one.

If he does it will be because Weprin's position in favor of marriage redefinition.

[NY Jew]

I actually think Turner might this one.

If he does it will be because Weprin's position in favor of marriage redefinition.

That's the third time you post this nonsense. I think we got the message, so please take your idiocy and get the hell out of here.

just because you don't like it doesn't make it nonsense or idiocy (The fact that the demographic that normally would have supported Weprin at over a 90% rate will now vote against him solely due to the marriage redefinition vote is a fact.)  That little fact will effect this election substantially even if Weprin wins.

Next time maybe you should actually live in NY before you make stupid comments.

[NY Jew]

I actually think Turner might this one.

If he does it will be because Weprin's position in favor of marriage redefinition.

That's the third time you post this nonsense. I think we got the message, so please take your idiocy and get the hell out of here.

just because you don't like it doesn't make it nonsense or idiocy (The fact that the demographic that normally would have supported Weprin at over a 90% rate will now vote against him solely due to the marriage redefinition vote is a fact.)  That little fact will effect this election substantially even if Weprin wins.

Next time maybe you should actually live in NY before you make stupid comments.

I don't have to live to New York to understand what kind of person you are. Unfortunately idiots and bigots are cosmopolitan species.

considering the fact that the demographic I'm speaking about is one of the most hated groups if not the most hated group in the world I think you might be the bigot.

PS. even if were all bigots it still doesn't change the fact that if a demographic that is quite large in the district changes from 90% support to anywhere from 60-90+% the other way that will effect this race.

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If you agree to stay out of NY then I'll agree to stay out of Greece.

[NY Jew]

considering the fact that the demographic I'm speaking about is one of the most hated groups if not the most hated group in the world I think you might be the bigot.

PS. even if were all bigots it still doesn't change the fact that if a demographic that is quite large in the district changes from 90% support to anywhere from 60-90+% the other way that will effect this race.

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If you agree to stay out of NY then I'll agree to stay out of Greece.

Cut the PC stuff with me kid. I'm not an AMPAS member. If you want to be a homophobe own it and stop hiding behind your religion.

I'm not a homophobe for 2 reasons
1. I'm not afraid of homosexuals
2. I don't like them for rational reasons (which happen to be 100% based on religion)

I'm also not hiding behind my religion, my religion is everything to me and frankly most Orthodox Jews.

and if you want to be an anti semite own up to it and stop hiding behind your liberalism.

please tell me what I should do with this statement in Jewish tradition if I wasn't in your words a homophobe (keep in mind we do not change the text to suit what ever the in thing is of the times)
(this is a translation of course)
god did not decree the flood until men started writing marriage documents for other men


leaving aside the reasons behind it over 40 Rabbis including some of the biggest rabbis in America came out against Weprin for the reason I said electorally speaking that means something whether or not that homophobic or not (and if you say they are your giving more credence to the fact that your the true bigot).  When it comes to financing Jewish organization Weprin is equal to none and if it wasn't for the tremendous elephant (or donkey of a man) in the room he would be getting plenty of support that is now going out to vote against him.

[NY Jew]

but if it wasn't for that marriage vote the orthodox Jewish vote would have voted for Weprin at over a 90% rate

[NY Jew]

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if you think that you don't know the first thing about the Orthodox Jewish vote

Weprin funded more Othodox Jewish organizations then any other politician on any level of government.

There are a few reasons why Orthodox jews have been voting for the Republicans and if you take away those issues they would lean slightly left on most of the issues and with Weprin's funding record he would have won big (but we are not willing to sell our principles for money) (and the only major area where Weprin failed was on Social issues with marriage being the biggest)

substitute Weprin for Dear or Hikind (Hikind's race last year was just to send him a message if it would have been a real race he would have won in much bigger) on the democratic line and Turner looses the orthodox vote in the high 90%

PS
how many orthodox jews have you spoken to about this election? I'm curious was it even one?


why else do you think over 40 rabbis said you can't vote for David Weprin even though he funded more Orthodox Jewish organizations then any other politician on any level of goverment.

Why else are many other Rabbis (who are not from the 40) that have previously been close to Weprin avoiding him like the plague.
thebrooklynpolitics.com/post/9038350644/the-rabbis-are-avoiding-being-photographed-with-weprin

Why else does almost every single Orthodox jew who supports Turner for a variety of other  reasons almost always add say some variation of how can any orthodox jew vote for someone who said it's alright for a orthodox jew to vote for gay marriage/or vote for gay marriage/or march in the parades ext.

[NY Jew]

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Even if Weprin wins (and I'm not saying he will I think Turner will win by a slight majority) if it wasn't for his gay shenanigans this district would not even be in play.

[NY Jew]

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I noticed you didn't answer this question

[NY Jew]

considering the fact that the demographic I'm speaking about is one of the most hated groups if not the most hated group in the world I think you might be the bigot.

PS. even if were all bigots it still doesn't change the fact that if a demographic that is quite large in the district changes from 90% support to anywhere from 60-90+% the other way that will effect this race.

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If you agree to stay out of NY then I'll agree to stay out of Greece.

Cut the PC stuff with me kid. I'm not an AMPAS member. If you want to be a homophobe own it and stop hiding behind your religion.

I'm not a homophobe for 2 reasons
1. I'm not afraid of homosexuals
2. I don't like them for rational reasons (which happen to be 100% based on religion)

I'm also not hiding behind my religion, my religion is everything to me and frankly most Orthodox Jews.

and if you want to be an anti semite own up to it and stop hiding behind your liberalism.

please tell me what I should do with this statement in Jewish tradition if I wasn't in your words a homophobe (keep in mind we do not change the text to suit what ever the in thing is of the times)
(this is a translation of course)
god did not decree the flood until men started writing marriage documents for other men


leaving aside the reasons behind it over 40 Rabbis including some of the biggest rabbis in America came out against Weprin for the reason I said electorally speaking that means something whether or not that homophobic or not (and if you say they are your giving more credence to the fact that your the true bigot).  When it comes to financing Jewish organization Weprin is equal to none and if it wasn't for the tremendous elephant (or donkey of a man) in the room he would be getting plenty of support that is now going out to vote against him.

He didn't say anything remotely antisemitic in this thread.
and saying you don't like gays is because of the bible doesn't mean you're not a homophobe, that's just your reason for being a homophobe (i.e you are homophobic because you follow a homophobic bible).

he said I was "hiding behind religion" you said I was against them to Judaism thus is the difference he was attacking me for my Judaism thus earning the anti semite title.

[NY Jew]

he said I was "hiding behind religion" you said I was against them to Judaism thus is the difference he was attacking me for my Judaism thus earning the anti semite title.

"hiding behind religion" is a way of attacking you and not the religion.

well when I'm following my religion and he attacks me for that I'm 100 percent sure that he's anti semtic (which means to me (if you want to give me a racial thing then I guess the Crusaders and Inquisitors weren't anti Semetic) people who hate jews for following Judaism)

[NY Jew]

Based off what exactly??  Gay marriage vote or not, Turner was likely to get the Orthodox vote and win the Brooklyn portion of the district

Btw, the district has more than just Orthodox Jews, Werpin leads among Jewish voters.

NY-09 has more than just Jews, too.  It's the non-Hispanic white vote sink in Southeast Brooklyn and Southern Queens, largely owing its shape and demographic makeup to the shapes of the Brooklyn and Queens VRA African-American and Hispanic districts.   The district includes substantial Italian and Irish-American neighborhoods as well.   As someone noted earlier in the thread, it's arguably the most New York of NYC's congressional districts, with the lowest percentage of residents born in a US state other than the district's state of any Congressional district in the country (though it has a large share of foreign-born residents).

Whether the blue-collar Archie Bunker types who live in the district would vote against Weprin due to his stance on gay marriage is an interesting question.  There may be a few, but, chances are, those whose vote would be swayed by Weprin's stance on gay marriage are already voting for Turner anyway because he's the more socially conservative candidate.   

Special elections are usually won on turnout.  Having an organized group behind you, like Orthodox Rabbis can't hurt.  But despite running a terrible campaign, I have a hard time seeing Weprin lose this.  Democrats have the organizational muscle and machine in NY-09 - which matters a lot.

I agree with you on the facts but the fact that the blue-collar Archie Bunker types (which don't really exist in NY anymore but I'll substitute it for Irish or Italian Archie Bunker types) in this election are now pretty much solid Republicans (having a Irish as a candidate also helps a little) there pretty much irrelevant The largest swing vote in this district and the one that needs to vote Republican for this election to be one will is being decided based upon marriage redefinition makes my statement true if Turner wins by a combination of the different Conservative elements in this district.

[NY Jew]

he said I was "hiding behind religion" you said I was against them to Judaism thus is the difference he was attacking me for my Judaism thus earning the anti semite title.

"hiding behind religion" is a way of attacking you and not the religion.

well when I'm following my religion and he attacks me for that I'm 100 percent sure that he's anti semtic (which means to me (if you want to give me a racial thing then I guess the Crusaders and Inquisitors weren't anti Semetic) people who hate jews for following Judaism)

Yeah, because the vast majority of Jews who aren't homophobes are clearly misguided and only bigots like you are in possession of the absolute truth.

Go get a life kid.

and the vast majority of American Jews don't follow any of the basic tenants (sabbath, Holidays, Kosher ext.) of Judaism and even more so even any 5 year old Orthodox child most likely knows much more about Judaism then your average American Jew In fact most of them can't even read hebrew. 
So what they think is 100% irrelevant to anything.

so keep your antisemitism out of blogs of about a NYC election

[NY Jew]

So what they think is 100% irrelevant to anything.

Excuse me?  I'm Jewish, I don't keep Kosher or the Sabbath (fully, at least), and I damn well beg to differ.

I'm not saying as a person your irrelevant, rather I'm saying that your opinion about Judaism's position about gay marriage is irrelevant.

to say that someone who follows their religion is hiding behind their religion on an issue like marriage redefinition because the vast majority of Jews are in favor of marriage redefinition I have to point out that the vast majority of Jews opinion about what Judaism's view point on a subject is is irrelevant because if it was I would also violate Shabbos and eat non Kosher.

[NY Jew]

Anyways, as to the by-election... my general view remains the same. This is (or ought to be) a safe seat. End of. So losing it would be a big fycking blow, no matter what bollocks could be spun about the humiliating circumstances or the grossly exaggerated importance of the Hasidic vote.

Of course, safe seats are often lost in by-elections. And a big contributing factor is often (though not always) a poor choice of candidate. And, well... yeah. So, we'll see.

the orthodox vote here is mostly litvish and sefardi not hasidic (just as religious though (if not more so))

[NY Jew]

Anyways, as to the by-election... my general view remains the same. This is (or ought to be) a safe seat. End of. So losing it would be a big fycking blow, no matter what bollocks could be spun about the humiliating circumstances or the grossly exaggerated importance of the Hasidic vote.

Of course, safe seats are often lost in by-elections. And a big contributing factor is often (though not always) a poor choice of candidate. And, well... yeah. So, we'll see.

the orthodox vote here is mostly litvish and sefardi not hasidic (just as religious though (if not more so))

Do you offer some sort of system thats weighs the religiousness of the various sects?

my point was that where talking about litvish (Lithuanian based) and sefardi jews who are not chasidic though just as rigorously orthodox (but for example don't follow any grand rabbi)

(everything else I shouldn't have said on a general forum and was really meant only on the very off shot there are some chasidim who may happen to see that comment)

[NY Jew]

he said I was "hiding behind religion" you said I was against them to Judaism thus is the difference he was attacking me for my Judaism thus earning the anti semite title.

"hiding behind religion" is a way of attacking you and not the religion.

well when I'm following my religion and he attacks me for that I'm 100 percent sure that he's anti semtic (which means to me (if you want to give me a racial thing then I guess the Crusaders and Inquisitors weren't anti Semetic) people who hate jews for following Judaism)

The crusaders and Inquisitors actually persecuted people because they were Jewish, PX simply disagreed with a certain opinion which is part of Judaism (and you for following it), an opinion with for which he would oppose other religions with the same opinion.
If not agreeing with part of Jewish law/scripture would make one anti-Semitic than that would make any non-Jew and many Jews Anti-Semitic, with me proudly among them.

to attack someone because of that belief or to say that "I'm hiding behind my religion" would be anti semtic.

also The crusaders and Inquisitors actually persecuted people because they were Jewish (you forgot this part) and would not abandon their faith

[NY Jew]

Dov Hikind always almost always endorses Republicans; his endorsement would only be news if he endorsed the Democrat.

he has endorsed Democrats (who represent values that his district opposes) which is why he did so badly last time.

[NY Jew]

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/09/07/in-race-for-weiners-seat-75000-from-foes-of-same-sex-marriage/

anyone still think that I'm completely wrong about Weprin loosing this because of marriage redefinition.

[NY Jew]

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there is no way that the Orthodox jewish population (most likely the biggest Orthodox population in any CD in the country) would even consider voting for Turner if Weprin had a good record on all homosexual related issues (Weprin would have gotten around 90% of their vote) (like I said this guy most likely funded more Jewish (and Orthodox) organizations then any other politician in the country on any level of government) (and the more religious jewish Weprin supporters who find out that all the rabbis are going strongly against Weprin (Rabbis have never gotten involved in any election as much as this one) are now turning away from him)


also bronx democrat state senator Ruben Diaz (Puerto Rican) (also for marriage redefinition) also crossed party lines to endorse Turner (there are about 40,000 registered Hispanic voters in this district)

though you might be right on the Irish/Italian catholic vote in this district because they for the most part would have voted for Turner anyway.

[NY Jew]

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the reason for it is the sign of doom for Democrats at least in the north east. (at least if the Republicans even have a half a brain to capitalize on it, which most likely means your right and this defeat will not have a big after effect)

the NY Republican establishment is the dumbest thing in existence (historically too)

[NY Jew]

the NY Republican establishment is the dumbest thing in existence (historically too)

I didn't know that you're part of the Republican establishment.

sorry for insulting you (I didn't realize that you would be so upset that I forgot about you)
so here's the correction
the NY Republican establishment is the dumbest thing in existence outside of Greece (historically too)

the fact is that this CD is going to a Republican due to marriage redefinition and whether or not you think that makes us bigots (it's OK I think your a bigot) doesn't change the fact that politically the only reason this district is in play is because of weprin's homosexual positions. Bigots or not those are the facts and nothing you said have disproved those facts.

NYC is still for the most part a ethnic city like no other and no ethnicity group (that didn't completely assimilate in to the WASP (which today seemed to change it's protestantism for liberalism) north eastern culture) is in a favor of this trash.

[NY Jew]

Can we rule out that NY Jew isn't a new edition of Coburn Fan? Just asking.

?
I do like Tom Coburn if that's what you meant

[NY Jew]

http://www.siena.edu/uploadedfiles/home/Parents_and_Community/Community_Page/SRI/SNY_Poll/CD90911%20Crosstabs.pdf
many Jews who say Israel is the main reason for there vote, are really saying marriage redefinition but it wasn't a listed choice (and other doesn't accomplish anything, but voting for your second reason does) (look at 90% of the Orthodox Jews who are voting for Turner based on Israel also say in the same statement the marriage but they are to afraid to mention it straight up)
In addition the 6% of jews who say other I can almost guarantee that there biggest issue was marriage redefinition.

[NY Jew]

Can we rule out that NY Jew isn't a new edition of Coburn Fan? Just asking.

?
I do like Tom Coburn if that's what you meant

Nah, he meant some past poster.

I assumed that but I couldn't find a poster with that name. (I was curious what this person did that I'm getting compared to)