No more Scottish Tories?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Silly title, but I'm tired.

Here's the story: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-14778353

Basically he seems to want the old Unionist Party back.

[tpfkaw]

This reminds me of a conversation I had with someone - we agreed that the California Republican Party would be better off renaming themselves the "California Conservative Party" or somesuch.

[redcommander]

It would probably be a good idea for Scottish Tories to do that, at least in the short term. If the Tory name wasn't so tarnished in Scottland still, Cameron probably would have won a majority if you take into consideration the amount of seats he picked up in England and Wales. They have to take drastic measures to fix their brand when they've been stuck with one MP in Westminster for 10 years now, and couldn't even pick up seats when Goldie ran a pretty good campaign for Holyrood.

[minionofmidas]

He's got the right idea, although the ship may have sailed in the Tories' case. Now for Labour to follow suit...

[Simfan34]

I suppose this new party will put a major emphasis on unionism? Might it end up a Scottish DUP?

[joevsimp]

So what will they call themselves? there's already a tiny outfit calling itself the Scottish Unionist Party isn't there.  Moderates? if the LibDems don't recover they could merge and call themselves Liberal Unionists again

[afleitch]

I suppose this new party will put a major emphasis on unionism? Might it end up a Scottish DUP?

The DUP is left wing, so no.

While I have supported a happy divorce from the UK party for some time, I'm not confident Murdo Fraser is the man to take it forward. The main UK party has supported this idea for years, it's the Scottish wing that has pulled back from it, particularly under Goldie. Lord Forsyth still excerts a strangely large amount of influence over the party which also doesn't help.

As for Unionism, the party can't decide what that actually means with regards devolution. Some still don't back the Scottish Parliament and others (myself included) want devolution max. The party missed the opportunity to push for devolution max and outflank the SNP and the unionist parties some time ago.

What we need is Ruth Davidson; hopefully she is just biding her time.

[You kip if you want to...]

Scottish CSU?

[joevsimp]

Scottish CSU?

the CSU have almost all of the seats in Bayern, so, erm, no, More like they're trying to be like the CiU in Catalunya, rather than turning into the Catalan branch of the PP

[You kip if you want to...]

Scottish CSU?

the CSU have almost all of the seats in Bayern, so, erm, no

I didn't mean that.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

More like they're trying to be like the CiU in Catalunya

I understand that another party got there first, sort of.

[You kip if you want to...]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-14779092

So, devolved leaders basically admitting that the Cameron Project's failed - atleast in the "non-England" sections of the union.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Bourne's not a leader of anything anymore. Remarkably badly written article, that one.

[Хahar 🤔]

The DUP is left wing, so no.

That's an interesting thing to say.

[afleitch]

Ruth Davidson has declared her intention to run.

So that's

Jackson Carlaw
Murdo Fraser
Ruth Davidson

[You kip if you want to...]

Ruth Davidson has declared her intention to run.

So that's

Jackson Carlaw
Murdo Fraser
Ruth Davidson

ScotsLibLabCon are all so inspirational.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Andrew, who do you think's likely to win?

[afleitch]

Andrew, who do you think's likely to win?

I wouldn't be confortable betting on anyone at the moment.

Both McLetchie and Goldie were chosen without a ballot (though the structure to have an election if there were a required number of contenders was there) There is a direct ballot of approx 16,000 members so the decision is really in their hands.

Murdo Fraser is the frontrunner; he's the current Deputy and backs deeper devolution and of course, divorcing the Scottish Conservatives from the main UK party which are two positions I back. Of course, he's hard right, socially conservative and not particularly good in Parliament or with the media (which counts for so much these days) What he has done however, is frame this race about the future of the party as part of the UK Conservatives. If he can sell this, he will win. If he can't sell it; he's toast. There is no guarantee that should he win and the party split, the he will take the whole Scottish party with him and there-in lies the danger. He does have the backing of 4 MSP's and undeclared financial backing from current and former party donors.

Ruth Davidson is my preferred choice on a political and personal level. She is the moderate candidate and has clear backing from Annabel Goldie and more importantly John Lamont (easily the parties, if not the Parliament's most successful constituency MSP) and various constituency associations in seats that matter. It's clear (though never explicitly stated) that she has backing from London. She is both new and unknown but has a great media presence and opposes Murdo's plan for seperation. I genuinely don't think her sexuality will cause her any problems in the race; if she struggles it will be due to other factors. Worth noting anecdotally at least, that David Cameron is said to have outperformed his national result in the 2005 leadership election amongst Scottish party members.

Jackson Carlaw is Jackson Carlaw. I'm holding my tongue on that one. Some have suggested Lord Forsyth run; highly doubtful but should he run and win then I'll be setting the lighter to my membership card.

[You kip if you want to...]

Andrew, who do you think's likely to win?

David Cameron is said to have outperformed his national result in the 2005 leadership election amongst Scottish party members.

Is that related to David William Donald Cameron being of Scottish descent? We saw what effect Gordon Brown had on the general election Scottish result.

[joevsimp]

More like they're trying to be like the CiU in Catalunya

I understand that another party got there first, sort of.

well yeah, the more I think about it, the more I see that that's a bad example, although I'm sure that he has that in mind, and CiU are ambiguous on the national issue, and Fraser seems to be in favour of devo max

[Simfan34]

I suppose this new party will put a major emphasis on unionism? Might it end up a Scottish DUP?

The DUP is left wing, so no.

While I have supported a happy divorce from the UK party for some time, I'm not confident Murdo Fraser is the man to take it forward. The main UK party has supported this idea for years, it's the Scottish wing that has pulled back from it, particularly under Goldie. Lord Forsyth still excerts a strangely large amount of influence over the party which also doesn't help.

As for Unionism, the party can't decide what that actually means with regards devolution. Some still don't back the Scottish Parliament and others (myself included) want devolution max. The party missed the opportunity to push for devolution max and outflank the SNP and the unionist parties some time ago.

What we need is Ruth Davidson; hopefully she is just biding her time.

Ian Paisley's party? Really?

[Insula Dei]

I suppose this new party will put a major emphasis on unionism? Might it end up a Scottish DUP?

The DUP is left wing, so no.

While I have supported a happy divorce from the UK party for some time, I'm not confident Murdo Fraser is the man to take it forward. The main UK party has supported this idea for years, it's the Scottish wing that has pulled back from it, particularly under Goldie. Lord Forsyth still excerts a strangely large amount of influence over the party which also doesn't help.

As for Unionism, the party can't decide what that actually means with regards devolution. Some still don't back the Scottish Parliament and others (myself included) want devolution max. The party missed the opportunity to push for devolution max and outflank the SNP and the unionist parties some time ago.

What we need is Ruth Davidson; hopefully she is just biding her time.

Ian Paisley's party? Really?

'Directed at the Working Class' is, I believe, probably the best description of the DUP's politics. But then, I'm hardly an expert on UK politics, so you may want for the experts to chime in, before you take my words as the undisputable truth.

[doktorb]

I tried to watch Murdo's speech on YouTube the other night. His opening jokes.....bombed, frankly. His approach is interesting - lots of "centre right alternative" and "progressive..."


If it didn't sound so clunky, then "Scottish Progressive and Unionist Party" could just about work. If I was in marketing, I'd go for "Progressive Scotland"....

[afleitch]

I tried to watch Murdo's speech on YouTube the other night. His opening jokes.....bombed, frankly. His approach is interesting - lots of "centre right alternative" and "progressive..."


If it didn't sound so clunky, then "Scottish Progressive and Unionist Party" could just about work. If I was in marketing, I'd go for "Progressive Scotland"....

While we're at it, I wish the SNP would just be known as 'National'; would give us a bit of an Australian flavour

[You kip if you want to...]

If it didn't sound so clunky, then "Scottish Progressive and Unionist Party" could just about work. If I was in marketing, I'd go for "Progressive Scotland"....

Now that would need a divorce from the Tories.