Israel general discussion

[ag]

You would be paying for ending Israeli occupation, not for prolonging it. Extra half a million Palestinians in the West Bank makes it so much less likely for Israel to keep the land.

[DavidB.]

... which is exactly why Israel is right in not accepting these Syrians from entering Eretz Yisrael.

[ingemann]

You would be paying for ending Israeli occupation, not for prolonging it. Extra half a million Palestinians in the West Bank makes it so much less likely for Israel to keep the land.

That was how they suckered us into funding their Bantustans the last time, and now the peace process (no matter how much of a zombie it is by now) and the Palestinians are kept as hostages to keep us funding them.

[Hnv1]

Holdai (Tel Aviv mayor) is warming up on the sideline, earlier this week he sent a letter to Labour members and Herzog urging him to hold the leadership elections soon. Amir Peretz returned (Again) to Labour while rumours are he's planning to return to his old seat as head of the Histadrut. Most of the "PLP" is pro-Herzog even the former Yechimovic majordomo Michal Biran is supporting him. Unless Ashkenazi runs I can't see any of the current pretenders beating him.

Their party convention is happening next week and I smell there will be more to it than electing a new head to the JNF

[Famous Mortimer]

Is Yachimovich looking unlikely to run herself?

[Hnv1]

Is Yachimovich looking unlikely to run herself?

Ambiguous about her intentions, but I think she's will be dumb to do so

[Hnv1]

So a small scale intifida is rolling since last week with the focal point of tension being as always around the Old Town of Jerusalem. riots spread across the west bank and even in some Israeli-Arab settlements. Government moves so far: increased use of house demolition and administrative arrests; limiting Muslim access to the temple mount; banning Israeli politicians from entering the mount complex. I'll reserve my judgement on the situation for now.

Politically: Bibi has been attracting fire from the right with members of his cabinet taking part in anti-government protests (I know absurd) demanding firm hand. Abbas speech at the UN is raising concerns among the security establishment regarding the future coordination with the PA (and its very existence); Herzog is proving yet again that he is no PM material.

All things considered I see a very "warm" summer starting next may (no one likes winter wars and conflicts in the ME)

[Comrade Funk]

Anyone going to challenge Herzog. He can't win imo.

[danny]

Anyone going to challenge Herzog. He can't win imo.

This is the Labour party, of course he will be challenged. Huldai seems almost certain, but there may be others.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

All things considered I see a very "warm" summer starting next may (no one likes winter wars and conflicts in the ME)

They might not like them but there's no evidence that anyone tries to avoid them.  If anything, it seems to be the reverse.

[danny]

We have a change in the Knesset, Daniel Atar was chosen as the next head of the Jewish National Fund, and will be replaced by Yael Cohen Paran.

 Yael comes originally from the Green Movement, which unsuccessfully ran on its own in 2009, in 2013 it ran with Livni's Hatnuah with a representative of the party placed at number 13 (Hatnuah ended up with just 6 seats). In 2015 Yael was the representative of The Green Movement in Livnis party, which then merged with Labour to form the Zionist Union. Yael was placed at number 25 but the Zionist Union only got 24 seats, so she was left out until now.

Yael will presumably focus on environmental issues as that has always been what she dealt with so far. She was at one point the leader of the anti road 6 movement (which thankfully lost, road 6 is great).

[Hnv1]

We have a change in the Knesset, Daniel Atar was chosen as the next head of the Jewish National Fund, and will be replaced by Yael Cohen Paran.

 Yael comes originally from the Green Movement, which unsuccessfully ran on its own in 2009, in 2013 it ran with Livni's Hatnuah with a representative of the party placed at number 13 (Hatnuah ended up with just 6 seats). In 2015 Yael was the representative of The Green Movement in Livnis party, which then merged with Labour to form the Zionist Union. Yael was placed at number 25 but the Zionist Union only got 24 seats, so she was left out until now.

Yael will presumably focus on environmental issues as that has always been what she dealt with so far. She was at one point the leader of the anti road 6 movement (which thankfully lost, road 6 is great).

1. Kakal is not identical with the JNF, it's two separate legal bodies with affinity (a bit of an elaborate legal construction) so chairman of Israel-based JNF is better suited.
2. Good and bad. Good: Atar is a out of the Knesset, he's a little corrupt politico of local government from the right section of Labour. Bad: Atar will maintain the JNF's corruption and misconduct (he won Biton, a reformer)
3. Yael, despite her opposition to highway 6, will be an excellent addition to the house

Part for Livni and Hasson the rest of the lot are natural for Labour and even Meretz. Peretz left back for Labour and rumours he might try to regain leadership

[Green Line]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

There was also a stabbing in Crown Heights of a Jewish man last night, and another Jewish man was assaulted nearby the same night. There was briefly a thread on it last night, but it deteriorated with incredible speed and was deleted.

No certainty as to connections there, but an ugly picture of the world right now when it comes to Jewish safety is certainly emerging.

[Famous Mortimer]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

I know anti-Semites are stupid but hating Jews and moving to Israel is pretty stupid even for a racist.

[danny]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

I know anti-Semites are stupid but hating Jews and moving to Israel is pretty stupid even for a racist.

I'm not sure what this response has to do with story, the attacker was Sudanese and the flight was between Chad and Ethiopia.

[Famous Mortimer]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

I know anti-Semites are stupid but hating Jews and moving to Israel is pretty stupid even for a racist.

I'm not sure what this response has to do with story, the attacker was Sudanese and the flight was between Chad and Ethiopia.

Oh, my bad. I thought it happened in Israel. Now it makes a bit more sense.

[Green Line]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

I know anti-Semites are stupid but hating Jews and moving to Israel is pretty stupid even for a racist.

I'm not sure what this response has to do with story, the attacker was Sudanese and the flight was between Chad and Ethiopia.

Oh, my bad. I thought it happened in Israel. Now it makes a bit more sense.

I just didnt feel like this warranted its own thread

[dead0man]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

I know anti-Semites are stupid but hating Jews and moving to Israel is pretty stupid even for a racist.

I'm not sure what this response has to do with story, the attacker was Sudanese and the flight was between Chad and Ethiopia.

Oh, my bad. I thought it happened in Israel. Now it makes a bit more sense.

Jews getting attacked in Israel by Muslims isn't newsworthy enough to post about because it happens several times a day.  Hell, even the leader of the Palestinians lying about sh**t and telling his people to do it more because of those lies isn't as thread worthy as Bibi saying something stupid about Hitler.  At least around here.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/sudanese-attacks-israeli-on-ethiopian-airlines-flight/

An Israeli citizen was attacked by a Sudanese Muslim on a flight after he learned the man was Jewish.  There doesn't seem to be much outrage or concern from the world at these attacks.  I can only imagine what the reaction would be if the roles were reversed.

I know anti-Semites are stupid but hating Jews and moving to Israel is pretty stupid even for a racist.

I'm not sure what this response has to do with story, the attacker was Sudanese and the flight was between Chad and Ethiopia.

Oh, my bad. I thought it happened in Israel. Now it makes a bit more sense.

Jews getting attacked in Israel by Muslims isn't newsworthy enough to post about because it happens several times a day.  Hell, even the leader of the Palestinians lying about sh**t and telling his people to do it more because of those lies isn't as thread worthy as Bibi saying something stupid about Hitler.  At least around here.

Because Israel holds itself out as not merely a Western-style liberal democracy, but the only real example of that in the Middle East, it's not surprising that it gets held to a higher standard. It's not right, as that standard should be more broadly applied, but it's not surprising.

[Hnv1]

Former president Isaac Navon passed away (93) this morning. he was a very popular president and he manged to force Begin's government to create a special inquiry committee to the Sabre and Shatilla events. In 84 he returned to politics and there was talks of him running against Peres (and as a popular unifying figure breaking the Likud-Labour deadlock of the 80s) but in a rare cooperation of Peres and Rabin he was hushed aside. Remained a lifelong Labour supporter and placed 120 in the last elections.

One of the few almost-best PMs in the what-if scenarios.

[DavidB.]

Poll questions on some issues, by Panels/Knesset Channel. Left less interesting ones out.

What grade do you give Deputy Foreign Minister Tzipi Hotovely (Likud)?
39% Good, 26% Bad, 23% Average

Should Yisrael Beiteinu join the government?
45% Yes, 41% No
Yisrael Beitenu voters: 55% Yes, 45% No

Do you support the EU decision to label settlement products?
78% No, 18% Yes

Will labeling settlement products harm the Israeli economy?
66% Yes, 27% No

Will labeling settlement products harm the Palestinian economy?
59% Yes, 28% No

Why is the EU labeling settlement products?
32% Opposition to Israeli policy in Judea and Samaria, 31% Anti-Semitism, 28% Hostility to Israel, 6% Advance a diplomatic process
(Not sure why it can't be a combination of (some of) these things, because I'd say the decision is fuelled by all four, but yeah... Israeli logic)

How do you define Israeli society?
54% Secular with an inclination towards traditional, 30% Traditional, 5% Moderately religious, 3% Secular, 2% Extremely religious
Note: "traditional" is the term Israelis use for everything that falls between the secular category and the religious category.

How do you define the Israeli state?
51% Secular with an inclination towards traditional, 26% Traditional, 5% Secular

Do you aspire that the Israeli state will become a Halacha State (i.e. a theocracy with laws directly derived from Jewish law, DavidB.)?
71% No, 26% Yes

Do you support ministers making decisions according to Jewish Halacha?
74% No, 23% Yes

Do you support MKs using Halacha as a source for legislation?
50% No, 41% Yes

Will diplomatic efforts of John Kerry & United Nations calm security situation in Israel?
77% No, 4% Yes

Are you pleased with Netanyahu’s conduct during latest terror wave?
72% Not Pleased, 27% Pleased

Who would you like to see in charge of Israel’s security issues?
22% Lieberman (Yisrael Beiteinu), 18% Bennett (Bayit Yehudi), 12% Netanyahu (Likud), 11% Ya'alon (Likud), 6% Lapid (Yesh Atid), 1% Herzog (ZU), 21% None of above

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Ouch that last number is a stinger for Herzog.

[Famous Mortimer]

Looks like Liberman is still pretty popular. Staying out of government was a good strategy? What is YB polling right now?

[Hnv1]

Looks like Liberman is still pretty popular. Staying out of government was a good strategy? What is YB polling right now?

he's as popular as security tension lasts and that's with people who won't vote for him come election day.

A poll last week on PM preferences one on one with BB had LTG Gantz the only one beating him and carry votes from the right 44% to BB 32%
BB beat the rest
Herzog 28% BB 51%
Lapid 32% BB 46% (I would actually rather have BB than that dimwit)
Ashkenazi 29% BB 41%
Diskin 30% BB 39% (my personal favorite of the bunch)

Alas, Gantz can't compete till 2018 but I fully expect Labour politicos to dethrone Herzog soon