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Author Topic: 1796 election held today?  (Read 2392 times)
#Ready4Nixon
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« on: September 21, 2011, 08:19:53 pm »
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Let's say that the 1796 election is held today with today's map, the candidates having to take stands on today's issues, and let's also add that the VP rules are changed so there are actual running-mates.

Vice-President John Adams (F-MA)/Former Governor Thomas Pinckney (F-SC)

vs.

Former Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson (DR-VA)/Senator Aaron Burr (DR-NY)

Who wins? What does the map look like? I know it's a stretch, transporting people over 200 years forward in time and being judged by today's electorate, but any guesses?
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NHI
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« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2011, 08:32:11 pm »
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Jefferson: 271
Adam: 267
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« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2011, 08:39:16 pm »
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Jefferson loses because he is a deist
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#Ready4Nixon
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« Reply #3 on: September 22, 2011, 07:13:57 pm »
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After a very brief look at both men's Presidencies as well as scanning over Jefferson's religion, here's how I think they might stand on some issues:

Jefferson:
-Supports the War on Terror
-Opposes the Patriot Act
-Believes in separation of Church and State and will articulate this in the campaign
-Believes in government efficiency
-Calls for strict Constitutionality and not too much centralization of power and for the President to truly be checked by Congress
-Believes decisions on social issues should be left to the states
-Campaigns on lower taxes, yet for farm subsidies and agricultural reform
-Is in no way a fan of immigration, opposing guest workers programs and the like, but immigrants end up voting for him, the lesser of tow evils

Adams:
-Opposes the War on Terror and calls instead for diplomacy and greater American security
-Believes in Patriot Act and immigration controls, claiming that the security of the country for whatever price
-While officially Unitarian, does have more support for Christianity than Jefferson who, despite being very interested in morality and religion, loses out to the Religious Right to Adams on the issue who essentially his Christian supporters try to portray him as any other man trying to find the right morality and believing that Christianity was a revelation however its churches did need reform
-Bills himself as maverick, not very supportive of party systems
-Says that he can make the unpopular but right decisions

Going on that, this is what I drew up.

Former Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson (DR-VA)/Senator Aaron Burr DR-NY) 281 electoral votes
Vice-President John Adams (F-MA)/Former Governor Thomas Pinckney (F-SC) 257 electoral votes
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#Ready4Nixon
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« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2011, 10:16:31 pm »
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No other takers? Tongue
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shua
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« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2011, 05:34:57 pm »
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Jefferson wages a libertarian populist pro-farm campaign.
Adams emphasizes urban and industrial renewal.
This map is 274-264 for Jefferson, but that's probably a maximum - Adams might well do much better.
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#Ready4Nixon
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« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2011, 09:12:32 pm »
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Jefferson wages a libertarian populist pro-farm campaign.
Adams emphasizes urban and industrial renewal.
This map is 274-264 for Jefferson, but that's probably a maximum - Adams might well do much better.

Thanks for the reply. The map makes sense, though I'm wondering about Vermont in this, though I suppose it could go to the Populist-Libertarian Jefferson campaign.
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« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2011, 09:51:14 pm »
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Jefferson:
-Supports the War on Terror
for farm subsidies

Adams:
-Believes in Patriot Act

lolno
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WillK
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« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2011, 10:15:37 pm »
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Maybe map would look like 1996 with Clinton states = Adams states.

But if the election were held with todays format -- with primary campaigning like we have been seeing -- then I doubt Jefferson would be the nominee.

Let's say that the 1796 election is held today with today's map, the candidates having to take stands on today's issues, and let's also add that the VP rules are changed so there are actual running-mates.

Vice-President John Adams (F-MA)/Former Governor Thomas Pinckney (F-SC)

vs.

Former Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson (DR-VA)/Senator Aaron Burr (DR-NY)

Who wins? What does the map look like? I know it's a stretch, transporting people over 200 years forward in time and being judged by today's electorate, but any guesses?
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shua
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« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2011, 01:47:26 am »
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Jefferson wages a libertarian populist pro-farm campaign.
Adams emphasizes urban and industrial renewal.
This map is 274-264 for Jefferson, but that's probably a maximum - Adams might well do much better.

Thanks for the reply. The map makes sense, though I'm wondering about Vermont in this, though I suppose it could go to the Populist-Libertarian Jefferson campaign.
At first I was thinking Vermont would go to Adams based on regional affiliation and a more communitarian approach to the economy, but Jefferson's emphasis on small farmers and agrarian over industrial and financial interests would resonate there. 
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asexual trans victimologist
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« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2011, 09:40:10 pm »
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Jefferson wages a libertarian populist pro-farm campaign.
Adams emphasizes urban and industrial renewal.
This map is 274-264 for Jefferson, but that's probably a maximum - Adams might well do much better.

Thanks for the reply. The map makes sense, though I'm wondering about Vermont in this, though I suppose it could go to the Populist-Libertarian Jefferson campaign.
At first I was thinking Vermont would go to Adams based on regional affiliation and a more communitarian approach to the economy, but Jefferson's emphasis on small farmers and agrarian over industrial and financial interests would resonate there. 

On the other hand, I can imagine Jefferson coming across as kind of fake to Vermonters. It seems like his hypocrisy (which is a matter of historical record) would be much more of an issue in today's environment.

Where do we think the candidates stand on social issues?
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A shameless agrarian collectivist with no respect for private property or individual rights.

His idea of freedom is - it is a bad thing and should be stopped at all costs.

Nathan-land.  As much fun as watching paint dry... literally.
#Ready4Nixon
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« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2011, 11:01:06 am »
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Bumping this. On social issues, Adams was the much more religious one & that would probably play a part. Jefferson's lack of a good answer to the question of religion hurts his numbers, but he has a large amount of support from Separation of Church & State types. Modern social issues would be hard to guage with these two, but that's the blue print I would use.
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Antonio V
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« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2011, 11:17:37 am »
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Small guv'men true Murican Jefferson would destroy Massachussets elitiszt evul federalist Adams.
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Quote from: IRC
22:15   ComradeSibboleth   this is all extremely terrible and in all respects absolutely fycking dire.

It really is.



"A reformist is someone who realizes that, when you bang your head on a wall, it's the head that breaks rather than the wall."

Peppino, from the movie Baaria
Jerseyrules
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« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2012, 02:37:11 am »
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Drink Too Much:
http://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=147022.0

An Empire of Stars and Stripes:

http://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=156974.0

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FOOL!  I AM Cathcon!

Endorsements:
President: Hillary Clinton
Governor: Brown (CA), Corbett (PA), Scott (FL)
House: Emken (CA)
Other: Rob McCoy (CA Assembly)

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jfern
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« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2012, 02:53:37 am »
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Jefferson comes out as solidly anti-TARP. saying "I bought a dozen states for only a 100,000th of that cost". Jefferson rails against Wall Street. Adams says we should let people who know best make the decisions. Despite massive attacks on his religion, Jefferson manages to win by a decent margin.
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