Please shut up about LBJ

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Well king of, except for attrition (i know is no excuse) the South would have dominated even after lee's blunders at gettysburg

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Boy have we gone off topic.... ill try to fix it

johnson sucked

[Kodratos]

Well king of, except for attrition (i know is no excuse) the South would have dominated even after lee's blunders at gettysburg

Had Jackson not died the South would have won. End of story

[patrick1]

Well king of, except for attrition (i know is no excuse) the South would have dominated even after lee's blunders at gettysburg

The only way the South wins is to change public opinion over the war in the North.  It almost happened. The North was just too industrialized for the South to keep up. 

[The Man From G.O.P.]

yeah kodratos, thats probably true, although i think longstreet was just as good as jackson

[The Duke]

Johnson had a great domestic record, a twisted personality, and a bad foreign policy.  A mixed bag, really.

And the south lost the Civil War because they lacked the materiel to beat Grant and were out of position to beat Sherman.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes and yes

good show ford

[??????????]

Johnson had a great domestic record, a twisted personality, and a bad foreign policy.  A mixed bag, really.

And the south lost the Civil War because they lacked the materiel to beat Grant and were out of position to beat Sherman.

Wrong. They DID have enough materials to beat the south. That fact has been proven. What failed for the south was the transportation system to deliver the goods to the armies. Plain and simple, the railroads lost the war for the south.

[A18]

What's important is:

1. The South deserved to lose

2. Lincoln deserved to be shot

Both happened.

[qwerty]

He was an awfull President, but I hold LBJ in high regard.

[??????????]

What's important is:

1. The South deserved to lose

Wrong

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Right

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Philip i hope to god ur not a virginia native, cos ud have people spinning in their graves right now

[J-Mann]

To turn this thread slightly back to the topic at hand: was anyone really going on and on about the merits of LBJ in the first place?  I recall most recently seeing his name at the bottom of many people's presidential rankings.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

About 4 people here like LBJ. I am one of them.

[ThePrezMex]

About 4 people here like LBJ. I am one of them.

I am another one. I think he was a good President. Without him, the Civil Rights legislation and other important stuff would not have happened. Was he controversial? yes. Would he fit the modern standards of 'political correctness'? no, but yet, those were other times.
I think that the best definition of him is the one given by one of his biographers, historian Robert Dalleck: 'Flawed Giant"

[Democratic Hawk]

I'm one of LBJ's few fans on the Forum.

I am too, he was a social progressive

Dave

[Engineer]

It is interesting to read how woefully uninformed people are these days.  I tend to blame it on the school system that no longer teaches history, only revisionist history.

The civil war was not about slavery.  If it had been, the North would not have had slavery before the Civil War.  The Emancipation Proclamation (issued Jan 1, 1963) only freed slaves in the Southern States, it did not address slaves in the North.  Read the document.  The slaves in the North, yes Northernors had slaves, were not freed until after the war.  

[Democratic Hawk]

Philip i hope to god ur not a virginia native, cos ud have people spinning in their graves right now

It's got me foaming at the mouth!

Dave

[Democratic Hawk]

It is interesting to read how woefully uninformed people are these days.  I tend to blame it on the school system that no longer teaches history, only revisionist history.

The civil war was not about slavery.  If it had been, the North would not have had slavery before the Civil War.  The Emancipation Proclamation (issued Jan 1, 1963) only freed slaves in the Southern States, it did not address slaves in the North.  Read the document.  The slaves in the North, yes Northernors had slaves, were not freed until after the war.  

I suspect that the Civil War had less to do with emancipation and more to do with providing a source of cheap labour for the North's growing industries. A place where, unlike Dixie, industrialists had no moral obligation to provide for their workers beyond paying them a pittance. In comparison, planters had a moral obligation to provide food and shelter for their slaves

Whether this is fact or fallacy, I'm far from certain, but the story has it that my ancestors never so much as raised a hand to their slaves. They were essentially benevolent paternalists

I make no secret of my antipathy towards the GOP and much of it stems from the Civil War and Reconstruction

I'm an ancestral Democrat and proud of it!

Dave

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Hawk, you said you had much antipathy for the republicans because of the civil war, well you seem to be missing somthing big (or im misunderstanding you) it is of course the republicans today that stand for southern ideals

(yes by god I would have been a democrat in 1860)

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I wonder who has worse spelling, TJN2024 or John.

Oh and the Confederates were a bunch of stupid traitor dogs who deserved to be wiped out, and LBJ was a Kennedy-killing bastard. I've made my view on that rather clear.

[AuH2O]

Everyone knows LBJ was involved in Kennedy's assassination. Personally I think he was taking orders, not giving them, but either way he was instrumental.

We would know more if Earl Warren hadn't also been involved, but people at the time were able to narrow it down to about 3 possibilities. Most likely it was feared Kennedy could lose and his comrades were displeased with his overall performance.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Johnson was a VERY BAD President (one of the worst).

Theodore H. White summed up Johnson's view of the world quite aptly when he noted that Johnson believed 'there ain't no problem that government cann't solve.'

See, The Making of the President, 1964.

The problem is that higher taxes, more bureaucrats, more regulations, less freedom was his panacea for everything.

The toxins he planted in the body politic have been causing turmoil for decades.

He was a crook, and first 'won' nomination as U.S. Senator is a rigged election.

Nixon (another bad President) was able to get elected because once the country became familiar with Johnson, it made Nixon look not as bad!

P.S. - One of reasons Kennedy gets such high favorability ratings is that people look as Johnson and then Kennedy, and Kennedy (a mediocre President) suddenly looks very good by comparison.

[??????????]

It is interesting to read how woefully uninformed people are these days.  I tend to blame it on the school system that no longer teaches history, only revisionist history.

The civil war was not about slavery.  If it had been, the North would not have had slavery before the Civil War.  The Emancipation Proclamation (issued Jan 1, 1963) only freed slaves in the Southern States, it did not address slaves in the North.  Read the document.  The slaves in the North, yes Northernors had slaves, were not freed until after the war. 

I suspect that the Civil War had less to do with emancipation and more to do with providing a source of cheap labour for the North's growing industries. A place where, unlike Dixie, industrialists had no moral obligation to provide for their workers beyond paying them a pittance. In comparison, planters had a moral obligation to provide food and shelter for their slaves

Whether this is fact or fallacy, I'm far from certain, but the story has it that my ancestors never so much as raised a hand to their slaves. They were essentially benevolent paternalists

I make no secret of my antipathy towards the GOP and much of it stems from the Civil War and Reconstruction

I'm an ancestral Democrat and proud of it!

Dave

You've hit the nail on the head.

[PBrunsel]

I'll give LBJ one good point, he worked very well with Congress. He got more stuff passed through Congress than any President in U.S. History.

Someone said of LBJ's bill passing, "Bills were flying out of Congress like candy bars out of vending machines."